Cottonmouth bite

[Wineoceros]

Has anyone here ever been bitten...or know anyone who has been bitten...by a large cottonmouth?

My son and I were hunting hogs in a boggy E. TX spot this past Sunday and were walking along the top a small river bank, with him trailing me by about 8 - 10 yds., when I hear him suddenly call out "Snake!" I stopped and wheeled around to see him staring at the ground at a spot I'd just crossed about 10 feet back, and where I'd stepped over a small group of 1.5"-2" broken tree branches that were lying in a pile more-or-less parallel to one another. On closer inspection I saw that one of the branches had a head, and was flicking a tongue in and out of it quite rapidly. The "branch" was, of course, a ~5 ft. cottonmouth that was lying alongside the real real branches with its body nearly perfectly straight. It so closely resembled the other branches that I had stepped right over it while looking right at it and never saw it for what it was.

After instructing my son to just give the snake a wide berth and walk well around it we went on our way and the serpent went on his/hers. Later on we began to talk about how fortunate it was that...

1) I was at least watching the ground enough that I stepped over the branches and the snake rather than on it, since the latter would have been my best chance for being envenomated by a rather pissed off reptile.

2) The snake didn't react to my actions by biting me as I passed over it anyway.

3) My son was paying close enough attention to spot the snake after I stepped over it, saving himself from the same two risks above.

So, as to my original question...has anyone here had the misfortune of having been bitten by one of these animals, and particularly one so large? I'm just curious to know what it is that I was lucky enough to have missed out on.

Oh, and since our current hunting boots are approaching the end of their useful lives anyway I think I've now got myself talked into splurging on two good pairs of high-rise snake boots for next season

 

[saddlebum]

not a cotton mouth, but i was bitten by a copper head. same family . trust me not fun at all.

one thing that i learned is a young snake is more likely to give you a large dose of venom than an adult snake.so a big snake might be better than a small snake if you could pick which one to get bitten by.

 

[xring44]

I live in a semi rural area, 4 miles out of a town of 2500 people. My next door neighbors were walking just back of my house along a slough, she was bitten on the lower calf of her leg by a BIG cottonmouth. They did the worse possible thing in running to my house, only a 100 yards or so. They wanted me to cut it, I advised that they were within 5 minutes of the hospital, that would be the best course of action. He pointed vaguely in the direction of the site, said they were on this side of the slough. I went down and found the snake, killed it and brought it to the hospital for positive identification, (in order to administer anti-venom) I knew it was a cottonmouth, but they called a herpatoligist, spelling, before they would administer the anti-venom. Her leg swelled so large that they split the skin to keep it from bursting. She bears scars and will forever, from that one misplaced step.
Be careful out there, them danged cottonmouths are dangerous.

 

[electric wombat]

I have not been bitten by one yet but Agkistrodon piciverous (cottonmouth) is one of the species I have studied. In general terms it's the young ones you really have to keep an eye on. They seem to be more agressive and being young tend to not conserve their venom. young ones will inject more venom when striking with a defensive bite than the older ones. On top of that their venom is a bit more concentrated therefore more potent than adults. The venom of A. picivorous is a hemotoxin which mean it attacks the red blood cells & tissues by breaking down their cellular structure. It also inhibits clotting, causes inflmation & can affect organ function. If bitten the venom will first start to destroy the tissue surrounding the bite as it works it's way through your body. Also you will experience large amounts of swelling to the point where the skin will be split open (or have to be cut open) to relieve the pressure caused by the swelling. probably not the most plesant experience. Most cottonmout bites will not be life threatning as long as you seek immediate medical attention & have the antivenon (antivenon is the proper termonology, not antivenom) administered to you in a timely fashon. You'll definately experience a good bit of pain but at least you won't be dead.

You & your son did the best thing, just leave it alone. Snakes are not going to strike unless they feel threatened. They will give you a warning before they strike. Body posture, breathing movements, all things to look at. In the case of A. piciverous of course it will open it's mouth wide (gaping) and rattle its tail in the leaf litter as a warning. It will also take the what i call S curve posture where it's head & roughly first 1/4 of its body will curl up into an S shape. As you can tell I've been bitten at a pretty good bit but that's because when I come across one I piss it off by catching it & taking measurements & whatnot. I know what I'm doing & am a trained wildlife biologist but I still have to be really careful when handeling any venomous snake. Hopefully I can go my entire career without being invenomated. For the "common" person best advise, leave it alone & it will leave you alone.

 

[Darthbauer]

If you think snakes are bad, stay clear of big lizards. A friend had one and it bit him in the hand. His father and I were in the garage and he came walking in with the thing hanging off his hand dripping blood. We had to pri the thing off with a hammer.


Snakes have venom, but atleast most of them let go.

 

[saddlebum]

in my case the hospital also called a herpatologist from the tulsa zoo to identify the snake by then 1.5 hours had passed. he told the DR. i was as sick as i was gonna get and not to give me the antivenon.

 

[bowl443]

I'm also from boggy E texas... went to school with a girl who got bit in her backyard at night. She was three days in the hospital. You were lucky. You have to always be on the lookout down here.

 

[dogrunner]

Fella that hunted on a lease I was involved in years ago was bitten thru a rubber boot and suffered severe damage. Crippled him up so badly that he failed to finish out the season that year and when I saw him the following he showed me his foot which was withered and obviously had been severely damaged.

As he told the story he was wading thru a swamp to a pine island where he had a tree stand when he was apparently struck. He didn't realise what'd occured and actually got into that stand when his foot began to throb and swell. He said he pulled off the boot and that's when he noticed the punctures. Walked out and drove himself to a medical facility.

I've gotten soft in my older years about killing but I WILL go out of my way to pop any moccasin I see. They are agressive as hell and I have SEEN a small one actually chase a fellow that tried to stomp it!!! They also have a bad tendency to "stand their ground" and just throw their heads up and dare you come on....I do, after a charge of shot has eliminated the problem.

Made a bad mistake when bowhunting some years ago....stuck a big one into the mud and had to hike a long way back to the truck to get my machete to retrieve my arrow.

Funniest thing I've ever seen with the things was a black guy that was trying to kill one with a .22 pistol on our property that bounds a river. I'd heard him shooting and went to see what was going on...when I got there he was standing in an aluminum jon-boat, trying to hold steady with a paddle on the bottom and popping rounds onto a tiny cypress island....I couldn't see what he was shooting at and asked what was going on....he managed to kill the snake at about that time and was trying to load it into the boat all the while stating, and this is a direct quote: "Mr. if you think only Jesus Christ walked on water if this mother****er come alive you 'bout see it again"......I'd walked way over a hundred yards thru a swampy area to get to him and on the way back I was SURE careful, looking for snakes everywhere.........That thing was probably well over 5 inches in diameter and nearly four feet long! Had a head on it bigger'n my fist. Damned sure a put you in the hospital type snake.

Said he just had to show the thing to his buddies.....

 

[Wineoceros]

It sounds like we did indeed dodge a venomous bullet there. I've encountered cottonmouths (and many other types of snakes) in the wild before, but just never in a manner that held so much potential for disaster. We were over a mile away from my vehicle and there is no way I could have made it back without a great deal of physical exertion.

Thanks to all for the informative feedback.

 

[Bailey Boat]

For those of you in snake country like I am, go to Wally World in the camping section and buy SEVERAL "Sawyer Extractors". They come in a yellow plastic box about twice the size of a pack of smokes and WILL save you a LOT of pain and suffering if/when you're bitten. They work on suction and don't require cutting the bite site. Their only about 10-12 bucks so you won't need a second mortgage.................. Don't leave home without it!!!!!!!

 

[WayneConrad]

I hike and hunt in the desert Southwest, home to some very venomous pit vipers. It seemed like a good idea to know how to treat snakebite. My research shows that the Sawyer kit is no longer recommended.

Please see Treating and Preventing Venomous Bites (FDA):

Though US medical professionals may not agree on every aspect of what to do for snakebite first aid, they are nearly unanimous in their views of what not to do. Among their recommendations:

* No ice or any other type of cooling on the bite. Research has shown this to be potentially harmful.
* No tourniquets. This cuts blood flow completely and may result in loss of the affected limb.
* No electric shock. This method is under study and has yet to be proven effective. It could harm the victim.
* No incisions in the wound. Such measures have not been proven useful and may cause further injury.

More discussion on snakebite treatment here (equipped.org).

 

[MCgunner]

I've known people bitten by rattlers and I had a dog killed by one. I saved a cat to the tune of 200 bucks at the vet. Was an aweful wound, maggots growing in the dead flesh. Yich.

I have a pair of snake boots I just got this Christmas. I have zip on snake leggings, too, that I've been using for quite a while. Better to wear the gear than not where my place is. It's coming up on spring and the snakes will be out. Hard to spot 'em in the heavy grass, too.

 

[stiab]

Has anyone here ever been bitten...or know anyone who has been bitten...by a large cottonmouth?

Yes, sort of, a cottonmouth bit the left hind foot of my 80 lb. yellow lab Cricket several years ago. Her leg swelled to the point that the lower portion was as big as a grapefruit and the skin split. I took her to the vet, but don't recall the treatment.

By the way, having worked and lived in the Great Dismal Swamp for several years, I have seen hundreds of cottonmouths, including some that were very big, but never one 5 feet long. A cottonmouth's size comes from its girth, not its length. If the snake was really that long it might have been a different type.

 

[paintballdude902]

im thinking it was a copper head if it matched the branches (not saying it wasnt just my .02)

out at the barn we had a stray hunting dog get bitten by a copperhead

the vet told us that she wasnt gonna get any worse and she was fine about a week later

cant say the same thing about the snake.....our barn hand red blew it inhalf with a 20ga

 

[MCgunner]

Well, I've never seen a copper head much over a foot and a half. LOL Now, there is a genus of water snakes, Natrix (google it), that are very agressive, will faux attack threats, even strike, but are non-venomous. Many folks think they're cotton mouths. They'll often be splotchy looking with various dull yellow patches and they get pretty big both in girth and length. There are quite a few species of genus Natrix and they are quite common in the woods of east Texas after a good rain. I've seen small lakes absolutely infested with 'em and the woods full of 'em mating in the spring after a downpour. Lookd for the pits near the eyes and plain dull brown/grey coloration, but take no chances. Walk around it.

One warm duck season, myself and a friend were out duck hunting. We stopped at a pothole after the morning hunt to check it out. We were walking a trail, he in front of me. I saw a coiled moccasin in the trail, grabbed him by the shoulder and yanked him back just as he was about to step on the snake. I told him the snake was there and he STILL didn't see it until I shot the head off the thing. He'd not taken his shotgun as this was to scout the pothole and we'd shot a limit, but something told me to just take it along. We could have side stepped the snake, but I didn't wanna encounter it again on the way out. That time of year, you don't really think to wear the snake leggings and we had our waders on. It pays to be vigilant in snake country.

After I decapitated the snake, we checked out the head. That thing had some major hypo needles, looked a couple inches long. We were a ways from the boat ramp and hospital, but I reckon he'd have survived. It would not have been a pleasant experience, though.

 

[Wineoceros]

I found several photographs and descriptions of the various species of the genus Natrix (most of which are native to Europe) and they're not even remotely similar in appearance to the snake we encountered, which was a dead-ringer for the photos of cottonmouths that I've found, not only in color but in general body shape, lacking the more gradual tapering of the tail possessed by the local Natrix species (Natrix sipedon).

Copperheads are even more dissimilar in appearance.

 

[retrieverman]

Though US medical professionals may not agree on every aspect of what to do for snakebite first aid, they are nearly unanimous in their views of what not to do. Among their recommendations:

* No ice or any other type of cooling on the bite. Research has shown this to be potentially harmful.
* No tourniquets. This cuts blood flow completely and may result in loss of the affected limb.
* No electric shock. This method is under study and has yet to be proven effective. It could harm the victim.
* No incisions in the wound. Such measures have not been proven useful and may cause further injury.

This is basically what the vets told us when my Dad's Brittany Spaniel got bit my a Cottonmouth last summer. It was a very large snake, and my Dad really didn't have much hope for his dog. His vet really didn't know much about snake bites and didn't offer much hope, but the vet that I use and is a good friend was much more optimistic and was right. To say the least though, he was one sick puppy for about 2 weeks, but he made a full recovery and hunted about 35 days during bird season.
Here are some pictures of the wound.

 

[Wineoceros]

Ouch! That's nasty looking. I'm sorry your dad's pooch had to go through that, but glad that he made it.

 

[K3]

I have run over several snakes while mountain biking. Well, 3, but that's several to me. I ride in the late afternoon, just when snakes like to stretch out and catch a little sun.

The first one was a copperhead. I think my butthole puckered up and sucked in the seat of my bike. I've heard from 'experts' that there are no Copperheads in the Lubbock area. Researched a little... It was a Trans-Pecos Copperhead, which most certainly is in the area. About 2-1/2 feet long.

The second snake was a hognose. The third was some sort of rat snake or something. I was riding pretty fast over that one.

The other snake I had an encounter with was a decent sized Western Diamondback. Prolly 3-1/2 feet, but he was coiled, so I couldn't be sure. I was riding though some switchbacks, and I passed what looked like a snake in the brush just off the trail. Stopped and got off the bike. Walked back slowly and sure enough, there he was. He was coiled up and looking right at me. I didn't get closer than 10 feet, and I headed back to my bike rapidly. I'm not sure why I had to go back and look at the snake. Curiosity I guess. It's been known to be harmful to cats....

 

[electric wombat]

To Mcgunner & Wineoceros. The one your thinking of that mimics the coloration of cottonmouths is Nerodia fasciata. This is the one most people get confused with the cottonmouth. Here's some pics. The first two are of N. fasciata (broadbanded watersnake) The first one is a juvenile & the second an adult. The last pic is of an adult A. piscivorous (cottonmouth). There's an obvious difference to those of us who know about snakes but you can see the similarities in coloration & how some may get the two species confused.

 

[Wineoceros]

I can certainly see how the adult N. fasciata could easily be mistaken for a cottonmouth, especially in the heat of the moment. In fact it's pretty close in appearance to the snake we encountered. The only things that make me continue to favor my original identification are its size (cottonmouths average a somewhat larger size than N. fasciata) and the far more abrupt tapering of the body diameter near the tail.

But I'm not a herpetologist, and certainly could have been wrong.

 

[MCgunner]

Well, there is NO shortage of cottonmouth in East Texas! I'd say that's probably what it was. Be kinda stupid to step on it and find out, I reckon. I've never been so scared as when a hog nose ran from a brush pile I was cleaning up when I was a kid, LOL! Boy, it was evil lookin', right out of Conan the Barbarian. I went and looked it up later, after I'd cleaned up in the bathroom.

A viper will kill a dog faster than a cat. You shoulda seen my poor cat, muscle mass eaten up, magots crawling around in the wound. I took her straight to the vet and after several months of TLC, she healed. My Beagle got off his leash and went and got bit behind the house (woods). He came home whimpering. I couldn't figure out what was wrong with him, no visible signs of the bite yet. Before I could get him to the vet, he died. It was in the hind leg muscle, cause he'd yelp when I'd touch it. Snake bites a dog in a good fleshy spot, just go ahead and dig a hole for him.

 

[MCgunner]

I've probably seen Nerodia fasciata and thought it was just another species of Natrix. But, heck, I was a fisheries management major. I didn't take herp, wasn't forced to.

 

[electric wombat]

But I'm not a herpetologist, and certainly could have been wrong.

I wasn't doubting that you came across a cottonmouth, lord knows they're all over the south east US. In the Louisiana swamps, where i'm from you get tired of seeing them. From the description it sounds like it was definately a cottonmouth.

I've probably seen Nerodia fasciata and thought it was just another species of Natrix.

the genus Natrix is usually applied to the european water snakes but there are a few in the US.

But, heck, I was a fisheries management major. I didn't take herp, wasn't forced to.

I geared all my studies to wildlife biology so I got everything from snakes to fish to birds to mammals. I focused more on herps since those are my fav. Alot of good all my wildlife knowledge is doing me now. I'm stuck in an office job for the Louisiana Department of Enviro Quality. At least I have a few of my side projects that get me out into the field.

 

[Patrick_Henry]

Sawyer Kit IS Still Recommended.

Upon close inspection of the FDA article posted:

A suction device may be placed over the bite to help draw venom out of the wound without making cuts. Suction instruments often are included in commercial snakebite kits.

This is the roll of the Sawyer Kit. The Sawyer kit is also recommended in the Merck Manual as well as a few other reputable sources. I think it is safe to say that these are here to stay at least for a while. And as previously mentioned they are quite cheap and no real problem to have around. What is definitely not recommended is cutting the wound or making a tourniquets. Instead the "new" concept is what is called limb immobilization. This basically means you put the wound in a sling very much like you would after a broken bone and make sure it cannot be moved, then seek medical attention ASAP.

Just thought I'd clarify that one.