Cultural shifts relating to firearms

[DustyGmt]

I was just looking over the "Do you remember when firearms were proudly displayed?" thread and it got me thinking about the cultural shift concerning how firearms are viewed in society now. I know it didn't happen over night and there has been a slow but unrelenting campaign against firearms and by extension firearm owners for decades. I'm just aghast at how bad it is now, considering we are a country with a long history of being a gun and freedom loving country with 70,000,000+ firearms in circulation with the population, more and counting with the recent surge in gun sales.

I just find it odd that in certain scenarios it seems like it's almost in poor taste to even mention firearms. My daughter had a 6th grade school project last year and the students were supposed to pick a political issue and make their case for or against and my daughter (unprompted by me) chose to make a case for the right of the people to own Semi Auto firearms and "high capacity magazines", etc... and all the students were tasked with getting up and reading their piece in front of the class and present their argument, etc and my daughter was the only one who had her viewpoint and position challenged by the teacher. Mind you none of the other students had this pressure component.

I'm proud of her though because she typically shy's away from controversial topics and avoids the heat and I didn't even know she was working on this project until she was almost finished with it and came in to ask me ne question and I looked over her work and was very impressed with what she had put together and helped her a lil toward the finish and she was very articulate and raised very good points. If anybody is interested in seeing what this 12 year old did let me know I'll see if I can dig it out but anyway....

I'm glad to see so many new folks getting into guns and maybe there will be a shift in how people view ownership and might not be so Gung Ho for restrictions and bans, etc. Just the other day I was looking for a recoil pad on Amazon and they had the image of the gun, a bolt action rifle btw, blurred and fuzzed out like it was a dirty image. I thought perhaps it was just to accentuate the recoil pad but I searched for other firearm related items and the images of the actual gun itself was fuzzed out. Smh. How the xxxx did we get there ?

Is it only a matter of time before you can't even view a YouTube video involving firearms or even having the topic banned? Just kind of going in circles on this, not a terribly focused thread. Just saying. Thoughts?

 

[AlexanderA]

The main reason, I think, that many gun owners are loath to show off their guns is simply security. With crime being the way it is, they don't want their guns to get stolen.

The other reason is that you don't know what the other person's sensitivities are. For all you know, the person, or a member of their family, may have been a victim of gun misuse. So until you know this person better, it might be wise to clam up about owning guns.

 

[trackskippy]

Seems to be headed that way, but in some respects, it has been since the early 80's or so, and a lot seems to depend on where you are, and who youre talking to.

If you think firearms, in general, are a problem, you should see what it can be like in the NFA community. Aintigunners arent the only ones who seem to have a problem with you, although it was always entertaining when the anti-gunners (read that teachers ) found out when they asked the kids what you did over the weekend, summer, etc, and my kids told them they were shooting machineguns. I wish Id recorded the phone calls I got.

I got a lot of flack from the trap shooters and hunters at a couple of "sportsmans" clubs I belonged too as well, and I dont doubt for a minute if things went south, and they thought that by giving you up would save them from losing their stuff, they'd do it in a heart beat. Ive had a couple tell me exactly that too.

A lot of those same people didnt like things like AR's, or people wanting to shoot things like that, or handguns a little more realistically, that slow fire on a bullseye target.

I actually think what went on the past couple of years was a good thing for the gun community, with so many people buying guns, that in the past probably wouldnt have. In some respects, I think a lot of people learned a lot about exercising "their rights", and are more in tune with that now. Thats not a bad thing.

 

[mstreddy]

Dusty,
Good job with your daughter. That she chose the topic on her own speaks volumes and show she "gets it".

On your statement on the 70 Million firearms -- it's probably closer to 500-600 million. The 300 million number was bandied about for years, not taking into account all of the various increases during the past few panic buying sprees.
What I've heard closer to 70 million, may be firearm owners.

My son is in 6th grade and my daughter in 4th. She was learning about the constitution and we discussed the importance of the 2nd and the Bill of Rights.

 

[Ignition Override]

Had it not been for school shootings in recent decades, maybe the subject would have been more tolerated in a class room.

As for Youtube, it will surprise me if the Youtube Politburo (I almost said the K** ) doesn't block a serious fraction of gun videos within a few years.

trackskippy:
The FUDDS should learn to hunt with a bow and arrow or a spear, and be allowed only one arrow or spear when they hunt.
And they should be required to pay for, and attend classes on bow and arrow "theory", before being allowed near a bow and arrow, as prospective gun owners must do in Germany. And the FUDDs should not protest about it.
After all, they should blindly submit to any govt. regulations/laws.

* Weeks or days ago there was a multiple murder somewhere in Europe or Russia where a single bolt action rifle was used.

 

[hq]

"We" didn't. Just people who generally aren't into guns or have much interested in learning the facts about them built IT-related media empires. Amazon and Alphabet are just the tip of the iceberg and their popularity has magnified the echo chamber to incredible proportions. That's where certain politicians have found common ground and a way to perpetuate their opinions.

I know. I'm a hard-boiled, bona fide geek, with an extensive background in telecommunications. I've just been into guns (as well as mechanics and anything motorized) just as much as I've been into electronics, computers and communications. I've been a COMPLETE anomaly in these circles, with few peers.

Much like you rarely got to read any articles about guns in non-specialized publications of yore and when you did, their point of view and idea of facts were nothing short of ridiculous. That world has just expanded into an Internet realm.

There are lots of special interest sites and online publications about guns, of course. Just don't expect anyone else to have an objective or informed perspective in the subject.

 

[dirtman]

Good for your daughter..... not so good for her teacher.... This teacher wants to challenge a fondamental right of our Republic.... and push his idological believes on your daughter..... Really glad to see a youngster promoting gun rights

 

[1942bull]

I do not think that the majority of the general public has great disdain for guns. I have neighbors who know I carry a gun. They do not care. They ask me questions about gun ownership. I gladly answer them. Yet there is a minority of the general public who think guns are the problem when it comes to crime and violence. I know some of them too. I try to adjust there thinking. Sometime it works, but mostly it does not. I think that is because they have no facts to rely upon, and they make no effort to get the facts. Here is an example. I was engaged by an assault rifle ban supporter. When I asked him why he wanted a ban his answer was because they are used to kill so many people. So i took out my smartphone and opened it to 2019 FBI statistics. Here is what I showed him.

In 2019 violent deaths on the USA are reported as follows:
By firearms: 10,258
by handguns: 6,368
by rifles: 364
by shotguns; 200
By knives: 1,476
By blunt object: 397
By body force: 600

I pointed out that not all of the 364 rifle deaths were by assault rifles only. I also pointed out that more people are killed by each of knives, blunt objects, and body force. (beaten to death with hands, feet, etc) than are killed by rifles. So what not ban all those causes? After all the discussion he still wanted to ban assault rifles. Go figure.

 

[dirtman]

lets not forget that the Johns Hopkins study 2016 estmated 250,000. deaths per year by medical errors....... and we are worried about guns.???

 

[ColoradoMinuteMan]

My observation is that, in general, there has been a compartmentalization/segmentation of culture across the board. Once upon a time, while many many proudly continued the traditions of their religious, national, or regional heritage, there was a proud American culture that was clear and distinct. That clear and distinct national culture brought us together and made us tolerant and even appreciative of the differences in our individual believes and interests.

The loss of that broad cultural fabric in much of America has fragmented us into many subcultures that now identify us. You can no longer be gun neutral or simply appreciative of guns as part of our heritage even if you don't have a passion for them. Today you must be polarized into your sub culture of pro-gun or anti-gun or extremists on either side will declare you an enemy. This polarization makes it very difficult to simply show your true colors around those you don't know well as it might have a REAL impact on you. You might get your property vandalized, loose your job, loose your friend as the result of polarizing differences.

You see this even on this or other sites where someone who buys from a company who once upon a time had a leader who, in their mind, wasn't fully committed to the Second Amendment.

 

[reddog81]

I'd be interested in seeing what she had to say if you find it.

It would be interesting to see the perspective of someone that young and how they view guns. I have a feeling the censorship and blurred out images will only increase over time. The media knows they can milk any "gun death" for views and those eyeballs mean more ad revenue. The more sinister they can make firearms, the more sensational they can make a story. It seems like this will continue to get worse for the foreseeable future.

Another thing I find interesting is that for all the focus on firearms in the media is that you can usually tell that the actual facts are of little relevance. I have seen many experts on TV mention that Alec Baldwin should have opened the cylinder and verified the ammo was blanks before practicing. I saw an expert on CNN showing how the revolver would have worked and stated that the revolver has 6 cylinders. The revolver being shown was a double action Smith & Wesson. The revolvers on set were single action guns where you can't flip open the cylinder and see what type of ammo is in the gun and it certainly did not have 6 cylinders. However you could view just through the cylinder and frame to see if any brass is in the gun but nobody ever mentions that. For practicing draws you wouldn't want any ammo or blanks in the gun. These are glaring mistakes if someone actually knows anything about firearms.

 

[AK Hunter]

Also note that over 60% of the firearm deaths are suicides.

 

[Reloadron]

all the students were tasked with getting up and reading their piece in front of the class and present their argument, etc and my daughter was the only one who had her viewpoint and position challenged by the teacher. Mind you none of the other students had this pressure component.

We have seen this not with our daughter but our granddaughter and it wasn't guns. Granddaughter is a bright kid. She is a HS senior this year and more than once if her views on an assignment disagreed with a teacher she heard about it. Thinking her last was the subject of Capital Punishment. Alexis favored capital punishment and made her point clear and concise with her point well backed up. Her view obviously was not inline with the teacher wanted to hear. Consider this, most teachers from grade to high school and beyond are very liberal. The idea being a teacher should teach and not push their views on their students.

It's not just guns and it extends well beyond guns. Take a look at many of the college level courses taught today. It's not about learning and borders on brainwashing. How dare a student have an opposing view.

Ron

 

[CherokeeGunslinger]

If anybody is interested in seeing what this 12 year old did let me know I'll see if I can dig it out but anyway....

You should know that we're all interested in seeing the glorious work your daughter did. You shouldn't have to ask

I just find it odd that in certain scenarios it seems like it's almost in poor taste to even mention firearms. My daughter had a 6th grade school project last year and the students were supposed to pick a political issue and make their case for or against and my daughter (unprompted by me) chose to make a case for the right of the people to own Semi Auto firearms and "high capacity magazines", etc... and all the students were tasked with getting up and reading their piece in front of the class and present their argument, etc and my daughter was the only one who had her viewpoint and position challenged by the teacher. Mind you none of the other students had this pressure component.

1. Good on your daughter and good on you for raising her right.
2. The last thing you should worry about is what an antigunner thinks. Mention your guns and worry not.

I should point out though that it is likely the teacher may say something to an administrator over this, so don't be surprised if you get a call because your daughter is "a concern for school safety." Tell them to take a hike if they go that far. There's nothing wrong with you or your daughter. And yeah, that happened to me at one point when I was in school.

 

[Growlers]

I just think that guns and, by extension gun owners, have been so stigmatized by the press and others, that I am reluctant to display my guns or even otherwise openly support guns for fear of theft, property damage or verbal abuse. I know that this should not be, yet I believe that this is the reality of today's political climate. So, I certainly agree with the OP's observation that there has been a huge cultural shift in this regard. I am old enough to remember bringing a gun to my high school and using it as a member of our school's rifle team. No big deal at that time.

Don't get me wrong, I freely discuss firearms and make the case for their ownership and use, but only if someone else brings the topic up generally.

Perhaps the reason for the cultural shift has to do with the many World War II veterans who made up the bulk of our society when I was growing up (the 50s and 60s). Nowadays, it seems that the role of military veterans has been marginalized, and there are many fewer of them.

 

[.455_Hunter]

In todays climate, a male middle school or high school student who actively discusses firearms or shows an interest in firearms always runs the risk of being on the receiving end of a "Safe2Tell" style complaint, especially when the discussion is overheard or witnessed by "sensitive" peers, teachers or administrators. My 15 year old son is rated "expert" in the NRA Jr. Smallbore Program, and his coaches have emphasized the program and its activities should NOT be discussed at school or with non-shooting friends- too risky.

 

[Hydraulic Jack]

I think it also matters rural vs urban. Where I am, gun ownership is normal. I may have...more...than normal.

 

[Ignition Override]

Reloadron:

About a month ago my wife and I returned from a personal trip to CO Springs and Boulder.

In Boulder I quickly figured out - via his terminology about personal travel- that a guy with whom I chatted was a pilot (Southwest, at the DIA crewbase).
His daughter standing by him is a student at the U. C Boulder, as is his other daughter (they grew up near Atlanta).

She told me that her major is biology and in Each class, even Within her major, every TA or professor injects a bit of "Woke" b.s. now and then.
Amazing lack of professionalism on their part. Imagine a student injecting "personal guns " these days on a major college campus. The guaranteed result would = one grade lower, at the end of the semester, unless the professor really likes you otherwise?

What surprised me was what the guy's daughter said about many of her fellow students; her impressions are that many of them don't fall for it, and only appear to meekly accept the Woke nonsense, but won't discuss it.

 

[Reloadron]

Amazing lack of professionalism on their part. Imagine a student injecting "personal guns " these days on a major college campus. The guaranteed result would = one grade lower, at the end of the semester, unless the professor really likes you otherwise?

Yep and so it goes. Teachers trying to push their personal mindset on students. Like I mentioned in my example, it's not just about guns, it extends well beyond guns.

Ron

 

[.455_Hunter]

What surprised me was what her daughter said about many of her fellow students; her impressions are that many of them don't fall for it, and only appear to do so, but won't discuss it.

That's the dirty little secret that doesn't get much media attention- Gen Z is flopping back the other direction.

 

[Steve S.]

Bravo to daughter and bravo to dad!

 

[entropy]

I got a lot of flack from the trap shooters and hunters at a couple of "sportsmans" clubs I belonged too as well, and I dont doubt for a minute if things went south, and they thought that by giving you up would save them from losing their stuff, they'd do it in a heart beat. Ive had a couple tell me exactly that too.

As a Trapshooter, I know a few like that, but I think the % is higher with Skeet shooters. But then the guys I shoot with will bring their newest AR build to leagues to show it off.

It's not about learning and borders on brainwashing.

It's out and out indoctrination, and the college students that were in the 4-H shooting Sports that I led know it, too. They keep their mouths shut and heads down until they can get their sheepskin and get out.

 

[rust collector]

Institutions of higher learning are a big problem. There is a largely unspoken rule that students must not introduce any thought that does not come from instructors or lecturers. The faculty are raised in a culture of enlightenment that will brook no opposing views. The institutions that once considered themselves bastions of enlightenment have become hidebound and hobbled by their treasured liberal outlooks. They are consequently losing their standing and credibility. Life in cloudcuckooland is not real and does not prepare students for life outside. Of course, I only had 20 years of education, so I could be wrong.

 

[Howland937]

Thankfully our kid has a pro-2A, pro-personal liberty, non-common core curriculum.

Yep and so it goes. Teachers trying to push their personal mindset on students. Like I mentioned in my example, it's not just about guns, it extends well beyond guns.

Ron

Hopefully by the time he's ready for college, he'll have already developed his own thoughts and opinions and not fall for any of that.

 

[nettlle]

And there is the old school basic respect for others. Although open carry was/is legal we didn't do so because it may have offended others. We didn't publicly display our firearms to others for fear of offending the non firearm owners. In my experience gun owners, for the most part, are more respectful to non gun owners than they are to us. And in my mind it should continue to be this way.

We were here first. And we were here first for a reason. We will get no help from those we have tried so hard not to offend.