CZ 75 Police Use?

[KenW.]

Every industrial company can improve something, somewhere. It could be a symbiotic relationship. There's nothing wrong with change for the better.

Like I said earlier; I really like Ruger revolvers (love the security, service, and single sixes, Blackhawks, GP/SP series) but I just can't get my head around thier P-series autos. Though the SR1911 and LCP look interesting.

 

[armoredman]

Perhaps you could look at the offerings from the company CZ did buy and has been adding to steadily over time - Dan Wesson. Some nice stuff in the 2012 catalog.

 

[roaddog28]

I believe one of the reasons you don't see autoloaders like CZ75, S&W 5906 and Sig P226 in law enforcement much because the LE agencies are in love with Glocks and basically Glock has bought the market. Other than S&W with their M&P I don't see any other brands of autoloaders in officers holsters. At least in California. I do see a lot of Sig 226 trade in guns from LE in gun shops now.
Howard

 

[Bobson]

Definitely true that Glock enjoys much of America's LE contracts. However, from what I understand, many agencies on the east coast still use the P226, especially state police and sheriff's offices. IMO, moving away from them was a poor choice. I know Glocks are great guns, but the SIG is too. It's a matter of budget though.

 

[Mr.Blue]

CZ's marketing in the US sucks. They have GREAT guns at GREAT prices, yet most people don't know what a CZ is.

 

[viking499]

I was thinking CZ could help Ruger's autos more than the other way around, and also benefit themselves by being associated with an American name.

Understand. I thought you were coming at that from the other direction........

 

[mgmorden]

They should hire some designers on, and change up the aesthetics of their automatic pistols. The Ruger P-series are pretty ugly, IMO.

I'll agree, but the P-series is one of their older lines that is just still around. The SR9/SR40 are their newer offering, and from an aesthetics standpoint they're great (ok, I know that's subjective, but IMHO they are).

They're a bit too lawyerized (mag disconnect, thumb safety, LCI), but from an aesthetics and ergonomics standpoint I think they're one of the better polymer pistols on the market.

 

[CZguy]

CZ's marketing in the US sucks. They have GREAT guns at GREAT prices, yet most people don't know what a CZ is.

Well..........at least their marketing is better than Styer's.

 

[Mr.Blue]

Quote:
CZ's marketing in the US sucks. They have GREAT guns at GREAT prices, yet most people don't know what a CZ is.
Well..........at least their marketing is better than Styer's.

FYI- I'm a CZ guy. Since I bought my CZ SP-01, my last 5 handguns have been CZs. Between CZ and S&W I'd be set for life with handguns.

I just think CZ has a devoted, cult-like following, yet no one knows about them in the US.

 

[Big Mike]

To the OP's question, I think it has more to do with procurement/subject matter experts scribing the technical specifications for a sidearm that will be mass purchased for a department. As such, customer service and quality are characteristics that will contribute to a winning bid, but I suspect there are more specifications that would be equally weighted. All that said, I believe that CZ is not used more by police here in the US because they have chosen to not respond to as many procurement solicitations that could put more of their firearms into the hands of law enforcement. I see the introduction of the P07 Duty by CZ as a way to be more responsive to these solicitations.

 

[KenW.]

procurement/subject matter experts scribing the technical specifications for a sidearm that will be mass purchased for a department. As such, customer service and quality are characteristics that will contribute to a winning bid, but I suspect there are more specifications that would be equally weighted. All that said, I believe that CZ is not used more by police here in the US because they have chosen to not respond to as many procurement solicitations that could put more of their firearms into the hands of law enforcement.

Very eloquent. But will you put that in everyday layman's terms? Did you say CZ isn't being responsive to or seeking LE bids? Aren't CZs used by some european militaries? Seems like that's not a far stretch for them to cross.

 

[BCRider]

One aspect I have not seen mentioned so far is the DA/SA trigger issue.

Does CZ make a DAO model? I'm not seeing it on the CZ-USA site. Without such a model I doubt that any police force will be interested. The issues with a DA/SA gun are a bit too great given that a lot of officers tend to shoot only just enough to stay qualified. A big reason why the striker fired guns are generally chosen.

 

[Big Mike]

Very eloquent. But will you put that in everyday layman's terms? Did you say CZ isn't being responsive to or seeking LE bids?

Well, maybe a better way to put it is that the the types of bids advertised make it difficult for CZ to compete. In my opinion, municipalities/states are looking for pistols that are Glock-like in price, factory support, and operation based upon some of the specifications I've read; I came away thinking that they were really looking for Glocks or S&W M&Ps (though they never said that). I believe CZs are used by several militaries, with success, but that may not equate to or have value when purchasing a firearm to be carried by a LEO.

Another way to put it, to the OP, the reason why you don't see heavy use of the CZ75 in police circles, is that people buying and issuing handguns to the officers are looking for features and benefits typically found in Glock pistols.

 

[Tenacious B]

CZ's marketing in the US sucks. They have GREAT guns at GREAT prices, yet most people don't know what a CZ is.

Agreed, when I bought my first handgun I had never heard of or seen a CZ before. I was impressed by it at first touch, but had to do some internet scrounging to figure out what it was. When I discovered their reputation for durability and accuracy I did wonder why they are not as popular. Oh well, more CZs for me!

 

[PabloJ]

Very eloquent. But will you put that in everyday layman's terms? Did you say CZ isn't being responsive to or seeking LE bids? Aren't CZs used by some european militaries? Seems like that's not a far stretch for them to cross.

The CZ is well known and much advertised brand in US. They even published CZ magazines that were stocked on bookstore shelves. The only place these are used in military units is in former Czechoslovakia.
I suspect LE agencies do not look to CZ is because this company is not a leader in polymer framed weapons. Even neighboring Poland adopted Walther P99 to replace Wist-94, P-64, P-83 clunkers in police and military units.

 

[Furncliff]

CZ employs more than 2000 people making it one of the largest arms makers in the world. They have been suppling the military and police forces all over the world for a long time. Since they have only had a presence here since 97 they are the new kid on the block. I don't think they need the big big contracts to improve their economies of scale, they already have that.

All of my CZ's have been excellent and their CS is first rate as well, I wouldn't like that to change.


P.S. I suspect that the Europeans might not share the American business philosophy of bigger at any cost?

 

[wojownik]

CZ might not have answered many PD procurement opportunities. On the other hand those opportunities might have been so skewed towards the "familiar" brands as to discourage CZ (and others) from even bidding. Bidding on a government RFP can be time- and resource-intensive, especially if you are a dark horse vendor.

They were a communist country until the early 1990's (which is a bit after the initial wave of PD's switched to autoloaders)

FWIW, communism fell in Czechoslovakia in 1989. The country peacefully split into two separate states (Czech and Slovak) in 1992.

 

[armoredman]

I just think CZ has a devoted, cult-like following, yet no one knows about them in the US.

We at CZ Forums are trying!

 

[Walt Sherrill]

What few people realize is that CZ-USA was a very small company starting with relatively empty pockets. Startup busnesses in the old Soviet world had a lot of obstacles to overcome.

CZ-BRNO (the European parent company) started almost from ground zero when the Soviet Union and Communist Bloc dissolved, having to come up with funding and business savvy that would let them compete in the West.

(They weren't allowed to export to most Western nations until after the Communist Bloc fell apart. One of the CZ senior engineers defected to the West and went to work for Tanfoglio. Tanfoglio simply STOLE their design and started selling it in west.}

They're marketing savvy is pretty good -- witness all of the new guns, some of which are really starting to take off. They're marketing BUDGET is what is limited. They don't have the money of the Glocks or Berettas or S&Ws of the world to buy their way into the police market, but they seem to be doing pretty well. The new P-07, which allows for either a decocker or safety, should eventually work its way into the police market; the .40 version will speed that, I suspect.

Word of mouth has sold a LOT of CZs over the past 10 years, and they just now seem to really be hitting their stride. Just a few years ago darned few people knew about them; CZ fans are now acting like GLOCKaholics -- they're everywhere. <grin>

 

[Fishbed77]

But then Walther hasn't gotten a big contract in a while either.

Not is the US, anyway. They do very well for themselves in Germany and Europe as a whole.

The simple fact is that Walthers are imported/marketed in the US by Smith & Wesson, who isn't about to let the superior Walther pistols (P99 and PPQ) cut into the contract sales of their bread & butter M&P-series pistols.