So What Is the Purpose of the CZ 82/83?

[Shoot66]

9x18 vs 9x19

HGM22
The 9x19 was a no option for the Czechoslovak armed forces and LE since the early 50s. Moscow blocked the SA 23/25 production which was intended to become the standard military SMG. Those produced were exported. The recalibration brought the SA 24/26 (later replaced by the vz 58). The CZ 75 was an export only product till the democratic changes and got on the former CSFR domestic market only in 1990-91.
Cheers!

Edit: The missprint in "SA 23/25" in the 2nd line corrected.

 

[entropy]

To the OP:
Silly question: A better way to phrase it might be, "What are the possible uses for the CZ 82/83?"

And the answers are numerous. I owned an 82, and found it quite accurate. As a matter of fact, it's accuracy is what won me over. I fired a friends' and walked a pop can out from 5 yards to 45 yards with a magazine full, with only one miss. It is very concealable, I carried mine often, as it wasn't a lot bigger than my J frame .38, and held more than twice the rounds. The grip fits most hands well, the recoil, while snappy, was manageable. It has a 1911-style safety, can be carried cocked and locked if desired, or DA as desired. Simple takedown for cleaning. Both cartridges are usable for self-defense, your opinion notwithstanding. The price was very reasonable. There have been more reasons posted by others, but these are mine.

The only reason I don't still own mine is I needed to sell some guns to buy a car, and I sold that one with the justification that it was a caliber I didn't reload, and one less caliber I'd have to stock.

And has been stated, the purpose of the CZ82 was the Czechs were mandated the caliber, but they had national pride, and developed their own gun instead of adopting the Makarov, as they did with the vz 45 and vz 58 rifles.


The purpose of the CZ83 was export sales.

 

[Pilot]

I carry a CZ-75D PCR, but also often carry a Bulgarian Makarov, Polish P-83 and Beretta 85FS. I am comfortable with 9x18, and .380. The CZ-82/83 is a European service pistol from the era when this caliber was considered powerful. Remember, one of the most popular police pistols for decades was the Walther PP in .32 ACP.

 

[Paladin7]

I have a CZ-82 in 9x18 Makarov. The reason I believe this gun exists is for countries that do not allow civilians to carry Military Calibers. Also, there are some European Police Forces who are stuck carrying .380s, hence the gun being in the line up.

I bought mine to handload and shoot more 9x18 Makarov since I already have an EG Makarov.

The ergonomics on CZs are great and so is their accuracy. I'm not a fan of their designs and the CZ-82/83 is an example of this. It is a Rube Goldberg design with way too many parts for what it is. Compare it to a Makarov and you will see what I mean. Others may not be bothered by this, but I'm just not a fan.

Having said that it is a reliable gun with great ergonomics that shoots accurately.

 

[Walt Sherrill]

I can't figure out why this gun exists. Its underpowered for a pistol of its size and weight, making it a poor choice for both concealed carry or duty use (yes it can be used for both, but I think everyone can agree there are better choices). Why not use the CZ 75 in 9x19 or 9x18 as the duty arm of the Czechoslovakian state (yes I am aware that this state no longer exists)?

Why is this gun still being made today and who is buying it given all the great options from not only CZ (P07/P09, P01/SP01, and PCR/CZ75), but Glock, S&W, Ruger, etc.?

I don't think they're still made today, and new ones are no longer available for import to the US.

They existed because the Czechs wanted their own design rather than the Makarov, which used the same round. The CZ-82 was designed as a military weapon, which was a back up gun and not the main weapon. The Soviet Bloc didn't use 9mm (9x19), so you won't find any milsurp weapons from there in that caliber unless they've had "importer" mods.

It's a reliable, accurate, and durable weapon. Only the Makarov and the Berettas (like the 84) are as good. (The CZ-83 was available in .380, 9x18 and .32 ACP.)

As noted in an earlier reply, a number of countries won't allow weapons IN that are available in the calibers used by their militaries. Go figure. 9x17 and 9x18 have been popular rounds in Europe and South America.

Are there better guns in the same caliber? Maybe, maybe not -- I doubt that there are less expensive ones (than the CZ-82) of comparable build quality, but there certainly are LIGHTER ones. They are an acquired taste. You're asking for RATIONAL reasons for the guns to exist (explained) and to buy today... and folks don't need rational reasons to buy guns.

 

[toivo]

I have a CZ-82 in 9x18 Makarov. The reason I believe this gun exists is for countries that do not allow civilians to carry Military Calibers.

In the Cold War era, 9x18 was the military caliber of the Eastern Bloc countries. The CZ-82 was the military and police sidearm of Czechoslovakia. The reason it still exists is that they had a bunch left over.

However, your reason could explain the CZ-83.

 

[golden]

Hgm22

The reason this gun exist is simple.

1. The Czech's needed a 9x18mm Makarov chambered gun. It was not a choice they needed to make anymore than when they adopted the 7.62x39mm for their rifles. The Russians said it, they did it.

2. Having a long, distinguished history as an arms maker, they decided they could do better than the Makarov and in my opinion, they did.

3. This was a military and later police duty pistol usually worn on a belt without concealment, not a concealed carry gun.

Note, that smaller guns are usually harder to handle and shoot well, at least in my experience, so another plus for the CZ.

4. Since they had already designed the best 9x18mm military and police gun, they decided to build an export model, (VERY BIG MONEY FOR THE CZECHS, EVEN TODAY).
The west was not using the 9x18 and unlikely to buy it, so make it in the most popular police caliber in Europe at the time, the .32ACP. Others would want a more powerful caliber, so make it in .380ACP.

If you compare it to the competition at the time it was introduced, you will see it was very competitive and far better than other guns that it competed with for use as a military or police pistol, the BERETTA Cheetah 80 series being the only one offering a large capacity magazine.

Compare it with the WALTHER PP, which for many years was the police standard in Western Europe.

I have a CZ82 and find it a very accurate pistol with good sights and excellent trigger that I would compare to my BERETTA 82 and 84. The BERETTA has an aluminum frame, which helps a lot with using it as a concealed carry gun, but like the CZ, both have fine triggers, large grips and good sights, so they are very easy to shoot well.

Jim

 

[Gun Master]

Yeah, what he said.

 

[Baron_Null]

If I understood correctly, the OP knows why it was designed and adopted, but not why it stayed in production so long.

IIRC, the CZ83 in .32 auto was a popular choice in India where >.32 caliber is prohibited for civilian ownership.

 

[chicharrones]

I gotta admit, I don't think about my CZ82 much, but all the replies have put it in a new light. Thanks, y'all.

 

[Walt Sherrill]

If I understooed correctly, the OP knows why it was designed and adopted, but not why it stayed in production so long...

I don't think you understood correctly: the OP didn't didn't really address why the CZ-82/93 why it stayed in production so long, but more basically asked why it existed in the first place. . He felt that the the 9x19 round and CZ-75 were better choices and both predated the CZ-82/83. He was right -- but apparently had no knowledge of the practices of the Communist Bloc (or, more correctly, the "Warsaw Pact, which was the communist bloc's equivalent of NATO) during the Cold War. He wrote:

I can't figure out why this gun exists. Its underpowered for a pistol of its size and weight, making it a poor choice for both concealed carry or duty use (yes it can be used for both, but I think everyone can agree there are better choices). Why not use the CZ 75 in 9x19 or 9x18 as the duty arm of the Czechoslovakian state (yes I am aware that this state no longer exists)?​

The OP was obviously unaware that the Soviet Bloc did not (and would not) use 9x19 round, that the CZ-75 was designed for export (out side of the Communist Bloc), and that the round or the CZ-75 were NEVER used in the Soviet Bloc (or by the Czech Police or military) as a service pistol until after the Soviet Union fell... He was also unaware that many countries deny civilians (in Europe and Central and South America) access to weapons that use the same ammunition as militaries in those countries.

For the Warsaw Pact, just transitioning to 9x19 weapons would have been a big supply/logistic and training headache, would have been terribly expensive, and would have taken years -- during a time when the Communist military was more focused on aircraft, submarines, and ballistic missiles. And while the 9x18 round wasn't as powerful as 9x19 or .45 caliber, it was better than a pointed stick. The Soviet military apparently thought that AK-47s were good enough on the front line -- and AKs are still raising hell all over Africa and Middle East, today!!

To direclty and simply answer the OP's question: "military bureaucratic thinking" and "politics."

 

[HGM22]

Well I understand the CZ 75 was intended for export sales, but not sure why it couldn't have also been adopted as a military/police side arm in 9x18; the two are not mutually exclusive.

 

[Ignition Override]

Apparently the Czechs had too much national pride to simply adopt the Russian designs, which also seems to have been the case with the Poles' P-64 and larger 83.

1) Excellent ergonomics, although my thinner wooden grips are available for better concealed carry.
2) Very smooth DA pull, better than my Russ., Bulgy and two EG Maks, and nice SA pull also.

Despite the fun shooting these four Makarovs (and Polish P-83), the CZ-82's Superb Czech engineering is obvious when using it.
As for authentic magazines, look for "Ceska Zbrojovka A.S.", from "Uhersky Brod, Czech Republic" to be printed on the package. Many only hold 10 rds. (for CA restrictions?).

Is Snejderek lurking here, planning to clarify this topic?

 

[RON in PA]

You could make the CZ-75 in 9X18, but would it work? The locked breech CZ-75 was designed for the 9X19, a round that works at 35,000 psi. The 9X18 works at approx. 20,000 psi and was specifically designed for the blow back Makarov.

 

[Walt Sherrill]

Well I understand the CZ 75 was intended for export sales, but not sure why it couldn't have also been adopted as a military/police side arm in 9x18; the two are not mutually exclusive.

All of the OP's original criticisms of the CZ-82/83 would still apply, with extra force, to the CZ-75... using the 9x18 round: big, heavy, not easily concealed, etc.

With a light-enough slide or the proper recoil springs, the CZ-75 MIGHT work with the 9x18 round, but I doubt that the CZ-75 would do anything BETTER than the CZ-83 or Makarov -- except mute felt recoil. It would be a bigger, heavier gun firing the same round as lighter, more compact guns -- and weight sometimes matters, especially in the military.

Adapting the CZ-75 to use the Tokarev rounds would have made MORE sense (at least for the Warsaw Pact), but I'm not sure it could be done while keeping the great CZ ergonomics, asThe 7.62x25 round is noticeably longer than the 9x19 round. And there would be no real demand in the West for such a gun, unless it could manufactured in BOTH the 7x62 and 9x19 models.

 

[Capybara]

The purpose has been well covered by the replies in this thread. My CZ82 is on my CCW, I carry it occasionally, it's not much bigger than the Glock 19, probably one of the most popular CCW guns, although being all metal, it is heavier. Probably the best DA trigger I have ever felt on a semi-auto pistol, built beautifully, I bought it for under $200.00 a few years ago from J&G, what's not to like. I kind of like the chubby little 9x18 Mak round, I even just found a 9x18 Mak case gauge so I can more easily reload for it. Kind of a wimpy round but a good BU gun, fun plinker too.

 

[jmace57]

Sometimes there is a gun that just "fits". For me, it's my CZ83, although I have a CZ85 as well. I can shoot the cz83 better than any other gun I own. Wonderful double action trigger, great ergonomics for me.

 

[mavracer]

but not sure why it couldn't have also been adopted as a military/police side arm in 9x18;

One of your complaints of the CZ82 was size and weight and yet making a gun even bigger and heavier makes sense:banghead:

 

[lsudave]

Why does any gun exist? Answer- because it does.

Why was the CZ-82 /83 made? It was a military sidearm in a Warsaw Pact country, and in a lot of ways it follows the Beretta 92 formula: it is larger than it needs to be, thus providing higher capacity and soft shooting characteristics for the round it is chambered in. It really isn't larger than the Makarov, but gives you 4 more shots. It IS larger than the P64, but is far more comfortable to shoot and hold.

There was a thread questioning the existence of the 9x18 rd, and that was answered well: the Warsaw Pact had no need of a more powerful pistol caliber. For military purposes, the 7.62 x 39 AK eliminated any need for a submachine gun. For police purposes, a smaller blowback pistol brandished at an unarmed man in a police state would be plenty of deterrent.

For current shooters, this is a very comfortable gun to hold, and to shoot. It's very well made.

As also noted, it's out of production now. A shame, since it really is a fine gun

 

[Ibmikey]

I currently have three CZ 82's and enjoy the heck out of them. I removed the enamel and bead blasted them, one is finished with a dull blue, second in silver/black cerakoat and third OD/black Cerakoat then added checkered walnut grips. I have no intention of carrying one but they make great plinkers when out shooting my AR's so obviously they serve a recreational need for me...no CC, no war just fun.

 

[Wishoot]

My CZ82 has the nicest stock trigger you could ever ask for. Couple that with it's fantastic accuracy and you've got a winner.

 

[Baba Louie]

Purpose? Stimulate Economy

Because American gun owners will buy anything that is cost effectively well made!

Iron Curtain History... that too.

Don't like it? Move on to something else.

But they surely are accurate and fun to shoot.

YMMV

 

[BSA1]

Well since this dog still has legs.

The most common surplus holster is a leather full flap that completely covers the gun. It also has a pouch for a spare magazine that is covered by the flap. A mystery to me is why these holsters are in natural leather rather than dyed black like most traditional police and military ones.

I found this holster a few years ago. I don't remember where I got it and there are no markings on it. It raises the interesting question if it was a military issue item. It is of the same design as the leather ones except it is made of nylon. It is convenient to have a spare magazine is the holster.

The main advantage is I can store my CZ in it without fear of rusting from contact with leather. Another plus is I like flap holsters for field carry.

 

[Lj1941]

Why does the Ruger Mark Whatever .22 still exist? It's underpowered for a pistol of its size and weight.

Some people actually like the Mak cartridge. I even reload 'em. It's not what I carry, but I have a good time shooting CZ-82, Makarov, PA-63, P-64, and P-83. It's only a slightly hot .380, more or less, but plenty of people have .380's.

+1 -My CZ82 is the most accurate pistol in my possession. I like it for many reasons. I hand-load for it and it is very economical.Different strokes for different folks.

 

[kBob]

BSA1,

I really like that holster, whoever made it. Can we see the back and maybe mounted on a belt with the pistol and spare mag in place?

Anyone,

So is there anyone with a batch of these VZ 82 9Mak things in the US today for sale or have we seen the last of them?

-kBob