The Grendel gets you the perks of a 6.5 bullet. A bit longer reach without losing low recoil is all I can say.
CZ finally offers the 527 in 6.5 Grendel
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For eating sized game, a good hunter should be able to work closer than 500, I've only ever shot once at a deer past 400 and that was because he was dragging a shattered rear leg from someone else's "hunt" and I knew I couldn't get to him in time, so the 300wm barked and he dropped, don't really use that one much anymore, but varmints at longer ranges are pretty common around here, just 2 weeks ago I ranged a yote at 525 and couldn't get him to come in. He didn't run off. However, my rifles all pack more heat out there than the Grendel. I don't worry about the bullet drop that everyone talks about, that is the easy part. Still having the velocity required to make your bullet do what it's supposed to is my issue.Anyone who says they take 500> yd shots has very little hunting experience unless you're just trying to cripple game and forget about it.
Sounds good on the internet. BS alarm going off here..
farmerboy78
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Anyone who says they take 500> yd shots has very little hunting experience unless you're just trying to cripple game and forget about it.
Sounds good on the internet. BS alarm going off here..
If you think I'm bsing, then come to bald knob, Arkansas area and watch the results for yourself at the range and then decide for yourself if I can make the shot! I have already taken one whitetail @ 875yds that was drt. Please, I more than invite you...
Corn-Picker
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The 6.5 Grendel runs 5k higher pressure than the 7.62x39 (50 kpsi vs 45 kpsi according to SAAMI), it has a slightly larger case (look how tlittle taper it has compared to the AK round), and has a wider bullet selection (with better BCs).
The 7.62x39 drops below 1000 ft-lbs (my minimum) at ~170 yards. I leave open sights on it. It's a six pound, thirty-six inch long, open sight hunting rifle that's good to as far as I can shoot with open sights. The 6.5 Grendel (due to higher pressure, slightly larger case, and slicker bullets) would carry 1000 ft-lbs to 300 yards, which is as far as I will personally shoot at a big game animal. The 6.5 Grendel would definitely wear a scope, whereas I don't know if I'll ever scope my 7.62x39.
dh1633pm
Contributing Member
The post is getting a little off target. The 6.5 Creedmoor, the 6.5x55 Swede, the 6.5 Remington, and the Grendel plus others all have their design models and were developed for a variety of reasons. However if I had a CZ527 and wanted a 6.5 caliber, I think the Grendel makes the most sense for the conversion. Its a length of action versus length of cartridge.
dh1633pm
Contributing Member
I scoped my CZ with a 1-4. Works for me. But I can see why someone might not.
More options are always good. I love my 6.5 Grendel AR, but I think the best thing about 6.5 Grendel is that it fits in an AR-15. That's the whole point of the cartridge. If going to a bolt gun, I'll take a .260 Rem, 6.5CM, 6.5x55, etc. Does everthing the 6.5 Grendel does, and more with very little downsides (maybe going from the mini action to a short action is about the only disadvantage I could see, and I don't see that as a bit disadvantage).
Newtosavage
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Actually, bullet weight would be a reason for me to favor the 7.62x39 over the Grendel. I am currently hunting with a 160-grain Hornady FTX that gives me sub MOA groups to 300 yards, and carries 1100 ft. lbs. to 200 yards. I suppose the 6.5 mm bullet options are pretty broad too, but it's tough to beat the options I get from a true .308 bore.
Ahh your correct i was only thi king of the "standard" x39 bullets of around 125grain. The 125-130 6.5s will still shoot flater than the 140-150 class .308s, but your correct youll lose momentum, and because of the lower velocity both rounds operate at expansion dia and momentum are very important.
Atleas in my limited experience and opinion.
Atleas in my limited experience and opinion.
If both rounds shoot a light for caliber weight, the Grendel gets the 120 prohunter (.246 SD and bc .368) out there at about 2400 fps and the 100 gr btip (b.c. .350) or partition (.326 SD .205) somewhere just above 2600 (conservatively) the x39R is pushing a .308 125 btip or accubond (b.c. .366 sd.188) 2400 fps Max with Rl7 or 150 partition (bc .327 SD .226) btip (bc .435) 2280(guesstimate) then it DOES require the 160 gr (bc .330 SD .241) 2225 (according to newtosavage) to even get into the same sandbox. When comparing calibers, look at the SD for a fairer comparison. The Grendel pushes the same SD and better bc to 1000+ ft-lbs of energy at 200 yds with over 1900 fps in tow, if we use the btip same weight, 1000+ energy and now 2000+ fps. Ultimately bullet construction, shot placement and what you're most confident with should make the final decision, but the two are almost tied with a slight edge to the beautiful bc that the 6.5 delivers. If we drop to the 100 energy is at 999 with 2100+. The 125 runs 1900+ fps and still over 1000 energy. The final factor comes down to shock and energy dump. Most bullets will still expand around 1800 fps, but more impact velocity means broader wounds and more shock. In this case, the Grendel wins every time when comparing similar classes of bullets. The x39R is and will be capable but I'd take the Grendel first, all you give up is frontal mass, and for the game both would be used for that should be a non issue.
And now after all of that, I'm really salivating over the Grendel cz!
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Dog Soldier
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horsey300, That was an outstanding post. Very good.
Thank you, I thought it would be more helpful than just saying that the Grendel to the x39 is the 7-08 to the .308horsey300, That was an outstanding post. Very good.
^This^
The 6.5 Grendel and the 6.8 SPC were both created to be larger cartridges with better terminal and/or long distance performance than the .223 or 5.56 while still using a magazine compatible with an AR-15.
Outside of that if you no longer have to use a box magazine with those restrictions it doesn't make much sense.
Corn-Picker
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Both the CZ 527 and Howa Minis are box magazines restricted to 223 lengths...
You probably shouldn't buy a CZ 527 in 6.5 Grendel if you don't want one.
It makes sense for people who don't care for the ar platforms, don't need/want the higher blast/recoil/range/powder usage of the faster 6.5s. They don't recoil much, but for inexperienced shooters and even an experienced shooter throwing volume down range the difference is noticeable. At the useable ranges the Grendel is applied to (if we ignore the extreme side of the equation) the .260/6.5cm/6.5Swede are just wasted potential. That doesn't mean they aren't useful anyway but at 100ish yds, the Grendel in a bolt gun is a great option for novices to learn good hunting/shooting skills without worrying about recoil and blast. At 250 it's still just fine for a more experienced shooter to place careful shots on game animals and allow rapid follow ups that are slowed ever so slightly by the larger capacity case when we look at multiple target scenarios. My instinctive counter to your suggestion that more is always better in a bolt gun, "At your mid class ranges, you're wasting time if you're not in an ar-10, get a real bolt gun in 6.5-284/6.5-06!" For a 6.5 to REALLY surpass a .243 100 gr @2900-3000 fps, you need to push a 125-130 equally as fast with today's modern bullet construction and availability.(now that I've referenced the lowly .243 I fully expect a good roasting) This is why a low velocity 6.5 makes sense, at close range, those fast kids are just as likely to shatter a 100-120 gr on impact with the higher velocities as the much debated .243. The Grendel simply cannot produce enough velocity to cause jacket separation all on it's own. It shines EXACTLY where any fast cartridge is most likely to fail. "So use a better bullet!" "Load them down slower!" Yes you can. If you handload, and wish to cripple the cartridge into the Grendel and turn your .308 spawn into the exact thing that we don't "need". Better bullets are fine too, but then we're back to why not a .243 or 6.5-284 etc. The Grendel in a bolt is maybe a niche market, but so is organic grass fed beef and there IS a rising demand. The cz offers a quality reliable platform to utilize a cartridge that is quickly gaining ground and it may not be for everyone, but many would rather have a bolt gun than an ar and do not need/want the extra firepower so it's a perfect fit. It is no more necessary than a bolt x39r and yet they both fulfill a wonderfully under valued portion of the market for both target pleasures and field applications. If it's not your thing, that's quite alright, but for many people it's the perfect compromise.
fireman 9731
Member
Lets not forget about the perks of cheap Wolf ammo for plinking too.
Im finding that im not a fan of the AR, but i do like the Grendel, so these guns are right up my alley. With the longer barrel you SHOULD be able to hit 2600-2650 (quick loads predicts more when run at 60kpsi, but ive not expermented with it, as i prefer to keep bolt thrust down) with 123s and cfe223 pretty easy. My 20" barreled upper gets 2500 with the 123s and they perform quiet well.
Corn-Picker
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I
I'd stick with SAAMI specs (50k) in the Howa Mini and CZ 527. Those actions were sized for these calibers, i.e. the bolt lugs on the Howa Mini are smaller than the bolt lugs on the Howa short action.
I'd stick with SAAMI specs (50k) in the Howa Mini and CZ 527. Those actions were sized for these calibers, i.e. the bolt lugs on the Howa Mini are smaller than the bolt lugs on the Howa short action.
And at those impact velocities, with the proper bullet, you may have just validated a 6.5 as an accurate fur saving coyote rd for ranges where the faster kids tear em up.....further testing may be required
CoalTrain49
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Exactly.
At 500 yds a 25-06 is at it's velocity limit for bullet expansion. Same situation with Grendal.
Nothing left to say.
Agreed, i should have been clearer in my post.
Newtosavage
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LOL but that works for me too. Excellent post btw and I agree that I want that CZ in the 6.5G too!Thank you, I thought it would be more helpful than just saying that the Grendel to the x39 is the 7-08 to the .308
But, now that you mention it, I want to neck down my 7.62x39 to 7mm and see what happens. LOL. Good bullet weight selection, better BC and SD. Possibly an ideal deer rifle for light framed shooters.
I won't. The fans of the cartridge who want to see it in something something other than an AR won't care, doesn't make it any less lame.
@ Horsey300
Won't get any roasting from me. Actually I believe the .243 makes more sense for a light bolt action than the 6.5 Grendel. To each his own though.
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