Deer drive should be illegal.

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Well, I'm glad there are rules or otherwise it would be a free-for-all among hunters who care for nothing but themselves. I'm sure there are none here but there are plenty of slob hunters out there that need rules. If it weren't for rules, the U.S.A. would be a sterile wasteland; just like South Africa where unless there is a fence up with regular patrols there is essentially NOTHING of a big game variety moving.

We owned property in Pennsylvania for awhile. It was posted but people tore the signs down. Pretty much every year there were hunter trespassers some of whom I caught and evicted.

I like Ohio. One has to have written permission to hunt land that isn't theirs and the land doesn't have to be posted. Hunt without permission on my property and you won't be talking to me; you'll be talking to the police or game warden.
 
I've hunted with a friend in his community over in PA for decades. Everyone getting together and driving the deer is a tradition that they've done for generations. I've never had any safety concerns over the locals and their drives. The only unsafe situations I have seen there involved Pittsburghers bumbling around the area.
 
here,s my .02, i have hunted for 63 years and most of my deer hunting has been on about 3000 acres of deep woods and wooded ridges on 5 farms. we still hunt for three days and then we drive(if you want to) and in all those years there has not been any one shot or hurt in any way, other than a few old men falling down in the rocks. out drives are set up with drivers and standers way before we start with every one knowing were they are to be and we have been wearing orange safety vests since 1958. if you have ever hunted deep woods you will know that its very hard to still hunt deer that have changed their travel habits due to hunting pressure in very thick cover( 50 yards would be a far shot). any hunting should be thought out and done in a safe way, still, driving,tree stand or blind hunting. rut here is mostly hot in bow season, but you don,t here gun hunters pissing and moaning about it, they can just buy a bow and join in. eastbank.
 

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I don't participate in deer drives where I am, and we don't run deer with dogs in my area.

I don't hunt public land on the opening weekend because it's full of folks who are not very disciplined with their fire. I do hunt an area adjacent to public land and let the yahoos push the deer to me. :D

Let me ask this..., is fox hunting illegal where you hunt? I ask because I've had both good and bad results from fox hunters. Bad..., there were a dozen horses, a dude with a horn, plus two dozen hounds chasing a red fox through the public hunting area during early black powder hunting season while I was hunting. What's the difference between that and a deer drive messing up my chances of getting a deer? No difference. I didn't like it at all, but they were exercising their rights to the land just as I was. :fire: So not happy, but not wanting to ban them either.

Good..., later in the same year the horse boarding operation West of where I hunt on private land was hosting a fox hunt...and that drove a nice buck and four does across the roadway, and into the nice, quiet, peaceful farm land where I was located, and I got the buck. :D


LD
 
Ban Everything.

The A List:

Drives
Feeders
Guns
Bows
Crossbows
Pistols
Revolvers
Automobiles
Food Plots
Camo
Treestands
Blinds
Dogs
High Fences

Did I miss anything? With deer populations like they are, the powers that be need to be more leaniant. If we we don't keep the populations under control Mother Nature will in the form of disease and starvation. Now if you will excuse me I am going out to kill something.
 
The lease I belong to is in southeast Louisiana. I believe it to be ~2,000 acres. All of it is swamp.

When we do a man drive it takes 15-20 of us with 1/2 driving and 1/2 standing. The drivers spread out at intervals where they can still see each other and begin trudging toward the standers whoopin and hollerin as they go. The drivers generally carry shotguns because when you jump one up he's moving and it's easier to get a swing on him with the shotty.

To the OP. If you think a 2-3 mile hike through the swamp is "weak" I suggest you give it a try. It's actually a lot of fun, but being a driver where we hunt is a young man's game. We leave it to the "flat bellies". I'm in my 50's, work out regularly, and consider myself in great shape. A few years ago I drove for the first time in many years and it liked to kick my a$$
 
Personally, I don't think this is even hunting anymore.

I see we are back to the standby grand insult that basically boils down to if you don't hunt the way I do or in a manner I approve, then it isn't hunting. Or maybe it is just a statement of ignorance.

Drives (and I am not a fan of them) don't just have a long tradition going back to our grandfathers, but going back to the days of the early colonists, the tradition coming over from the Old World.

However, it was a tradition common to Native Americans for thousands of years with archaeological evidence of drives for rabbits, deer, pronghorn, caribou, and bison (that I know of).

It is hard to say that it isn't hunting anymore when it has been hunting for thousands of years.
 
When hunting public land, every other hunter should be viewed as a potential driver, and any hunter activity that includes movement is a potential drive. Studying the habits and movements of humans and incorporating it into your hunting strategy is every bit as important as studying the deer when it comes to hunter success on public land. If a half dozen hunters want to come in and be deer dogs, and do all the dirty work, I'm happy to take a strategic position based on anticipation of expected flight patterns of fleeing deer.

On public land, after the first few hours of the first day of gun season, the deer go exclusively nocturnal, and the only deer you are likely to see before sundown are those that have been "driven" to move from their hiding spot.

I wish we had more animal rights activists in Ohio so they could do the dirty work of driving.
 
In my area of SC, dog drives for deer is commonplace...but changing rapidly. I feel that one day soon it will be a thing of the past, but may not necessarily be illegal according to the law. The pressure is coming from other areas:

A local timber company is very dominate and owns thousands upon thousands of acres of timber producing land. They lease these holdings to hunting clubs of which some are still hunting clubs and some are dog driving clubs.

A non-hunter gentleman from out of state bought several hundred acres to build a home and have his dream estate on the river. Soon as hunting season started, dogs from adjacent clubs were everywhere and the hunters in trucks following the dogs literally rutted and tore up the man's new property. The man sued the timber company and won significant damages in court. This action rippled and the timber company stopped leasing their lands to clubs who use dogs to drive deer. Other timber companies and large landowners caught wind of this action and are stopping dog drives too.

Man drives may be the end result since the "man" driving the deer has some sense of property boundary lines. Not always, but hopefully, sometimes.
 
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I have been on many, many, deer drives.
I have been on many dog hunts for deer.
I prefer hunting from an elevated stand.
I really enjoy controlled, small dog hunts but I can't stand the 100 dog, 100 stander, 25 4x4 dog hunts where we spend half the day rounding up dogs. Dogs don't recognize property boundaries (neither do deer) and I have had several intense talks with dog owners when their young dogs decided cattle were easier to run than were deer.
We often do controlled drives in 5-10 year old planted pines. A couple of standers on a logging road with shotguns and a few people easing through the pines and making a little racket can lead to a lot of success.
Public land carries many challenges. You can't leave a stand or build a stand. Others can just drive through whenever they want. Squirrel season coincides with deer in many areas so Zeke and his dog Thunder (all 4 pounds of feist) can just stroll through with a 20 g looking for Mr Bushytail. People that don't hunt just may decide that opening day of deer season is a good day for a horseback ride and a picnic. Hey! It is PUBLIC LAND. The key word is PUBLIC.
Idiots tromping through the woods throwing lead indiscriminately are definitely a problem but I think that is more the hunter than it is the method of hunting.
Calling the DNR because you don't like a legal deer activity is a GREAT idea. Maybe someone will call in because your bow is scaring their children.
 
Personally, I don't think this is even hunting anymore.


Some say the same about baiting or the use of dogs. Same argument can be made about "primitive weapons" hunts using scoped muzzle-loaders shooting sabots or Compound crossbows. Get over it, odds are you saw the deer you did because those folks were driving. Had you got a deer because of this, you'd probably be here bragging about your hunting prowess.

Deer drives in Wisconsin are just as deeply ingrained as deer camps and the season wrapped around Thanksgiving. If you do not know this, you haven't hunted Wisconsin for very long. As for the multiple bullets buzzing by your head, I tend to be a bit leery and think there may be a bit of embellishment there. But solitary deer hunters shooting at deer randomly walking/running thru the woods can be and are, just as dangerous. Those most vulnerable to unsafe deer drives are those involved in the drive themselves.

In many areas, driving deer is the only way to see deer or make them accessible to hunters. I guessing you were on public land. Hunting pressure on public land makes it so deer do not move naturally during daylight hours.
If you see a deer during daylight hours during the gun season on public land in Wisconsin, odds are, you or another hunter kicked it up. Most folks on private land wait till later in the season to make drives in hopes the neighbors aren't on stand to shoot the deer that leave that property. In states where deer drives are illegal it is like baiting, or using dogs, more of a unfair advantage or regional thing, not because of safety, unlike the restriction of firearms.

As for the fish drives, many folks think that's what trolling is, and have the same sentiments towards that as you do about deer drives. But in many of the states waters, trolling and the use of down-riggers is the only way to get a bait effectively down to and in front of the fish. Don't like it yourself, don't do it, but if you don't do it, don't condemn those that do it safely, ethically and legally, just because it's a effective method you do not employ.

You don't say where in Wisconsin you were hunting. I have hunted many of the states large parcels of public land. Hunting them during opening day of gun season can be frustrating and bothersome regardless of whether there are drives going on or not. Generally later on in the season, you have the whole place to yourself. While you may need to employ tactics other than just taking a stand and eating sandwiches while you wait, there are generally deer left and quality field time to experience. If those driving areas " pretty much cleaned the entire area" they probably didn't do it by killing all those deer, they just drove them somewhere else where drives are not easy to make. Deer on public land pattern those folks that make the same drives in the same areas time after time, day after day, year after year. If they didn't there wouldn't be any deer left to drive.
 
It's not about what I know not to do, it's whether the other folks in the woods know it as well. My experience is many don't. That's one of the reasons I took up fly fishing and stay out of the woods in deer season.

Well, yeah, I don't hunt public land. If I were to do a drive, it'd be on a private lease with friends that I know and could vouch for. I have hunted on public lands in Texas. The most of it is in east Texas in the piney woods, tough hunting and one buck limits. The best hunting in this state is in the roughly western 2/3 of it on private property. Most of the hunting is done in elevated blinds/stands near a corn feeder or over a food plot. If you ask someone from Oregon or Washington, 99 out of 100 of 'em say this should be outlawed because they don't think it's ethical. Well, screw 'em, I do think it's ethical! :D
 
Hmmm...

Well, neat. Glad to see we have yet another voice calling for yet another human activity to be made illegal. :scrutiny:

You know, someday we're going to pass enough laws, finally, that so much stuff will be illegal that the world will be a happy and safe place to live. :mad:




I've never been on a game drive and have no interest in doing so, but just remember, the next time you notice some freedom you THINK you should have being made illegal, or you find that some activity you feel you should be allowed to choose whether or not to engage in is against the law of this "land of the free" -- just remember how many times you've looked at someone else doing something and said, "they aught to make that illegal." Unfortunately, we get the laws and the society we deserve.
For deer, I'm also primarily a bow hunter (still-hunting on public land) but I have to agree 100% with Sam1911. Don't like how they hunt? Shake it off and hunt somewhere else or at least be aware that gun hunters (for deer) don't think and hunt the way you do.

From their perspective, a drive is a perfectly efficient (and probably entertaining) way to hunt deer and pain-in-the butt bow hunters sitting out there get in the way and ruin the fun. Hope they don't want to outlaw bowhunting.

Outlawing deer drives? No. Get over it.
 
There are obnoxious things that other hunters do to screw up your hunt. Simply walking too close to you when you are on stand is common. One year a guy was sighting in his gun about 100 yds. from me in mid season for buck. I don't see how you can control everyone's bad manners. A deer drive has it's place if the deer are holding tight - opening day, I don't understand it. Shooting bears over bait in guided "hunts" is perhaps the worst thing I've seen.
 
Yeah, I LOVE the real sporting types that gripe about drives....dog or otherwise....I run dogs, find it extremely challenging and personally consider that a real trophy buck taken in front of a good dog pack is one of the most difficult to realize.

It's really not exaggeration to state that these hunters, (still/stand hunters) invariably place their stands at the edge of dog hunt areas, or if on public land directly on the most known drive routes........yeah, they're sportsmen,,,real non dog hunters that gripe about us and are STILL hunting over our dogs.

Best of all, are the ones that tell you face to face that they 'didn't do that back North'..

Just the sort of crap that damages ALL hunters is the infighting syndrome articulated in the first post!!
 
The OP's complaint is not about drives as drives, but about a drive that was poorly thought-out, without consideration that other hunters--or hikers--might be in the area. That's the part of the deal that was dead-wrong, IMO.

Winner!
Sounds to me like the OP went on a drive with some morons.

All my father in laws does is dog hunt and drive, I don't understand why people always go to "this should be illegal". If you don't like it simply don't do it, I don't do it mainly because I'd rather be in the still, quiet, solitude of nature than the socializing that is commonly done in drive hunting.

I completely understand why people like it, I enjoy it to some extent. And I completely support they're right to so.


I'll point out, at one time and probably occasionally today, many people wanted hunting with rifles outlawed because the bullets could kill a man miles away. I've seen people show up to hunts and see rifles there then leave.
 
Let me rephrase this, it should be illegal on public land. Private lands, i could care less. It's just dangerous. Even with blaze orange on, can you really spot every single hunter within sight while you're fixated on the running deer? i think not. This also took place in the marsh and it's quite thick even during winter. You couldn't see someone in blaze orange pass 50 yards. Now add the excitement of shooting at running deer with semi-auto's and things can turn ugly fast.

okay, didn't mean to offend anyone. It all boils down to safety. I don't care if the next guy shot all the deer. I only care that I can go back home alive. It's public land. Expect that there will be others in the area between the drivers and shooters.
 
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Jeff,

what's there to defend? There's no need to defend myself when safety is the main priority.
 
Perhaps "defend yourself" isn't the right way to say it or see it. There have been a lot of thoughtful responses that debate against the "should be illegal" opinion you presented.

In the interest of a quality discussion here on this subject, do you have any response to those points? Do you still feel laws should be passed to outlaw an eons old and worldwide hunting practice to solve the safety issues or inconvenience issues you perceive?
 
Perhaps "defend yourself" isn't the right way to say it or see it. There have been a lot of thoughtful responses that debate against the "should be illegal" opinion you presented.

In the interest of a quality discussion here on this subject, do you have any response to those points? Do you still feel laws should be passed to outlaw an eons old and worldwide hunting practice to solve the safety issues or inconvenience issues you perceive?

Thank you for phrasing it more eloquently than I did.

pse, perhaps you don't need to "defend" yourself, so to speak, but you proclaimed a rather incendiary statement, which led to a lively discussion, and then just walked away without a response.
 
Jeff,

what's there to defend?

Calling everyone who has ever participated in deer drives "weak hunters."

Then setting yourself aside as better than them because you bow hunt...and that takes skills...again implying they have none.
 
Let me rephrase this, it should be illegal on public land. Private lands, i could care less. It's just dangerous. Even with blaze orange on, can you really spot every single hunter within sight while you're fixated on the running deer?

I've had the luxury of only hunting on private land, I've never once hunted on public land.

So I can't honestly comment on how hunting on public land should be conducted. That said, I'm generally not in favor of new laws.
 
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