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Defensive Ammunition 101

Discussion in 'Shotguns' started by Dave McCracken, Aug 14, 2011.

  1. RetiredUSNChief

    RetiredUSNChief Member

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    o_O

    Might just as well shoot birdshot, then, for all the penetration they lack. Factory produced, cheap, and not a concern with respect to forensics data should you ever actually have to use your shotgun in defense.
     
    TikkaShooter and Big7 like this.
  2. Down Range

    Down Range Member

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    They were good enough to eliminate problems in Vietnam. Makes them good enough for me.
     
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  3. amd6547

    amd6547 Member

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    They were considered an unsuccessful experiment in Vietnam.
    The only guy I've learned of who was famous for using a shotgun in Vietnam was named Patches Watson. He was a SEAL, and often used an Ithaca Model 37 loaded with #4 buckshot.
    His shotgun had a spreader choke device.
    Patches' Model 37 is in the SEAL museum.
     
  4. RetiredUSNChief

    RetiredUSNChief Member

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    ^^^^

    What he said.

    A great many concepts have been tested/attempted in firearms over the centuries of use, and ultimately the final outcome is that mass, combined with velocity, is pretty much king.

    Razor blades, for example, are deadly sharp...but if you load up a shotgun shell with razor blades, all you'll get is a poor pattern, excessive loss of velocity, and minimal penetration.

    HOWEVER...there is a decent range of ammunition available perfectly suitable for self-defense to choose from and there is absolutely no reason whatsoever to say "you MUST use THIS one". Make your choice as you see fit, for whatever circumstances you may see yourself in. Just choose wisely.
     
  5. Big7

    Big7 Member

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    ABSOLUTELY.

    Mine sits with a stack of 3 1/2in. 00.

    Put on all the body armor you want. Even if there is no penetration, the blunt- force trauma from that 18 pellet shot shell WILL solve the problem.
    And... Even with that armor on, nothing stopping the defender from shooting the face/ head or bottom torso. It's instant. Dope or not. NOBODY can survive that.

    Case closed.
    End of story.

    Who's with me on that?
    If you are, please "like" my post.
     
  6. Big7

    Big7 Member

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    No. They do not. Look it up on a reliable source.
     
  7. Big7

    Big7 Member

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    ABSOLUTELY !!

    Especially with the Brown Water Navy shelling river banks with 10 and 12 gauge semi- auto mounted gun pods.

    Off topic a little but NOTHING can survive that barrage if a direct hit occurs.
     
  8. Remy1858

    Remy1858 Member

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    That load has been permanently discontinued from Federal, a shame.

    I use the Federal LEO low recoil 9 pellet 00 in my 870 for home protection. My feelings are the reduced velocity makes 0 difference inside the home but the recoil is less for faster follow throughs and the muzzle blast effect is a bit less on the ear canal.
     
  9. TikkaShooter

    TikkaShooter Member

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    Unless accompanied by Infantry, the shotgun was frowned on in Vietnam. The reason is simple, slower to reload. In combat, obviously, speed of reloading is of high importance. Can anyone reload a 12 gauge semi or pump faster than an AK or AR?
    As I was in Vietnam; it isn't debatable. OTOH, for home defense, a shotgun is definitely good stuff.
     
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  10. 1KPerDay

    1KPerDay Member

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    Why? You don’t get prizes for the most likes. o_O
     
  11. amd6547

    amd6547 Member

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    7D3345FF-EE31-4244-8010-F26CCFB72792.jpeg Patches with his Ithaca Model 37, nicknamed “sweetie”.
     
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  12. TikkaShooter

    TikkaShooter Member

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    The R/Ts we inserted carried a sawed off M-79.
    https://sofrep.com/news/the-guns-and-gear-carried-by-special-ops-sog-recon-teams//

    "Sawed-off shotguns saw SOG service, too, primarily the Remington Model 870. One SOG recon skydiver, Sammy Hernandez, somehow got his hands on a sawed-off Winchester Model 1897, which he strapped aside his body for a night jump into Laos. Another SOG recon man carried a sawed-off Browning A5 semi-automatic into Laos, which proved his undoing; it was fast to fire but slow to reload, and he was shot dead while reloading."

    https://www.americanrifleman.org/ar...my-lines-weapons-of-vietnams-covert-warriors/

    I'm not saying you're wrong; however as I was there too; I also know what I saw.
     
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  13. 2zulu1

    2zulu1 Member

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    I don't ever remember seeing any shelling with shotguns, there were mounted belt fed 40mm OO buck with an assortment of other load outs. Flechettes in shotguns didn't have enough mass to be effective, some SEALs formed an oval shape at the muzzle of their Ithaca 37s in an attempt to get a broader pattern with OO buck, it didn't work out either.

    Gunships could load flechette rockets in their rocket pods, with white phospherous damage was kinda like a stake and bake. :)

    When did you serve in the Nam?
     
    Merle1 likes this.
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