Dishonestly selling a gun?

[YeagersClaw]

Not sure if you folks are aware but Springfield armory is doing a giveaway each week on their website and having two main firearms "duel" each other. On their website for the duel the gentleman in the video describes the Socom II "for home defense, its going to be a great option". Does anyone actually agree with this guy, or would actually do this? What happened to the old pump-actions and AR-15s for home defense? Sales people really do just say anything is great for home defense as long as it goes bang so I guess he's right. Its better than nothing but I feel like you would destroy your home with such a powerful round....What are your thoughts? I feel that sales men misguide people out of better options for home defense by promoting anything as "great for home defense" to make a sale, and to do so is disrespectful.

http://duel.springfield-armory.com/vote

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcR6fUzEQsA

 

[Robert]

If a .308 is all I had then sure. But there are much better options.

 

[Agsalaska]

Ever shot a .308 indoors. No way man. Not unless its all I had.

 

[Theohazard]

Well, with lightweight varmint loads a .308 would work for home defense, but I'd much rather have a .223.

 

[vaupet]

I once shot a 30-30 indoors, muzzle out of the window at broad daylight and it wasn't a pleasant experience.

For me 9mm is ok for home defence.

using a rifle would meen I'm inside with a rifle and the danger is outside my closed house.

imagine convincing a judge and jury

 

[HexHead]

Ever shot a .308 indoors. No way man. Not unless its all I had.

Especially a short barrel .308 with a muzzle brake. The word LOUD wouldn't even begin to describe it.

 

[Sam1911]

I doubt anyone hanging out at the Springfield Armory site and watching their gun duel videos is such a gun newbie that they're really susceptible to being grossly mislead by a little gun salesman pitch like that.

And yeah, so it isn't a perfect weapon for the role? Meh. We get really hung up on which gun and which ammo for defensive purposes and those kind of gear questions are really the tail-end 3% or so of the important stuff one should be considering when planning out home defense. I wouldn't pick a .308 rifle for the purpose if I had other options, but it really makes almost no difference at all.

If I was asked to advise someone about a good HD choice, I'd pick something else. But I sure wouldn't get upset or cast claims of being unethical on a company rep over this.




...

And having run 7.62Nato battle rifles in shoot houses, I've found the Socom to be pretty handy compared to (for example) a full-sized FAL or M1A. It's a rifle. It's loud and powerful. You could do worse in defending your home.

 

[DeepSouth]

I'd personally rather have a M1A for a home defense gun than AR, different strokes for different folks I guess. Hell, for a while my marlin 450 lever gun stayed beside my bed!

To me it's simple, the gun I'm enjoying most at the time is my HD gun. With in reason of course, I never propped up the Sharps beside the bed. My wife keeps an XD on her side of the bed so were always covered.

As far as the sales pitch, it's just all the other sales pitches..... Silly and borderline insulting.
Just tell me why your product is good, tell me about the materials used, tell me about the tolerances, tell me about the design, tell me about the manfactureing process, tell me about the warranty, ect, ect. I'll decide what I want to use it for.

 

[Ryanxia]

While it wouldn't be my first (or 2nd) choice either, it might be a pretty good choice for some. If you have a couple hundred yards of open field around your house and there's more than just shooting from room to room for instance. And if you take into consideration large wildlife as well, not just burglars, I can definitely think of worse guns to pick.

That being said, of course they're going to promote their own product, that's what businesses do.

 

[Skylerbone]

I had the misfortune of standing next to my 30-06 as my gunsmith fired two rounds down the test tube. I wasn't paying attention when he gave notice but my hands went to my ears for the second shot even as the ringing swamped my senses. Even now I keep corded plugs round my neck during deer season and when the opportunity allows I get them in.

Maybe SA is pitching hype but I'd sooner have enough gun and use it if need be than to weigh potential hearing loss vs the consequences. Of course that's something to consider long before the situation arises.

 

[sauer1911]

I'll stick with .40cal hollow points. That will be loud enough.

be safe

 

[a-sheepdog]

I think a 308 would be way too much for home defense unless you are up against armored attackers or in an environment with no neighbors and no house guests that may be struck with the projectile after it continues through the walls and out of the residence. The SOCOM is gonna be loud as well, especially with the muzzle brake so you will not be able to hear after the first shot. I think that there are much better options for interior home defense. If you are fighting in an environment where distance is needed, an option, but then again, there are yet better options for that situation as well.
If you wanted to use a rifle indoors, I would want a .223/5.56 with soft point ammo to limit penetration after striking the target. Even a 12 gauge shotgun with 00 buckshot will penetrate 8 layers of sheetrock. Once the projective leaves the barrel, its your responsibility where it goes after that. Plan ahead to keep collateral damage to a minimum.
Springfield is just trying to move their product, once its sold, its the buyers responsibility as to how its used.

 

[Art Eatman]

"Home defense" can have many different scenarios. Mine generally are inside or very near the house. So, IMO, a handgun or shotgun would be as useful as a rifle.

A few years back, however, we had a member from northern New Mexico who was having to deal with armed thief/vandal types and in an area of almost no LEO response. A semi-auto .308 for him would easily have met a true need.

While I think that the "voting war" is rather silly, IMO it's a trivial issue.

 

[taliv]

i had a socomII and it was unbearably loud outdoors. it was seriously loud. things would have to be pretty bad before i found myself indoors with only a socom II

common sense notwithstanding, i wouldn't get upset about the salesman stuff. however, they should know that as soon as I hear something like that from someone, their credibility instantly goes to zero, and it take a long time to earn it back.

i've sold lots of stuff, but none of it was worth my credibility. so why make up stuff like that? maybe it was unintentional and his mouth just outran his brain. who knows

 

[BSA1]

It will serve duty well for us country folk. In fact the .308 is a better choice for me than the .223. It would have been reassuring if you were in Missouri during the recent riot.

The fact you disagree with the sales hype doesn't make it "dishonest."

 

[Fishbed77]

Especially a short barrel .308 with a muzzle brake. The word LOUD wouldn't even begin to describe it.

My thoughts exactly. Sounds like a good recipe for permanent hearing loss.

 

[Sunray]

The Socom II itself is a marketing rifle. No such thing as an M-14 Carbine. In any case, a rifle, in any cf chambering, is the last thing you'd want for house defense. Unless you're being invaded by zombies.
"...I feel that sales men misguide people..." Not really, but they will say anything to make a sale. A video is done by the Marketing types, not sales.

 

[benEzra]

In any case, a rifle, in any cf chambering, is the last thing you'd want for house defense.

An unbraked .223 carbine is an excellent alternative to the traditional 12-gauge shotgun in the HD-long-gun role; it's not any louder than an 18" 12-gauge and is less prone to overpenetration than handguns are.

For me and my circumstances, a .308 would be less than ideal (unnecessary recoil, less handy, and more wall penetration than .223) but for someone in a more rural setting than I am, it could make a lot of sense. I'd choose one with a flash suppressor rather than a muzzle brake, though; a brake on any gun that might be used indoors is a big negative, IMO.

 

[highpower]

It's called "marketing".

They are trying to sell guns..go figure.

 

[orionengnr]

So...win their contest, take the .308 rifle, sell it and buy two or three more suitable HD weapons. Easy as 1, 2, 3.

 

[Ditchtiger]

Ever shot a .308 indoors. No way man. Not unless its all I had.

Yes, my CETME in a tin shed at a private range. 2 rounds and I stopped.

 

[HOOfan_1]

How can that be called dishonest? It is an opinion...

 

[Outlaw Man]

A great option for a self defense weapon is one that is at arm's reach and will stop the threat.

That said, the SOCOM II certainly wouldn't be my first (or last) choice.

 

[henschman]

Enjoy firing that 16" braked .308 indoors.

The point of self defense is to DEFEND YOURSELF from death or serious bodily harm... not to CAUSE YOURSELF serious bodily harm! I would put blown out ear drums in that category.

 

[CarJunkieLS1]

What happened to the good ole 12gauge pump shotgun.. IMO there is no equal to this for HD use. In or around my house 12gauge everyday. On my person a .40S&W Glock