DON'T use the slide release?

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If a pistol discharges simply from releasing the slide to chamber a round, that is called a slam fire and something is defective internally.

Now, if you were to do something stupid such as have your finger on the trigger when chambering a round, that would be a loose nut. ;)
 
Hmm... I have tried both, and to be honest, I think I am faster at just hitting the lever. Still, I guess my main question would be "Who cares?". Both methods get the gun back into battery quickly, right?

The comment about the levers being small is an annoyance to me, because its true! I am willing to work around some things, but if I can't operate the three controls on my gun with one thumb, that gun is useless to me as far as a defense gun goes. I don't do much weak hand training as far as shooting goes, which I know I should, but I do sit in my room and do weak hand training with the controls, and on all my "defense" guns, I can operate the gun one handed with either hand. Call me silly, but that is important to me. Silly small levers.....
 
Now if my primary shooting hand somehow gets a bullet thru it,aka out of commission,how does the training that I so dillegently did to slingshot the gun back into battery help me now??? :confused:

Rifles were made for two hands,pistols were made for one! :neener:
 
Defective pistol and A.D.

So you're going to say that a condition exists because it occured in a defective piece of machinery? That's kinda like saying a Ford is likely to stall simply because I saw a forty year old beater with no maintenance done sitting on the side of the road.

Function checks are our friends.
 
The lever is much quicker on a 1911.

As mentioned, if you are going to shoot all different types of autos, the slingshot method might be the best.

And, I believe the chances of a "reload" in a "real world" situation is probably slim to almost none. As Tuner said, if your gun is "locked back" you probably are in trouble anyway. :)
 
I have to second the motion that finding the slide release is not a "fine motor skill" its actually much less of an action than what is required to slingshot the slide. You have to practice. If you can't find your slide release I don't know how you would manage to find the magazine release. I have been a piano player most of my life and I remember giving recitals when I was young where I was almost frozen with fear and nerves and playing a classical music piece takes plenty of fine motor skills. Its practice that helps you develop your ability to perform actions under stress. No tactic is going to overcome a lack of practice. Using the slide release is, in my opinion, the simplest, fastest way to drop the slide and chamber a round. It also economizes motion and creates consitancy between your emergancy and tactical reloads to avoid confusion under stress.

The exception being as noted before if your weapon doesn't lend itself mechanically to dropping the slide that way EG: Glocks.
 
If you can't find your slide release I don't know how you would manage to find the magazine release.
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Exactly. And what is trigger control if not a fine motor skill.
Having BTDT on a few occasions, "fine motor skill" is an overworked phrase by those who get paid by the word and repeated by those who have never been in a shooting situation to know what goes on.
jon_in_wv is absolutely correct. Practice. It's not about "fine motor skill", it's about maintaining a perishable skill and that is only done by repeated and constant practice. No pro basketball player ever made it by only shooting baskets just one afternoon and get picked up by the NBA the next day. It's a skill you develop and a skill you have to continually practice to maintain.
 
I was almost tossed off a Dept range for using the slide release, yes, on a G-rock, and I informed them that I would TRY to do it thier way while qualifying, but off of that range, I will do it they way I have trained for YEARS. Slingshot is WAY unnatural for me, and would cause, as Sir Toppenhat would say, "Confusion and delay."
 
I read in Chris Bird's Concealed Handgun Manual, about a police officer who was killed while behind cover, trying to release the slide with his thumb (don't know what model of pistol). The BG came around and shot the officer.

I've experienced the all-thumbs feeling, while waiting with a gun in my hallway, while a BG tried to kick in my front door. Dialing 9-1-1 on the cordless phone was very, very difficult.

I grab the back of the slide. The slide stop on my P-11 is tiny.

Respectfully,
Dirty Bob
 
One other point that nobody has mentioned. A locked-on-empty gun is a stoppage, no matter how you cut it. Stoppages will get a body killed in a real fight.
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As mentioned, if you are going to shoot all different types of autos, the slingshot method might be the best.
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I don't use a slide stop for exactly these reasons. I want to train my body to use the same motion every time for every pistol; doesn't matter if it's an 'empty mag' stoppage or a stovepipe or any other form of malf, and I don't want it to matter that I have a 1911 in my hand or a CZ. I want to do a variation of a TRB and be done with it. That means that I rack the slide with an overhand or slingshot movement to clear/recharge it regardless of why the chamber is empty.

It may not be the fastestbestestbeatthebuzzer kind of movement and JMB may not approve of my shunning his checkered/serrated slide stop, but it will work for me every time - and that's what I want.
 
how does the training that I so dillegently did to slingshot the gun back into battery help me now???
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Well, I've got a couple of guns with no slide release, so I'd have to rack those on my belt or on a hard surface nearby. If the gun does have a slide release, then I could always use it if my weak hand were messed up.
 
My thumb can't reach the slide release on my Browning Hi-Power, and on my Glock it's obviously not big enough to use easily. I use the same method for both guns, and when I draw my Glock I sweep off the imaginary safety.
 
Release

>>My thumb can't reach the slide release on my Browning Hi-Power, and on my Glock it's obviously not big enough to use easily.<<
************

psssst...Try it with your left thumb as you slap a magazine in. But...:scrutiny: ya didn't get that from me. 'Kay?:scrutiny:
 
I think it's a general oncensus that Browning designed the 1911 and early BHP to operate this way, it's only recently (in the past 40 years) of 'smiths looking at guns in need of repair that realized dropping the slide on an empty chamber causes problems... if you want to funtion test your pice use snap caps, that's what they are for.

I've had a 1911 develop hammer follow-down and dropping the slide on an empty with the slide stop was called by my 'smith the most likely culprit. So I don't do it anymore--regardless of the make or model.
 
1911 Tuner, that's what I mean, my left thumb. It always seemed like a reach. There's no way my right thumb was making it over there, so I assumed everyone used their left thumbs. I couldn't do it at any reasonable speed, so if the slide was locked back, I'd just grab it and release it.
 
Reach!

Nekkid prophet wrote:

>1911 Tuner, that's what I mean, my left thumb. It always seemed like a reach.<
*******

For the short-thumbed, there's a little different technique. Slap the magazine home, and leave your thumb extended as you roll the gun back into a firing grip...reach for the pad as your hand slips onto the frontstrap. I don't have overly-large hands...though they're above average...but if I stick my thumb straight up with my hand in a firing grip, the tip is a good half-inch above the top of the slide. A matter of a little practice can get the timing just right.

Semper Fi! Do or die! You can do it...if ya try!

oorah...;)
 
Also, don't have the action locked open, drop a round into the chamber and then release the slide (by slingshot or by using the slide stop). This is very hard on the extractor and will break or bend it and/or deform the hook that pulls the empty case out of the chamber.
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This is also the only way I've been warned against chambering a round re: NDs. The slide slams home onto the round in the chamber with more force than when stripping a round from the mag, and could result in a slamfire.

Also, with my mousegun (Beretta 21A in .22LR) I've been warned that debris on the breech face can cause an AD when chambering a round using the slide. This probably goes for all semi rimfires. But, the 21A has the unique, flip-up barrel. So it is one auto where it's okay, and actually preferable, to manually load a round into the chamber by hand.

I also think they should be called 'slide stops' not 'slide releases'. I don't own a Glock, but I own a Mak. And the slide stop is probably the weakest link in the design, most are stamped and will wear-out over time if you use them to release the slide. I guilty of using both methods but if you want to be anal about it, the 'slingshot' method is preferable.
 
Also, don't have the action locked open, drop a round into the chamber and then release the slide (by slingshot or by using the slide stop). This is very hard on the extractor and will break or bend it and/or deform the hook that pulls the empty case out of the chamber.
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This is ok in Ruger pistols and the Beretta 92/96 pistols. Check the manual, it will say if direct chamber loading is ok. Even if it is, I wouldn't make a habit out of it--after all, what are magazines for?
 
I always slingshot. Of course I'm a lefty and only have one pistol that actually has an ambi slide release so it's really a necessity, activating a left side release with the trigger finger is a little iffy. As it is, I have one action for a reload on any of my semi-autos.

Tex
 
Texfire, I'm also lefty and also slingshot. Although I have pretty much mastered the left-index-finger slide release on my CZ-75, I wouldn't trust doing it in the dark, with a rapid heartbeat, in a fight/flight response situation.

What guns have ambidextrous slide stops?
 
Slingshot or thumb-to-rear?

For those who, like me, release the slide by pulling it to the rear, do you use a true "slingshot" grip, or do you clamp your hand across the top of the rear of the slide with the thumb facing to the rear?

I do it in the latter way, because it keeps the gun tighter to my body while reloading, seems to require less rotation of the gun hand between the insertion of the mag and the slide grab, and -- most importantly -- I believe it's a stronger grip. The slide is clamped between the meaty part of the base of my palm on one side, and the ends of four fingers on the other side, as opposed to just the thumb and forefinger. I found that, after getting used to it, I was able to do a quick, simple reload this way, and it's the same with all semiautos.

Regards,
Dirty Bob
 
The agency I work for trains to use the slide release. In the event of a tactical reload hitting the slide release out of muscle memory does not cause any negative effect but slingshotting will eject a live round that could be useful in a continuing fight. A STOPPAGE clearence should include racking the slide. In the event you try to drop the slide and it doesn't work you should immedietly revert to clearing the stoppage.

Also the officer mentioned earlier wasn't killed because his slide wouldn't drop. He was killed because he took his eyes off the threat due to a lack of training and familiarity with his weapon. There is no reason he could not have conducted a reload and a stoppage clearance (when the slide didn't drop) without taking his eyes off of the bad guy. You HAVE to know you weapon with your HANDS not your eyes. You eyes must be on the threat. Chances are it wasn't his fault, just a simple lack of training. NO department trains you enough. You have to take your instruction and practice until you are proficient.
 
I want to train my body to use the same motion every time for every pistol; doesn't matter if it's an 'empty mag' stoppage or a stovepipe or any other form of malf, and I don't want it to matter that I have a 1911 in my hand or a CZ.
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I found a simple solution to this problem:

I got rid of all my non-1911 pattern autos.

:)
 
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