This is a followup to an older thread here. thought it would be getter to start a new one rather revive a 400 day old thread:
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=516575&highlight=bullpup+draco
Picked up one of the K-Var/Century AK bullpup conversion kits a while back and was considering converting an AK. Standard AK is 25" from barrel tip to the end of the receiver and adding the bullpup stock adds 1 5/8", so I would have to add about four inches to the barrel with a permanently attached extension of some sort to bring it to 30" (CA minimum for centerfire rifle with detachable mags), and I did not want to do that.
Since SBR is not an option in CA, what about putting it on a Draco (without using the stock piece)? For CA folks this is probably as close as we can get to an SBR.
Looks possible...
Remove the original pistol grip and replace the lower handguard with the new grip/trigger assembly. Add the new front and rear sight assemblies...mockup done!
First two photos below show it mocked up with a 10/30 mag and the original trigger photoshopped out. There is no way to attach the stock that comes with the kit to the Draco, so that should eliminate any SBR issues.
Legality:
You can follow the progress of another Draco bullpup pistol here: http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?...ll-pup-pistol/
Evidently there is no letter, only an email. From the link:
Here is a copy of the email that explains the ATFs position:
__________________________________________________ _______________________________________
Mr. Deyarmin,
This email is to confirm what we spoke of yesterday regarding your proposed AK bullpup pistol. As I confirmed with the ATF Firearms Technology Branch (FTB), the weapon as you described would not fall under the NFA. You stated your understanding that you would either need to purchase the Century Arms Draco AK pistol or build up a “virgin” receiver and then install the bullpup kit in order to prevent the gun from becoming an NFA type weapon.
This morning I spoke again with the FTB and requested information regarding the issuance of letters stating that a firearm does not fall under the NFA. I was told that such letters are only issued when a firearm was formerly considered to be an NFA firearm and then removed from the NFA list of firearms because of its collectible status. Please feel free to contact me with any future questions.
David M Jones- Industry Operations Investigator
Mockups
Update #1
Got this thing to the point where it is ready to test fire and will be test firing it this weekend. Replaced the missing front and rear sight parts (Allen screw, ball bearing and spring).
Finally gave up on the trigger to trigger group connecting wire that came with the kit and built my own out of a 12" bicycle spoke. Took a while to get the bends right, but it works pretty well now. Ended up having to relieve the wire holes in the trigger, trigger group and handguard to fit the spoke through.
The trigger was relieved on the inside because it was pushing up on the barrel at both ends of its travel. Also curved the corner edges of the very square trigger, but this is not shown in the trigger photos below.
Cut a channel with a big ball burr and Dremel in the right side of the handguard to make for better clearance for the connecting wire.
The trigger pin is a pretty weak design and adds some slop to the trigger pull. Have not figured out what to replace it with yet, but someday...
The lighter gray area is the clearance channel in the hard guard channel
Update #2
Finally got to shoot the gun yesterday.
Even with a new linkage, the trigger is very bad. You pull fairly hard until it fires, but its very hard to tell WHEN its going to fire so its very exciting! Hold is reasonably stable with the left hand holding the mag, but the relatively light weight (6.6 pounds) and lack of a stock to brace against the shoulder make for a pretty violent action. Most secure way to hold it is tucked inside the elbow, but then you can't use the sights. Laser time...
Lower handguard at the pistol grip needs some stock removal as the handguard slams down pretty hard against the second joint of the thumb.
Update #3
Worked a bit more on the bullpup today. Looks like the hard trigger problem has to do with the trigger to FCG linkage wire binding between the right side trigger guard rivets and the hammer pin reinforcing plate/rail. The hammer spring also binds the wire a bit.
Got into the the receiver with grinding wheels and burrs (not easy because its so deep inside the receiver) and ground down the outside half of the rivets a bit and ground a bit on bottom of the rail/hammer pin reinforcing plate so the wire does not bind. Also bent the hammer spring so it clears the linkage wire. Works much better now!
Did some more work on the finger part of the trigger so its more comfortable.
Update #4
Last minute update before the July 2 shoot. Got the Tapco gas tube rail on with a cheapo red dot and replaced the AK sling with a single point sling. Added a side rail for a laser, but its not mounted in the photo. You can also see where I reworked the grip for my smaller hands, although there is more work on the other side. Polished the hammer and hooks. Also put on the bipod (cut down Romy RPK bipod).
Shot it at 25 yards with iron sights only today (ran out of time to play with the reflex sight). This is the final target after adjusting the sight a lot. The target below (25 yards) was shot by a number of people. Need to try out the AMD-65 muzzle brake next time out
Still need to do more work around the hammer spring and the hammer as the hammer was catching on the disconnector after each shot so we would have to pull the charging handle after each shot to reset the hammer.
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=516575&highlight=bullpup+draco
Picked up one of the K-Var/Century AK bullpup conversion kits a while back and was considering converting an AK. Standard AK is 25" from barrel tip to the end of the receiver and adding the bullpup stock adds 1 5/8", so I would have to add about four inches to the barrel with a permanently attached extension of some sort to bring it to 30" (CA minimum for centerfire rifle with detachable mags), and I did not want to do that.
Since SBR is not an option in CA, what about putting it on a Draco (without using the stock piece)? For CA folks this is probably as close as we can get to an SBR.
Looks possible...
Remove the original pistol grip and replace the lower handguard with the new grip/trigger assembly. Add the new front and rear sight assemblies...mockup done!
First two photos below show it mocked up with a 10/30 mag and the original trigger photoshopped out. There is no way to attach the stock that comes with the kit to the Draco, so that should eliminate any SBR issues.
Legality:
You can follow the progress of another Draco bullpup pistol here: http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?...ll-pup-pistol/
Evidently there is no letter, only an email. From the link:
Here is a copy of the email that explains the ATFs position:
__________________________________________________ _______________________________________
Mr. Deyarmin,
This email is to confirm what we spoke of yesterday regarding your proposed AK bullpup pistol. As I confirmed with the ATF Firearms Technology Branch (FTB), the weapon as you described would not fall under the NFA. You stated your understanding that you would either need to purchase the Century Arms Draco AK pistol or build up a “virgin” receiver and then install the bullpup kit in order to prevent the gun from becoming an NFA type weapon.
This morning I spoke again with the FTB and requested information regarding the issuance of letters stating that a firearm does not fall under the NFA. I was told that such letters are only issued when a firearm was formerly considered to be an NFA firearm and then removed from the NFA list of firearms because of its collectible status. Please feel free to contact me with any future questions.
David M Jones- Industry Operations Investigator
Mockups
Update #1
Got this thing to the point where it is ready to test fire and will be test firing it this weekend. Replaced the missing front and rear sight parts (Allen screw, ball bearing and spring).
Finally gave up on the trigger to trigger group connecting wire that came with the kit and built my own out of a 12" bicycle spoke. Took a while to get the bends right, but it works pretty well now. Ended up having to relieve the wire holes in the trigger, trigger group and handguard to fit the spoke through.
The trigger was relieved on the inside because it was pushing up on the barrel at both ends of its travel. Also curved the corner edges of the very square trigger, but this is not shown in the trigger photos below.
Cut a channel with a big ball burr and Dremel in the right side of the handguard to make for better clearance for the connecting wire.
The trigger pin is a pretty weak design and adds some slop to the trigger pull. Have not figured out what to replace it with yet, but someday...
The lighter gray area is the clearance channel in the hard guard channel
Update #2
Finally got to shoot the gun yesterday.
Even with a new linkage, the trigger is very bad. You pull fairly hard until it fires, but its very hard to tell WHEN its going to fire so its very exciting! Hold is reasonably stable with the left hand holding the mag, but the relatively light weight (6.6 pounds) and lack of a stock to brace against the shoulder make for a pretty violent action. Most secure way to hold it is tucked inside the elbow, but then you can't use the sights. Laser time...
Lower handguard at the pistol grip needs some stock removal as the handguard slams down pretty hard against the second joint of the thumb.
Update #3
Worked a bit more on the bullpup today. Looks like the hard trigger problem has to do with the trigger to FCG linkage wire binding between the right side trigger guard rivets and the hammer pin reinforcing plate/rail. The hammer spring also binds the wire a bit.
Got into the the receiver with grinding wheels and burrs (not easy because its so deep inside the receiver) and ground down the outside half of the rivets a bit and ground a bit on bottom of the rail/hammer pin reinforcing plate so the wire does not bind. Also bent the hammer spring so it clears the linkage wire. Works much better now!
Did some more work on the finger part of the trigger so its more comfortable.
Update #4
Last minute update before the July 2 shoot. Got the Tapco gas tube rail on with a cheapo red dot and replaced the AK sling with a single point sling. Added a side rail for a laser, but its not mounted in the photo. You can also see where I reworked the grip for my smaller hands, although there is more work on the other side. Polished the hammer and hooks. Also put on the bipod (cut down Romy RPK bipod).
Shot it at 25 yards with iron sights only today (ran out of time to play with the reflex sight). This is the final target after adjusting the sight a lot. The target below (25 yards) was shot by a number of people. Need to try out the AMD-65 muzzle brake next time out
Still need to do more work around the hammer spring and the hammer as the hammer was catching on the disconnector after each shot so we would have to pull the charging handle after each shot to reset the hammer.
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I'm all over that... Its an EVIL, SCARY LOOKING, BLACK GUN that is legal in CA.
