For conceal carry: HK P7 vs. SA EMP?
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VA27
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Depends. 1911's should be in 45 or 38 Super. Any other caliber is an abomination and should be shunned.
If you want a 9, go with the P7, provided you've actually shot one and like it. Lots of love and lots of 'meh' for the P7, so be sure you want a P7 before you part with your hard earned bux.
If you want a 9, go with the P7, provided you've actually shot one and like it. Lots of love and lots of 'meh' for the P7, so be sure you want a P7 before you part with your hard earned bux.
harmon rabb
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Sounds like someone who hasn't handled or fired an EMP. 9mm is actually the perfect cartridge for a (slightly modified) officer's frame 1911. The EMP is incredibly sweet shooting.
Verses a P7.. well, I've never fired a P7 so I don't know.
wow6599
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Orion8472, I know you want to sell your EMP (because I want it!), but DON'T DO IT. IMHO, you have the best CCW on the market today. I just don't get the hype behind the P7. I think it and the VW Beetle are the only ugly things ever produced by Germans.
230therapy
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The EMP is awesome. More importantly, it's in production and many standard 1911 parts work with it. Add some custom grips, replace the ILS and have the trigger tuned.
EMP uberthread on the 1911 Forum:
http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=257261
EMP uberthread on the 1911 Forum:
http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=257261
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Orion8472
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wow6599 said:
You may have a good point here. I will hold off on the sale thead until I have more information. I was wanting this person's A Grade P7, but would only be able to get it by selling the EMP [not that I really want to]. Unfortunately, I'm not blessed with a lot of disposable income, so I may have to let the P7 go.
VA27
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I've never even seen one. I have a P7 and like it, so I have no interest in the EMP. I'm sure it's a wonderful piece.
The P7 is not for everyone, which is why I suggested that he shoot one first.
The crack about the caliber was me being funny. Hence the
at the end of the sentence.I feel the same way about 1911's in 40S&W as I do about 'em in 9mm.
That was me being serious. You can tell 'cause there's no
at the end.
I have both and they are very different guns.
The P7 is a much older design, but well before it's time in features and handling..if you were wiling to step outside the box. It is a much slicker package than the EMP.
The EMP's major advantage over the P7 is weight and the fact that it is still in production. The obvious advantage/disadvantage is that being based on the 1911 design, the market is over loaded with add-ons and there is no shortage of top flight gunsmith who are already doing excellent work on the platform.
Another very interesting option you might want to look at is the Kahr line. I can highly recommend the P9 (if you like polymer) or the K9 (if you'd like a steel frame). The Kahr is as sleek, well made and innovative as both of the guns you are looking at
The P7 is a much older design, but well before it's time in features and handling..if you were wiling to step outside the box. It is a much slicker package than the EMP.
The EMP's major advantage over the P7 is weight and the fact that it is still in production. The obvious advantage/disadvantage is that being based on the 1911 design, the market is over loaded with add-ons and there is no shortage of top flight gunsmith who are already doing excellent work on the platform.
Another very interesting option you might want to look at is the Kahr line. I can highly recommend the P9 (if you like polymer) or the K9 (if you'd like a steel frame). The Kahr is as sleek, well made and innovative as both of the guns you are looking at
usp9
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... or the Kahr TP9 or T9, which are the 8+1 equivalent to the P7 or EMP. The T9 is almost exactly the same size and weight as the P7 and also has the same 4" barrel.
Lots of good options in this sized CCW. I'd be happy with most any gun mentioned in the thread. Personal choices, not quality or reliability, are the questions to be answered, and that's a good thing.
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Orion8472
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For a cheap option, . . . what about the Kel Tec PF9? Is it a "love/hate" relationship with this pistol? I like the looks of it, especially some of the cerekote colors, and the price is quite affordable.
I DO like the Kahr, but they can be a bit pricey, even the cheapest model. Nice triggers, though! . . . . For DAO. I'm just considering something like this, over the EMP, because of the issue with "IF I had to respond very quickly, would I fumble on the thumb safety". Of course, . . . . . training, training, training.
I DO like the Kahr, but they can be a bit pricey, even the cheapest model. Nice triggers, though! . . . . For DAO. I'm just considering something like this, over the EMP, because of the issue with "IF I had to respond very quickly, would I fumble on the thumb safety". Of course, . . . . . training, training, training.
wow6599
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Nah.....the cheapest I can think of is the CW line, and they run about $350 +/-. Besides, you're talking about your EMP and an HK P7.......and now a Kel-Tec?
Madcap_Magician
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They're very different guns. The P7 is a great gun... accurate, great trigger because it's effectively SAO. Well made. But parts are hard to come by, it's not the easiest gun to disassemble/reassemble, and subjectively, I felt like its operating system made it recoil more than any comparable-weight 9mm guns.
I have not fired the EMP, but have been lusting after one for some time.
I have not fired the EMP, but have been lusting after one for some time.
You can get any part you want from HK or send it in to HK to be repaired. Also, the gas system self compensates for the relative power of the round. I find both my P7's among the most soft shooting centerfire guns I own. The felet recoil also comes straight back due to the low bore axis. The recoil impulse is really nice and allows for quick follow up shots.
Maybe the one you shot had a clogged gas port???
Zerodefect
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Is the EMP narrower than a CCO 1911 or something? Just wondering what the hubbub is, about that particular gun.
The HK p7 and psp are the best weapons HK has ever made IMO. Takes a while to get used to squeezing them. I think a CCO style 1911 still suits me better, but the HK's are one heck of a good pistol.
The HK p7 and psp are the best weapons HK has ever made IMO. Takes a while to get used to squeezing them. I think a CCO style 1911 still suits me better, but the HK's are one heck of a good pistol.
The P7 is a fantastic weapon and one of the best shooting weapons ever produced. However it is large in the handle and wouldn't be as good of a carry weapon as the EMP in my opinion. The H&K is thin so its easy to conceal but it requires a larger and wider holster to stabilize its small presence in the holster when carried IWB. The squeeze cocker also means it has to rid a little higheso you can get a grip on it. If you put the EMP and the H&K in similar holsters you would find the EMP much more comfortable and secure to carry.
harmon rabb
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It's not thinner than a CCO 1911, but the circumference of the grip is less and the reach to the trigger is shorter. The EMP is a 1911 shrunk down to match the OAL of 9mm. Some parts to it are unique, some parts are standard 1911.
Really, unless you have very small hands, there isn't much difference in the handling or feel of the EMP over a standard officer's frame 1911. The real difference is that 9mm just feels "right" for an aluminum officer's frame 1911 -- it doesn't feel like a small gun shooting a caliber that's too large for it. It feels perfectly matched.
rellascout
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I would trade my HK P7 for a EMP in 9mm. LOL Hint Hint....
The HK P7 is a great gun. It has a cult following which it has rightfully earned. IMHO there are much better carry guns. The weight and balance of the P7 makes the gun move a lot in a holster. Your belt and your holster need to be rock solid or you will feel movement. It is heavier than it needs to be.
It is a accurate gun and fun to shoot but in then not one of my favorite 9mms.
The HK P7 is a great gun. It has a cult following which it has rightfully earned. IMHO there are much better carry guns. The weight and balance of the P7 makes the gun move a lot in a holster. Your belt and your holster need to be rock solid or you will feel movement. It is heavier than it needs to be.
It is a accurate gun and fun to shoot but in then not one of my favorite 9mms.
For a cheap option (about half that of your choices), I don't think i would go below a Kahr for reliable carry...the CW9 is quite a deal now as prices have fallen with the introduction of the CM9Orion8472 said:
How much easier could it be to disassemble a P7, than to press a button, pull the slide to the rear, lift and take it off to the front?Madcap_Magician said:
It isn't any narrower, the hubbub of the EMP, over a gun like the CCO, is the shorter barrel without the inherent reduced realiability of shorter barrel guns based on the .45ACP length actionZerodefect said:
The P7's short slide ( the barrel is a full 4") and heavy butt do need to be taken into consideration when making a holster selection.jon_in_wv said:
Before his passing, I had a chance to correspond with Lou Alessi about a holster for a P7. His recommendation for a OWB holster (I don't do IWB due to L3/L4 problems) was his CQC/s...for it's higher ride (more cant) and widely spaced belt loops to spread out the weight of the gun on the belt
rellascout
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I agree with that. I have found that OWB keep the P7 in the right place better than IWB.
Which P7?
There are several variants. The PSP with the heel clip mag release might be skinny but it takes both hands to eject a magazine.
The M-8 changes this out for a more traditional style release you can use with one hand but its a little heavier.
They work like no other gun you'll own. It takes practice and a lot of it to learn its unique 'manual of arms' if you are used to something else. They are accurate and superbly made.
The EMP works like every other 1911 ever made, it's just scaled down in size.
There are several variants. The PSP with the heel clip mag release might be skinny but it takes both hands to eject a magazine.
The M-8 changes this out for a more traditional style release you can use with one hand but its a little heavier.
They work like no other gun you'll own. It takes practice and a lot of it to learn its unique 'manual of arms' if you are used to something else. They are accurate and superbly made.
The EMP works like every other 1911 ever made, it's just scaled down in size.
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I have both. Both are exceptional firearms. The HK is a bit 'handle heavy' and carries somewhat awkwardly in anything but a perfect holster.
The EMP is well balanced and carries a few more bullets, has a safety, and a 1911 trigger.
When I carry a 9mm, it's usually the EMP or my G26 or Kahr pm9. None of the pistols i've mentioned here have ever failed.
The EMP is well balanced and carries a few more bullets, has a safety, and a 1911 trigger.
When I carry a 9mm, it's usually the EMP or my G26 or Kahr pm9. None of the pistols i've mentioned here have ever failed.
My personal preference is the PSP with the original heel release. It's lower sights, smaller trigger guard, and recessed striker collar just make it a neater package to my way of thinking (I have carried both as duty guns)...I've never been a fan of the changes made for the NJSP.
The heel release does take a different technique. It is much like the motions used in an IDPA Mag Change with Retention. I should point out that the heel release is just about the fastest ever used...nod to the original Beretta 92...as it is pressed forward rather than backward. It uses a milking motion
usp9
Member
The P7 to P7M8 modifications were made for the U.S. Army pistol trials. New Jersey just reaped the benefits.
I thought the model submitted for the military trials was the M13...since increased capacity over the 1911 was one of the requirements
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