Found my perfect optic. Now it's discontinued.

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Trey Veston

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I built an AR-10 in .308 for a SHTF battle rifle and tried a couple of different optics on it and finally used the Nikon P-Tactical .300 Blk 2x7 scope. Perfect! Great size, magnification, clarity, and BDC marks were just fine for the .308 loads I was using.

That was just a few months ago.

Then, a couple of weeks ago, I ordered a new Ruger American Predator rifle in .308 that was going to be my SHTFall-around beater rifle for hunting/sniping duty from 50 yards to 500+ yards.

Went to order another Nikon P-Tactical .300 BLK scope for it and they are gone. Completely sold out on every online site.

So, what is comparable? Compact, light, BDC reticle, clear, good quality, and $200 or less? Won't buy Vortex after my very first Vortex product failed out of the box and it took them a month to replace it with no apology. Screw them.
 
Trey I too have a couple horror stories regarding Vortex scopes. Scopro Optical Co. makes them in Philippines. Google map them on street view, an eye opener.
Spend the $ and buy an Elcan scope, you won't be disappointed. For less $ Leupold are good scopes.
 
I applaud your drive to standardize your optics where possible.

Remember, "currently unavailable" or "out of stock" does not mean gone. I would hold to your plan and wait the supply out.

Just last night I was very surprised to find an otherwise very common percussion gone sold out across the country.

Such are the times we're living in. Some market constriction is due to the Covids and some due to the Politicos. Either way, percussion rifles to shingles, most everything's at least tight just now.

I see Savage had a press-release about being unable to ship a particular rifle package due to unavailability of a specific "Asian Optic".

Todd.
 
Won't buy Vortex after my very first Vortex product failed out of the box and it took them a month to replace it with no apology.
Wow, that's just terrible. :confused:


Remember, "currently unavailable" or "out of stock" does not mean gone. I would hold to your plan and wait the supply out.
In the case of Nikon rifle scopes, it absolutely means gone.
 
I have a Bushnell AR scope. It has alot of features and isn't bad. Not a Leupold as far as clarity but being a cheapskate I would call it decent and usable. I liked Weavers but they are gone too. Burris scopes are very good for the money too. If I buy any more scopes they will be Leupold or better. I think I am cured of being a cheapskate.
 
I too have a Bushnell on my 18" heavy barrel AR and can shoot 1/2" groups with it. Bushnell has just renamed all their scope lines. Bushnell has a better warranty than Vortex. I had a Viper PST 24x that began shooting 9" off zero. Took over 3 months to return, supposedly repaired. I saw a finger smear of glue looking in the front of the scope. Didn't take 60 rounds of .223 to dislodge it again and it shot many inches off zero. Sent back and took months and arguing. I offered to pay extra so they could send me an upgraded scope since the Viper I had was discontinued. The answer was "we can't at this time", and I said what time is good???
They sent another new discontinued Viper PST to me that I quickly sold online for a loss of a few $100 bucks. Who wants to spend time sighting in a rifle to have another scope fail, send it back and wait months??? The main supplier here in Canada is a guy that first and still does sell bird feed. So just a salesman that decided to sell something he knows nothing about. The $ from the sale of the Viper bought me a good Leupold 24x and have had NO issues with it.
 
In the last issue of the Natchez Shooters Supply catalog I received, they were listing 33 Nikon scopes priced up to 60% off (which included Nikon's lifetime warranty on their scopes not containing electronic components). I don't know how many they might have left.
 
I've never been one to buy expensive scopes until I saw an Elcan Specter 4x on sale $1400 all in and I wanted a good one for my AR. One of the best AR scopes you can have. It can quickly clip onto any Weaver base. Once you buy one good scope you will not look back. I sold a couple guns to fund the scope, well worth it.
 
which included Nikon's lifetime warranty on their scopes not containing electronic components).

That lifetime warranty means they will replace it with another Nikon product of similar value. But you won't get another scope, nor will you get that one repaired. If you have a $200 Nikon scope you'll get to pick from a $200 set of binoculars or camera gear.

Nikon hasn't made new scopes in a while, but there are some still in the store rooms at several retailers. Which isn't unusual. I've bought new guns that were 10 years old, but had never been sold.
 
Vortex has gone through some QC issues lately. I dont know what happened either. I got my Viper HST prior to this new wave of issues and i am glad i did.

Vortex made a name for itself by selling quality affordable scopes with a lifetime warranty and as of recent is destroying it. I hope they get it together soon.
 
Vortex has gone through some QC issues lately. I dont know what happened either. I got my Viper HST prior to this new wave of issues and i am glad i did.

Vortex made a name for itself by selling quality affordable scopes with a lifetime warranty and as of recent is destroying it. I hope they get it together soon.
they are cutting costs to maximize profit. They essentially said "we used to put $100 into a scope we sell for $200. Now that we're an established brand, If we reduce the quality of our components and decrease our QC, we can put $70 into a scope we can still sell for $200, and most people won't be able to tell the difference! Bob, get me the Learjet catalogue!"
 
I've never been one to buy expensive scopes until I saw an Elcan Specter 4x on sale $1400 all in and I wanted a good one for my AR. One of the best AR scopes you can have. It can quickly clip onto any Weaver base. Once you buy one good scope you will not look back. I sold a couple guns to fund the scope, well worth it.
I'm intentionally avoiding the Elcan altogether. The temptation might be more strain than I can bear. ;)
 
they are cutting costs to maximize profit. They essentially said "we used to put $100 into a scope we sell for $200. Now that we're an established brand, If we reduce the quality of our components and decrease our QC, we can put $70 into a scope we can still sell for $200, and most people won't be able to tell the difference! Bob, get me the Learjet catalogue!"
That may very well be the case.

I havent done enough research to see if its just certain models or all of them. Or even if they are working to fix the problems. But i have seen enough issues to cause me to pull back and rethink buying another one. As far as i can tell it started around or a little before Covid.


Some of their higher end scopes had glass from Japan of my resources are correct. Much better than the Chinese lenses. I have come to understand that Japan makes some decent lenses. Not as good as whats being made by companies like Zeiss in that part of the world but a good second best. Maybe that has changed too.

Speaking of China, it is a crazy backwards communist country that does things with profit in mind. Nothing else. Even though some companies there are more in tune to customers and heed advice it is rare. All too often many brands come from the same places with varying degrees of quality.

Its funny how they refuse to adopt the same way of thinking as the other countries who produce higher quality products to be more competitive on the global market. Instead it's make it look pretty as quick and as cheap as possible without reguard for quality.

They are also quick to copy things with little to no reguard for Patents. They are good at making cheap clones of much lesser quality. Even going as far as using the brand name of the very thing they copied like Leuopold.

Too be honest they look at sales as a measurement for how they are doing and the consumers are ignorant enough to play along. It all adds up to a false sense of meeting demand from their perspective. I like to refer to Chinese products as the disposable choice.

Crazy fact. There was a set of cheap digital brand scales that used to be on Amazon and Ebay. They had some decent electronics in them and they worked very well. I forget the name though i have one of them on my bench. Anyway the scale became popular and part of the reason i boughg it. Not long after the price started skyrocketing. In jless than a year they were not even the same product.

A guy on youtube pulled one of the old ones apart and the new ones with the same name and model. Totally different electronics. The Chinese figured out that there was a profit to be made and ran with the brand until people figured oug it wasnt the same. It is what they do all the time.

Several chinese brands are the same way. Start out decent for what they are and as soon as the brand gets popular the quality changes.

All of this leads me to beleive they see us as trenders that buy brands and then get tired of it and move on. So they look to maximize profit by creating their own chinese brands and then cut quality and ride the wave. Over and over again.

What can I say. People are suckers for cheap/cheaper products.
 
That may very well be the case.

I havent done enough research to see if its just certain models or all of them. Or even if they are working to fix the problems. But i have seen enough issues to cause me to pull back and rethink buying another one. As far as i can tell it started around or a little before Covid..........

What can I say. People are suckers for cheap/cheaper products.

I ran into this guy https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCWL2TQa6Ug_qqj36AgPp2XA one day at my local range, and we got to talking scopes for a long time. If you believe what he has to say, he was pretty down on vortex scopes. he is the one that told me about the cost cutting at vortex, and he was telling me about their rate of return, and it was WAY higher than other manufacturers. I asked him what he thought the best value in scopes were right now, (over a year ago) and he said black hound, arkan, and primary arms.

he said that's kind of the pattern he sees with new companies. Start offering high value, build a reputation, then start back-sliding. He predicted the same thing would happen to athlon.
 
China does not obey copyright or patents. They make fake Zeiss scopes that are on EBay.
Vortex made by Scopro Optical Co. https://matchory.com/supplier/scopro-optical. Note the other companies they supply for. This is why we get cheap Nikons, Bushnell etc. Some brands just charge more for the same inexpensive scope. Really have to do your research.
 
I ran into this guy https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCWL2TQa6Ug_qqj36AgPp2XA one day at my local range, and we got to talking scopes for a long time. If you believe what he has to say, he was pretty down on vortex scopes. he is the one that told me about the cost cutting at vortex, and he was telling me about their rate of return, and it was WAY higher than other manufacturers. I asked him what he thought the best value in scopes were right now, (over a year ago) and he said black hound, arkan, and primary arms.

he said that's kind of the pattern he sees with new companies. Start offering high value, build a reputation, then start back-sliding. He predicted the same thing would happen to athlon.

That's why dealers push Vortex hard. I've owned a few before I learned better. Any but their top of the line scopes are made very inexpensively. $1200 Viper scope failing on a .223 rifle in under 100 rds. They add features higher end scopes have to justify the hype. They spend plenty on advertising but not on the product.
All you can do is shop smart and avoid bad purchases.
 
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