Found some handgun powder today

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joneb

joneb

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:) I was at the local Sportsman warehouse and found a lbs of each, W-231, BE-86 and 2400 :D I was mostly surprised by the W-231 as I have not seen it on the shelf for many years.
I was torn, there were two one pound containers of W-231 and one 1lbs of BE-86. So now I have a lb of BE-86 and little data :(
I load and shoot a lot of plated and cast lead for 380 acp, 9x18 Mak, 38spl, 357 mag, 44spl, and 45acp and Alliant's data is limited.
Any help and experience would be appreciated.
For .380 100gr xtreme plated FP
9x18 Mak 95gr HC LRN
38 spl/ 357 mag 158gr LSWC and 158gr plated
44 spl 200gr Lead and plated and JHP
45 acp 200gr LTC and plated RN and 185gr JHP
I had a tuff time with the search feature here :confused: Sorry.
 
I load BE-86 in .357 with 140 gr MBC coated Zingers. I did not have data. I had to work a load up from 158 gr data.
 
I would suggest you go online to the Alliant website and ask your questions under the "ASK THE EXPERTS" button. It may take a few weeks to get an answer but they should get you one eventually.

You can use the 200gr LSWC data for your LTC bullet found on the Alliants products link for B-86 powder. Remember Alliant only lists max loads so you have to calculate the 10% reduction for the start load.
 
When loading for my Mak if I didn't have Mak data I usually started about the middle of the .380 charge range and worked up.
I usually ended up a bit above the MAX listed .380 charge by about .1 or .2 but that was just my pistol, the powders and bullets I was using, others may be different.

Alliant has just released the 2015 guide. Download it and take a look.
(no Mak data though)
 
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here were two one pound containers of W-231 and one 1lbs of BE-86.
Click to expand...
I have W231 so I would have bought some BE-86. If I were you, assuming you did not have any W231, I would have bought a pound f both.
 
Not much Mak data out there. I did find some on the net using Bullseye I think but I have that.
 
Standard disclaimer - my results from my loads, my gun, my reloading equipment. Your results can and probably will be different. Start low and work up.

On edit: data for BE86

For 380 Xtreme 100 plated, I seated to 0.955" COL and tried charges of 3.4, 3.5 and 3.6gn.

3.4 - 724fps
3.5 - 732fps
3.6 - 757fps

These were from a standard Bersa Thunder 380. The 3.5 load seemed the best for accuracy and recoil.

For 38spl Xtreme 158 SWC plated, seated to cannelure:

4.2 - 696fps
4.4 - 709fps
4.6 - 750fps

These were from a Ruger GP100 5" barrel. The 4.6gn was the best for accuracy.

For 357mag Xtreme 158 SWC plated, seated to cannelure:

7.2 - 1011 fps
7.4 - 1066 fps
7.6 - 1090 fps

Same GP100. The above were with CCI500 primers. 7.6 was the best accuracy, and is my pet load for moderate recoil plinking 357 loads. Note that the recommended velocity limit for this bullet is 1200fps. If you have a longer barrel, this may be an issue.

45acp, Xtreme plated 200 HP, seated 1.245", Win large primer:

6.5 - 773 fps
6.7 - 800 fps

Shot from Witness 4.5" barrel. 6.7 was most accurate. While I have not tried the 200 RN yet, it is within 0.002" of the same bullet length as the HP, so I would expect very close to the same results.
 
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Thanks Toprudder, This is very useful info :)
I loaded five of each for 357 mag. using 158gr Xtreme plated RNFP with WSP and ran them through a Ruger Security Six w/a 2.75" barrel.
BE-86 7.3gr 3.5" group @ 15yds taper crimped, bullet pull on the last round was .009"
BE-86 7.6gr 2" group @ 15yds taper crimped, bullet pull on the last round was .01"
I had 357 cases ready to load so I tried the BE-86, this may be worth pursuing.
My main focus with this powder will be for 9x18 mak, 380acp 45acp and 44spl.
 
Walkalong
I have W231 so I would have bought some BE-86. If I were you, assuming you did not have any W231
Click to expand...
I had about 1/2 lb of 231, I will guess by leaving one on the shelf someone was very happy.
 
I would like to try the BE-86 in 44 spl. with 205gr LTCFP these are Penn target grade bullets. I have no clue for a start load :confused: My best WAG is 6.2gr of BE-86 with standard lg primers, what say you?
I sent a message to Alliant but that could take awhile.
 
SARuger said:
231 is easy to find here but 2400, h110, and unique are like hens teeth......
Click to expand...
8lb h110 Kegs in stock at powdervalley for $148. W296 for $150/8 or $20/lb. im sure plenty of other online outlets have it as well, pv was just the first i checked. Buy 8lb and its likely cheaper than anywhere locally after shipping and hazmat.
 
I tried BE-86 in 44spl with 205gr Penn LTCPB and GM 150. My guessimation of 6.5gr of BE-86 was pretty dang close I think ?
3" barrel
W-W brass, trim 1.148"
Av Vel. 779 fps
ES 21.23
SD 7.81
This load shot a 1.75" group at 15yrds.
I may pursue BE-86 in 44 spl but W-231 will be hard to beat.
 
In the small amount of testing I did with HP38 in 38spl, I did not get as low a SD with it as I do with BE86. I think BE86 is less position sensitive than HP38/W231. I may go back and play with HP38 some more, though.
 
In the small amount of testing I did with HP38 in 38spl, I did not get as low a SD with it as I do with BE86
Click to expand...
I find the best numbers do not always equal the best accuracy.
In my experience Bullseye and W-231 work well in 38spl, and W-231 and Accurate #5 work wel in 44spl, I'm not sayin there aren't better combinations.
 
joneb said:
I find the best numbers do not always equal the best accuracy.
In my experience Bullseye and W-231 work well in 38spl, and W-231 and Accurate #5 work wel in 44spl, I'm not sayin there aren't better combinations.
Click to expand...

True. I did not get the greatest SD with AA#5 in 45acp, but very good accuracy.

I tried HP38 in 38spl when I was first getting into reloading and had just gotten my chrono. I did not do serious accuracy testing at that time. I have since learned the error of my ways. :eek:
 
BE-86 very nice so far

I finally found a pound of BE-86 last week at the Sportsman's Warehouse and just tried it out. Great powder for 9mm.
Lee TL356-124-2R powder coated and sized to 0.356" loaded to where the top band is flush with the case rim (1.110" COL). These were not hand weighed, I simply adjusted my LnL AP powder measure and cranked out rounds progressively

Stock 5" Beretta 92FS
4.8g
Ave MV = 1112 fps
Ex Spread = 44 fps
StDev = 13.2 fps
Quickload difference from Herco data = 0.43%

5.0g
Ave MV = 1140 fps
Ex Spread = 62 fps
StDev = 16.8 fps
Quickload difference from Herco data = 0.70%

5.2g
Ave MV = 1185 fps
Ex Spread = 41 fps
StDev = 11.1 fps
Quickload difference from Herco data = 0.18%

All rounds ejected briskly and shot very well (no cases to the face or landing on top of my head). As for recoil, hey it's 9mm in a metal gun, what recoil?

In Quickload, Herco is right between Unique and Power Pistol in burn characteristics so for mid range loads, it looks like it would be a good predictor which is what Alliant used to say (right between Unique and Power Pistol).

I think that if you stay conservative, you will be safe to start with a mid-range Unique load for your cartridge and work up/down from there.

Now, if I can only trade my newly bought 8# jug of Titegroup for some more BE-86
:cuss:
 
Now, if I can only trade my newly bought 8# jug of Titegroup for some more BE-86
Click to expand...
If you add your location you would increase the odds of getting rid of it.
I have a lb of Titegroup and have yet to find a good use for it, the similar powders I have do a better job.
 
If you add your location you would increase the odds of getting rid of it.
I have a lb of Titegroup and have yet to find a good use for it, the similar powders I have do a better job.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the reminder. I have it on other boards, I guess I simply didn't do it here.

Sacramento, CA

I know a lot of shooter's use it but I have a couple of fears about it.
1. It is extremely dense and double charges are tougher to spot vs. Unique which virtually overflows on a double charge.

2. Load data shows that it reaches max pressures at fairly low velocities although conventional indicators of pressure (sooty vs non-sooty cases) indicate that "max pressure" loads are still not quite up there in pressure.

Because of this I am not comfortable loading 9mm 120 and 124g bullets above 4.2g even though they are down in the "wimpy" range for 9mm. I'm not into the "macho" thing in trying to get max velocity, I'm just trying to get enough PF to get a nice crisp ejection without having to goof around with weaker springs etc. Unique (unobtanium), BE-86 and 20/28 have so far been able to get me this velocity without going over pressure.

My 1# test bottle of Titegroup has worked OK with light to medium loads in 38/40/45 and barely adequate 9mm loads as well as 12 gauge slugs. I know it is the cannister version of Nitro 27 loads but I load 3/4 oz 12 gauge target loads for skeet and Titegroup is just a little too slow for that so if I could trade it for something slower like Unique, 20/28 or BE-86 or faster like Clays/Titewad/Extra Lite, I'd do it in a New York minute.
 
Thanks Toprudder,
Your data for 45 acp with BE-86 really helped :)
I loaded 7 of each with 200 gr Xtreme plated RN with GM 150 in Win. brass with a COL of 1.263", 6.7gr of BE-86 gave a 3" group at 15 yrds.
6.9gr of BE-86 gave me a 1.5" group from a Remington R-1 commander That's quite a difference in 2/10ths of a grain :confused:
6.7gr BE-86
L=814
H=871
AV=857
ES=57.01
SD=20.27
6.9gr BE-86
L=862
H=908
AV=893
ES=45.6
SD=14.4
How far can I work this one up? I will try 7.0gr and 7.1gr next.
 
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