Gun Prices - Are They Justified?

Thomasss said:
What should a no dash S&W 586 Nickel 6 inch be selling for???
Just curious.
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I don't watch the nickle guns very closely and didn't have any idea about how they're selling, so your post made me curious. A quick look on closed GB auctions indicate they can range a good bit. Here's an apparently super-nice one with box and all. It brought about $1700 when someone snatched it up at the BIN price, so this might not be a real test of what it would have brought if the bidding had gone on. Looks like two guys ran it from 1000 to $1600, then the 3rd guy clicked BIN.
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/982090435

Another apparently nice one (no lock, not sure if it's a no-dash version), but without the box and all, brought $1000.
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/982849011

A nice-looking no-dash with aftermarket grips at $754.
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/982849011

One that looks to perhaps have been shot a little more, but still very nice with box at $1025.
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/976289435

And there are some others that sold in the $850-$900 range.
 
This discussion reminds of a Seecamp, when those were rare and there were little alternatives. A dealer had one for $800. It didn't move for years, then other small 380s arrived. Oops, he lowered it a little at each show, till it was down quite a bit. I don't know what he got it for but he could have sold it for $600 right away - made about $200 bucks, IIRC the company's wholesale price. Instead, the value just dwindled away. You have to move merchandise. If it sits, you lose.
 
So if a gun is listed in an LGS for $500 and it doesn't sell, then it gets listed on Gunbroker and sells for $1000,
What is the value of the gun?
 
Value is psychological. What value had gold on the deck of the Titanic vs. a life preserver? Sunk costs, perhaps?
 
Hard to say. Most new firearms have increased in price far beyond my comfort zone. Probably because I remember what I used to pay for them and over a 20 year period my income didn't keep pace with the higher prices. In that regard the prices weren't justified, for me anyway. Regardless of the cost to manufacture a firearm, the average wage earner/consumer can't keep up. But that can be said about many products on the market these days.

Used firearms just follow the new firearm market. Higher prices can be realized if new prices keep going up. I've been out of the market for new firearms for 10 years at least.
 
I'm going to say "probably not" but I'm a dinosaur so what do I know? Once you get over the sticker shock and figure inflation, supply train issues, labor shortages, ect, maybe the price makes more sense. Or maybe not.............?
 
CoalTrain49 said:
If a tree falls in the woods and there is no one there to hear it, does it make a sound?
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Its a fair question, since we are talking about value as a set number or fairly small range....but I see that all the time, and I capitalize on it all the time.
Take the pre-war Winchester 94 I just bought for $700 at a LGS. If its worth "whatever I paid for it" because the LGS doesn't know how to price guns, is it worth the $700 I paid for it, or the $1200 +/- I could get at an online auction for it?
 
Justice comes back to one’s personal values. A price will be justified for one person and not for another person. Attempts to “approach this logically” are misdirected. Things happen without our permission and that’s always tough to accept which is why I pray to God.
 
I think supply and demand has been a factor .The massive inflation that is going on has driven everything up and after the debt bill they just passed thing are going to get worse.
 
silicosys4 said:
So if a gun is listed in an LGS for $500 and it doesn't sell, then it gets listed on Gunbroker and sells for $1000,
What is the value of the gun?
Click to expand...


Kind of depends.. i.e. a early gen Glock in Mass is worth a ton more than in a “free state”. GB doesn’t differentiate.
 
Cost to make and distribute, supply/demand, features, specs, reviews, etc. There's all that and more...sales, marketing, and pricing for any product is complex.
 
Recently bought a Shield Plus for $399 and put together a PSA AR for roughly $450 both of which I thought was a good deal but as look through the dealer's stock in the rack there are some things that no way will I ever pay that price until they come to their senses --- sort of what I've been observing is that there are a lot of lookers and not many buyers----I can just wait them out as I'm in no big hurry so we'll see how long it takes them to come back to reality.

Same with vehicles---I've been wanting a new truck but I'll wait them out too----prices are already coming down.
 
Thomasss said:
His price has stayed the same. The free market possibly does set the price. There is a lot of lookers, but no one is buying.
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That's it right there. No one buying? Price is too high. Sold out in minutes? Price was too low.
 
dweis said:
I think the cost of most guns is reasonable and has been so over years except than shortages happen like during Covid. I recently bought. Ruger Security 380 with an extra 15 round magazine. Cost me $375, and will last for decades. On the other hand I bought a 12 ounce cup if coffee at Dunkin Donuts, and it cost $139. It lasts for about an hour. If I do that every day of the year it comes out to $507 a year or $5,070 a decade. I like my pistol. I’ll give up the coffee.
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People could fund their retirements with what they spend at coffee shops. Or, for that matter, at ammo shops.
 
silicosys4 said:
Its a fair question, since we are talking about value as a set number or fairly small range....but I see that all the time, and I capitalize on it all the time.
Take the pre-war Winchester 94 I just bought for $700 at a LGS. If its worth "whatever I paid for it" because the LGS doesn't know how to price guns, is it worth the $700 I paid for it, or the $1200 +/- I could get at an online auction for it?
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I'm sure the LGS knows how to buy and sell firearms. If they didn't they wouldn't stay in business very long.

The LGS sold the gun for what they needed to sell it for to realize the profit they needed. It was fair market value at the time and place where it was sold. I'm sure the LGS dealer knows about selling online.

There's a lot of overhead (expense) for people selling online. The LGS's over-the-counter price will be less because of that. Time is money.
 
silicosys4 said:
So if a gun is listed in an LGS for $500 and it doesn't sell, then it gets listed on Gunbroker and sells for $1000,
What is the value of the gun?
Click to expand...

The 4Ps of marketing- product, price, place, promotion. Place is important. That gun might not have demand in one area, but there might be someplace in the country where it is more valuable.

Or it's promoted to more people. Maybe it doesn't have exposure in the shop as when it goes on Gunbroker. If the shop has 300 people a week coming through the store, and a thousand people see it on Gunbroker, you might get a better price on Gunbroker.

Or it's promoted in a way that gets the best price for the gun. Winner's curse. An auction is a contest to determine who is the biggest sucker.

What is the item's real value? Whatever someone paid for it. The item in your post is worth less than $500 in your LGS, and worth $1000 on Gunbroker. Just like your car is worth more in a private party sale than as a trade in at a dealer.
 
silicosys4 said:
So if a gun is listed in an LGS for $500 and it doesn't sell, then it gets listed on Gunbroker and sells for $1000,
What is the value of the gun?
Click to expand...

Value is subjective.
To the people that saw it and passed for $500, it was less valuable to them than 5 one hundred dollar bills.
To the guy that bought it for $1000 it’s value was at lest $1000.
 
CoalTrain49 said:
I'm sure the LGS knows how to buy and sell firearms. If they didn't they wouldn't stay in business very long.

The LGS sold the gun for what they needed to sell it for to realize the profit they needed. It was fair market value at the time and place where it was sold. I'm sure the LGS dealer knows about selling online.

There's a lot of overhead (expense) for people selling online. The LGS's over-the-counter price will be less because of that. Time is money.
Click to expand...

wayneinFL said:
The 4Ps of marketing- product, price, place, promotion. Place is important. That gun might not have demand in one area, but there might be someplace in the country where it is more valuable.

Or it's promoted to more people. Maybe it doesn't have exposure in the shop as when it goes on Gunbroker. If the shop has 300 people a week coming through the store, and a thousand people see it on Gunbroker, you might get a better price on Gunbroker.

Or it's promoted in a way that gets the best price for the gun. Winner's curse. An auction is a contest to determine who is the biggest sucker.

What is the item's real value? Whatever someone paid for it. The item in your post is worth less than $500 in your LGS, and worth $1000 on Gunbroker. Just like your car is worth more in a private party sale than as a trade in at a dealer.
Click to expand...

DeepSouth said:
Value is subjective.
To the people that saw it and passed for $500, it was less valuable to them than 5 one hundred dollar bills.
To the guy that bought it for $1000 it’s value was at lest $1000.
Click to expand...

I would have to disagree with all the above. If it doesn't sell for $500 in a LGS but it does for $1000 online, it doesn't mean the gun is worth different things at different times, or even to different people.
The value is the maximum amount the market will reasonably bear, not what one person or one shop is able to pay or sell the gun for, and the market will reasonably bear $1000.
If one particular person isn't willing to pay $500 but another person is willing to pay $1000, the market doesn't change, simply your ability or interest in maximizing your market potential.
If you sell a gun for $500 because thats what one shop or person will pay, you aren't realizing market value if you can sell the gun for double by other means...you are simply choosing not to pursue the means by which you will realize the full market value.
 
Its not that gun prices are high, its the fact that your money is almost worthless. Using an inflation calculator a Ruger single six sold for $57 in 1955. (I think that is correct). And now the price for one should be in the $645 range per the calculator. And that is close to what the street price for one of those is now. In 1955 they only came with one cylinder. Now they come with two cylinders.

There are guns I just can't justify paying the asking price for. I have now grown an interest in AR-15s. I just built my first from a PSA upper and added three lowers to the order along with a carry handle. The cost was just over $600. That was fair and I have two lowers to build two more guns if I want. I can't justify $2000 or more for a top shelf AR like a Daniel Defense or other maker. Maybe if it was all I shot and I was competing with it but not for just the casual use I will put mine to.

I have around 60-70 firearms and am thankful I have what I have and the components to keep them shooting. My sons can be glad about what they will inherit when I croak.

I did cave and bought a Henry 22 mag lever action and the total cost was around $550 from Buds. Now I am on Henry's email list and they keep sending me emails about all the money they donate to different causes. One donation was $200,000. It makes me wonder how much they could lower their gun prices if they stopped giving away money and guns? They have nice guns and they really charge a lot for them. Enough that I doubt I will buy anymore of them.
 
Yeah - it's so much easier to just not buy something when you were around to pay yesterday's prices. Or you have everything you ever needed and can just take a pass.

Especially when it essentially will last a lifetime with reasonable care.


For those that weren't/don't - guess what?
 
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I've kind of discovered that unless you are buying really expensive guns, the cost of the gun isn't what stings, it's the cost of ammo. I recall shooting sessions as recently as 6-8 years ago
where I'd take a friend or relative out and together, we'd shoot two or three thousand rounds in a day through 5-10 guns. Doing so today would cost me a fortune, even with reloaded rounds.
When I go to the range now, it's much more typically 100-200 rounds because it's literally all I can afford.

I like C&Rs and C&R prices have skyrocketed since 2012 when I first began. I used to love $89 Mosin 91/30s, $300 for a nice Enfield and a $199 SKS from J&G. All of those guns now cost at least
double or triple what they cost just ten years ago and that is sad. But my Glock 17, ten years ago was maybe $399 and today it's $549. That is a lot more but not out of line with the cost of everything else.
 
True - ammo is your big-picture cost to be sure, but I think what really "stings" is knowing what something used to go for. That's my main point.


If you know what a 1970's-era K-22 went for in the store back then, and what they go for now, you might balk at today's price. If you aren't old enough and the only price you know is what you see today, then you will just open your wallet and pay and there is no "sting" involved whatsoever. At least no sting of what the price once was. You can't miss out on a price you were never around for.
 
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