Has anyone reverse engineered Frankford case solution?

[BigMacMI]

I got the 30# F.A.R.T. I have run probably 6 batches of cases through thus far. Using Armoral Wash n Wax for soap, and Lemishine powder.

I have been experimenting with times and volume of Lemi. From 1-4 45ACP cases worth.

Everything has been coming out really dull (one batch was too long I think because it turned an olive color).

Cases are clean enough to reload and shoot, but not very shiny.

I did just finish a batch of .223 which I used the small packet of solution that F.A. sends as a sample with the FART. Super shiny and clean. Leads me to believe that it is more of a solution issue in my mix.

Problem is, I only have 1 more batch of dirty brass to run (unless i can re-run some of the dull ones to experiment on getting them shiny).

Has anyone figured out the ratios for the F.A. solution? (it was blue).

 

[CKweigand]

I run mine with a 1/4 tsp of Lemi and a squirt of blue dawn dish soap for about a 1 1/2 hrs. I like this time and solution for the moment. My brass comes out super clean primer pockets and all but then again I’m only putting around 750 rounds of 45 in there at a time. And about 25 min in the FA brass dryer and it’s ready to go...

Do you have pictures of your “dull” brass? What you call dull I might call clean and shiny.

Hope this helps.
CK

 

[GW Staar]

I've wet tumbled .45, .40, .223, and even LC 7.62. Probably 10 batches so far. All batches have produced perfectly cleaned, hurt your eyes bling, inside, outside, and primer pockets. Nary a dull batch yet. Every batch used the same:

single .45ACP case full of Lemishine
2 second squeeze of blue Dawn dish detergent. (not the concentrated kind)
5lbs of SS pins
1 quart of brass.

Then I fill with cold water to 1 to 1.5 inches of the top of my little red Thumber's fast speed Model B. I timed all for 4 hours.

I think too much Lemishine and not enough Dawn may be your problem......if not, maybe its your local tap water chemistry. My water is hard rocky mountain water....no water softener at my house.

If your machine is made to handle more weight & volume you'll have to interpolate proportions to match what I was taught and do.

 

[Fine Figure of a Man]

Too much Lemishine or citric acid will result in dull brass.
Starting with hot water seems to help if you brass is real dirty.

 

[BigMacMI]

223 cases on bright orange towel with the FA solution. Mixed brass on ShamWow were my home brew. Just finished a batch with less lemishine. may re run those. They were once fired cleanish brass so was seeing if I could get them to shine up... does t appear as so

 

[Reeferman]

Depending on the water quality you have makes a difference in the amount of lemishine you use. The water where I’m at is pretty hard and I have to use a lot of lemishine to get the bling. I use armour all wash and wax and very hot water.

 

[dh1633pm]

My new recipe works wonders. Some burnishing compound which most say is ivory soap, and a little car wash. I stopped adding lemon shine. Everything comes out not only clean but shiny.

 

[Blue68f100]

If your pins are coming out dirty and not bright and shiny like the brass should be your not adding enough soap. When I switched over to county water from my well I had to increase the Limeshine. Went from 1/4tsp to 1/2 tsp. My well water was acidic with a lot of carbonates. The county water is softer and required more LimeShine to get the clean brass.

 

[BigMacMI]

Thanks everyone. In 40 min I will pop open a re run and see what it looks like

 

[D Rock]

I'm still using a 32 oz bottle of Frankford Arsenal Brass-Cleaning Solution that I got with a FART kit. I only use two cap fulls per about 8 lbs of 9mm (they recommend 4 caps) and run for less than 2 hours.

I'm reloading a total of 50 lbs of brass I finished in January and it's still bright and shiny. As long as I can buy it locally, I'll get another bottle of Frankford Arsenal Brass-Cleaning Solution when I run out of my first.

Dave

 

[BigMacMI]

I can get the solution locally. I think it is 19.99 a bottle or something. I had a hard time swallowing that for the cheap brass that I shoot (9mm and 223). Good to hear it works well cutting it.

I think you guys were correct on the too much lemishine. I did have one batch I ran with significantly less (1/2 .45 case) that worked out REALLY well (shiiiiiiiny). I was out of dirty brass at that point.

Tried re-running some of the tarnished stuff (water/soap/LS) to see if the pins would abrade that top layer off and return it to it's former luster... no such luck. Am running a small batch now with just pins/water/soap to see if it will knock that outside layer up a bit and maybe I can re-run it.

If not, no problem to me... will all load the same I guess. I did happen upon a local range I can get some once fired off of, so I won't feel as bad losing stuff at matches now.

 

[Dudedog]

How much citric acid depends a lot on the PH of your water. HIgh PH water needs more, neutral PH less.
However it does not seem to be super critical. More import is having enough wash and wax, be generous with it. I dump in a couple oz, never measure just a healthy dollop.

Only bad batch I had was when I tried adding some car paste wax to the batch. This was a VERY BAD IDEA!! (it seemed reasonable when I tried it, more wax is good right....) Brass turned out grey, pins were gray, lots of 409 to clean up the whole mess. Everything was coated with micro fine grey crud

I don't know if it was just me or if anyone else has tried it and had the same thing happen.

It might be interesting to try to find a MSDS on the Frankford solution, that might give you an idea about making something like it.

 

[BigMacMI]

Well I was able to get to the range to 'unload' some cases... you know, for the purpose of testing the tumbler of course.

indoor range

Ran 1 hour with 1/2 .45acp case of LS and 3/4 cap of Armorall Wash and Wax. Came out the olive drab tarnish again. I have found I can re-tumble these in corn cob media and they will shine back up. This was a low-volume tumble. Maybe 200 9/.45 cases with pins.

I guess next time I will go less LS, a 3/4 .380 case or something

 

[GW Staar]

I don't think you are using enough detergent. Suds.....do you see suds when you open after an hour.....if not, not enough detergent. Also I don't think 1 hour is enough time for real bling unless they are already pretty clean. I've always wondered about the wax.....I understand that some like it, but it seams to me that detergent and wax is like shampoo/conditioner in one bottle....neither works as well. Clean it first, IMO.

 

[BigMacMI]

I’ll try dawn next time. A bit more as well. Thank you. Guess I better load some more up and blast it out this weekend.

 

[Dudedog]

What is you water PH? Could be you need more citric acid/lemishine if your tap water has a high PH
You should be able to test pretty quick if you have already cleaned some cases to see about "bling"
Maybe 1/2 hour run would give you an idea.
I would say try some (small test sample) with maybe 2 or 3 times as much Lemishine. (I use citric acid but same difference).
Again be generous with the wash and wax, for fun try twice as much.
One batch with no Lemishine just plenty of wax.
Is one better than the other? That should give you a heading on more or less lemishine.
My try would be to double both citric acid and wash and wax.
I don't know if the citric acid works better than Lemishine or not, but you can get it in the canning section of the super market and it's cheaper.

Make sure your pins are not dirty as well, not likely but possible.

If the cases are really dirty it helps to maybe run them for 20-30 minutes then dump the dirty water off them and add clean solution for the rest of the run.
There has to be a simple solution, it works for lots of us, so you just need the magic amount of stuff in the water.

 

[frankmako]

I load brass as much as i can get in the barrel, about 80% plus full. Then two shots of dawn, two tea spoons of lemishine, five pounds of pins. Water to the top of drum and run for 3 hours. Brass comes out like new.

 

[Blue68f100]

I've learned not to load the barrel with more than 70# full. The fuller it gets the less action you get the longer it takes. Try not to go over the weight of your brass too. Like I said earlier, if your pins are coming out dirty you need more soap, be generous with it.