Heh, heh, heh.,,

[Yoda]

My wife and I are now sitting in a large commercial auditorium with perhaps 5,000 - 7,000 other people, waiting for the show to begin. As we entered, we walked past about a dozen uniformed policemen, then the civilian security folks at the gate spent about 15 seconds poking around in my wife's purse with a flashlight, looking for a bomb or sawed-off shotgun or who knows what.

She anticipated this, and didn't bring any of her "little friends" along. Instead, she depended on me for "escort services."

And me? Oh, the pleasures of deep concealment. I "obviously" wasn't carrying anything in my hands, like a purse, and I wasn't wearing a jacket or vest. Since I clearly had nothing to hide, they just waved me through.

We heard sirens as we were walking from the parking garage to the auditorium. Maybe there will be more sirens later tonight as we walk back to our car. However, with our own self-help security, we will be more alert but less vulnerable.

It's SO good to live in the free state of Florida!

- - - Yoda

 

[silicosys4]

Forgive me if I'm mistaken...but wouldn't that be considered trespassing, to knowingly carry a firearm into a private establishment that is clearly marked as a not allowing firearms?
Do you think that if the "dozen" policeman and how many security couldn't stop a problem, your deep concealment piece would have been the hammer of Thor?
Did you feel threatened to the point that you needed protection outside of the heavy police presence, and why would you voluntarily walk into an area that you would feel such danger in even with so much LE presence?
Do you feel that a better solution would be to restrict your activities to places that are more friendly to firearms, and respect the rights of a private establishment to act as they see fit on their own property.... instead of breaking laws and disrespecting property rights, to unnecessarily prove a point?
Do you believe that if your concealed piece had been found, that you would have put gunowners in general in a positive light?


Sorry if I'm coming off harsh, but I feel that the right to carry does not trump the rights of a property owner to do what they feel is proper on their own property. You of course have every right not to step foot on their property and not give them a dime of your money.

I'm all for carrying, but I keep in mind that the owners of private residences and businesses have every right to bar carrying, just as I have every right not to do business with them or support them, and notify them why they are losing my business when I see such anti-cc practices.

 

[NOLAEMT]

Did they say no weapons allowed? I've been to events where they search bags but have no posted signs about weapons. So I carried iwb and no one was the wiser.

Not that I particularly care if its posted no weapons. Not against the law here.

 

[22-rimfire]

The only time I have ever been searched for weapons other than at the court house or airport was at a bullfight in Colombia. My Sak was okay. Wasn't even searched at a Bush campaign rally prior to 9/11.

 

[silicosys4]

Well, if you came onto my property with that attitude....you'd immediately be looking at the business end of my firearm as I call the sheriff.

Having a store on my property that you want to shop at, or a theater that you want to come see a show in, or an ampitheater you want to attend a show at...doesn't make a lick of difference. You are still violating someones property rights, and property rights are just as important as gun rights.

 

[Certaindeaf]

What was the show.. that limited venue/showing of Atlas Shrugged?

 

[Yoda]

Not against the law in Florida! The places you can't carry are clearly defined in FS 790, and unless this auditorium is hosting a sports event or has been converted into a bar, or is being used as a courtroom, legislature, jail, school, or mental counseling facility, we're good to go, EVEN IF IT'S POSTED! (Of course, in Florida, if I was found out, and asked to leave, and I refused to do so, that would be aggravated trespass, a felony.)

And all those cops? I'm sure they would lay down their lives to protect mine while we're in the vicinity if the auditorium. Would they be in position to help out during our walk to the garage, or during our rude home? I don't know. Why take the chance?

As I said, it's good to be in the "gunshine" state!

- - - Yoda

 

[doc2rn]

you'd immediately be looking at the business end of my firearm

Note to self never spend any money at this store on vacation.

 

[Sam1911]

Step 1: Follow the LAW.
Step 2: Conceal well.
Step 3: Be happy.

 

[berettaprofessor]

Well, if you came onto my property with that attitude....you'd immediately be looking at the business end of my firearm as I call the sheriff.

Real high road there. Immediately go to guns.....

 

[wgaynor]

Same is in Kentucky. Unless it's listed in the State Laws, you can carry there even if it's posted. If it's posted to not carry firearms on the premises, I ignore it, my firearm is spotted, then they can ask me to leave on grounds of trespassing. At that point I am violating the law if I refuse to leave.

I love Kentucky

Please know the laws for the individual situation before you start the lynching.

 

[orionengnr]

Well, if you came onto my property with that attitude....you'd immediately be looking at the business end of my firearm as I call the sheriff.

And you would know...exactly...how?

It's called The High Road, not The High Horse. Get with the program, please.

 

[beatledog7]

Real high road there. Immediately go to guns.....

It's every bit as high road as violating and/or supporting the violation of property rights.

Why, in a place called "The High Road," are seeing this pervasive "my rights trump yours" attitude regarding RKBA vs. property rights?

We go through this about every other day now; somebody pokes out his chest about how he carried someplace where he was rightfully asked not to carry. The poster blatantly violates someone else's rights, and then he has to be all big and bad and "Hey, look at me, I sure stuffed it up that guy" about it.

And moderators support it!

Is this really a place where we think our right to carry in places where the property owner asks us not to carry is perfectly acceptable as long as we don't get caught? Do we also advocate cheating on our spouses and encourage each other to brag about it (as long as we don't get caught)? Hey, it's not illegal.

Mercy sakes! Into what sort of pit are we descending?

 

[Texan Scott]

When peoples' rights conflict, it is part of the legitimate role of the State to decide whose rights take precedence. The state of Florida has decided, as a matter of law, that the OP's RKBA does, in point of fact, trump the arena owner's property rights. This is not a matter of courtesy. It is a matter of law.

 

[wgaynor]

Private Property Rights do not trump the 2nd amendment. That's why there are other laws. In these states, they state that one who has a license to conceal carry can do so in establishments with these signs until they are asked not to do so.

Just because you feel that you have the right to deny the right to keep and bear arms doesn't mean you do.

It's a slippery slope. I'll still carry. If I'm asked not to, I've messed up because it wasn't concealed. I'll then leave the premises. Simple as that.

Now... if I lived in the Socialist State of California or Illinois, then I'd have no rights whatsoever.

 

[Yoda]

Gosh, guys, I saw no "No Guns" signs, just security folks looking for weapons.

- - - Yoda

 

[wgaynor]

Yoda, that makes you even more in the right and I'd think they violated your constitutional right against unwarranted search and seizure.

Then again, why put the focus on you.

Good job.

 

[bottom shelf]

somebody pokes out his chest about how he carried someplace where he was rightfully asked not to carry.

Is this really a place where we think our right to carry in places where the property owner asks us not to carry is perfectly acceptable

Whats all this about being asked not to carry? The OP never indicated anything about it being prohibited or even discouraged.

 

[beatledog7]

The OP never indicated anything about it being prohibited or even discouraged.

The OP intimated that what he was doing would not have met the approval of the venue ownership/management. So it sounds to the rational man as if he knew his CCW was unwelcome.

...one who has a license to conceal carry can do so in establishments with these signs until they are asked not to do so

And the sign saying "no firearms" is not the owner asking you not to carry a gun? I realize that legally it is not, in some states, but you still know darn well you've been asked not to carry.

If it's posted to not carry firearms on the premises, I ignore it, my firearm is spotted, then they can ask me to leave on grounds of trespassing. At that point I am violating the law if I refuse to leave.

As for RKBA trumping property rights, how do you get that from the fact that once your expression of RKBA is discovered, you must do as the property owner asks or face charges? Sounds like the trump card is in the hand of the property owner.

 

[wgaynor]

Once again, there were no signs. Please read the post and quit assuming. And yes, when I see a sign of this that you are refering to in kentucky, I will ignore it. The law supports my decision.

Kentucky law does not support a property owners decision to take away my right to carry on his property by posting a sign.

I know my rights because I was educated by state law and attorneys in my ccw class. Such laws are in the class manual. I actually read them.

Sounds like you are arguing for gun control.

 

[Steel Horse Rider]

Just another example of the lack of High Road on this website. Notice the protester doesn't identify where he is from, that speaks volumes in my opinion. As my office manager says, "Crap flows downhill".

 

[Yoda]

Gosh, guys, I saw no "No Guns" signs, just security folks doing a piss-poor job of looking for weapons.

- - - Yoda

 

[wgaynor]

Yoda, the ones that are arguing with you are the same ones that do not understand the full meaning of the law. They only know it the way they want it to apply to their opinion.

 

[beatledog7]

Kentucky law does not support a property owners decision to take away my right to carry on his property by posting a sign.

I know my rights because I was educated by state law and attorneys in my ccw class. Such laws are in the class manual. I actually read them.

I'll note again: if the owner asks you to leave and you do not leave, or you make a fuss, you can be charged with some sort of trespass. Further, he can ask you to leave for whatever reason, CCW or not. Further, you have no inherent right to enter his property in the first place, but do so only as a privilege extended by that owner.

Now, what part of that means your RKBA trumps his property rights? Clearly the law is ultimately on the side of the property owner, for you as the visitor have no way to press charges against him for asking you to leave.

Sounds like you are arguing for gun control.

No, I'm arguing that if we as gun owners fail to respect the right of those who wish their property to be gun free, and blatantly violate that right, whether they know we're doing it or not, then we shouldn't expect them to have respect for our rights either.

As long as you are not being coerced to enter private property, being asked to enter it only if you are unarmed is not a violation of your RKBA.

 

[beatledog7]

Let me be 100% clear. If I owned a shop, pub, restaurant, or whatever place where the public is invited to enter, I'd welcome open or concealed carry; in fact, I'd encourage it to the extent the law allows.

But I still argue that disrespect for those who don't want guns on their property, even though I think they're 100% wrong, warrants disrespect in kind.