westernrover
Member
- Joined
- May 4, 2018
- Messages
- 1,613
I've got some decapping to do. Should I use:
ABLP with case feeder (ie. Pro 4000)
or
Deluxe APP with decapping kit
Since I don't have a 223 shell plate for my ABLP with its case feeder, I setup my Deluxe APP for decapping. This press uses a different case feeder and I had to adjust it to the 223. That was not simple to get configured correctly, and after less than 1000 cases, I bent the decapping pin. I switched to my Lee Universal decapper and kept going, but it doesn't work too well since there is nothing to hold the cases down or eject the cases from the die. The deluxe model does not use the X shell holder like the regular APP. I quit after fiddling with a few hundred more.
I know from experience with other cartridges the ABLP case feeder can be made to work reasonably well. Occasionally, I'll have a case bounce and double feed. Occasionally, I get a case that fell in the collator upside down. Overall, it works fine. On the other hand, the red plastic ramp the case slide towards the shell holder on my ABLP is warped in a convex arc. Too often, the case rim collides with the shell plate and it tips over. If it doesn't do that, the case will frequently only go into the shellholder half or two-thirds of the way. Larger cases will self-center in the decapping die, but I'm concerned the 223 won't. Another method I use with previously decapped cases is to leave station 1 empty so as the shell plate rotates to station two, the case is pushed the rest of the way in. That makes the press useable but won't help with decapping which requires station 1. I could get the Lee "Heavy Duty Guided Decapper" which will either choke on cases not fully inserted into the shell plate, or it will pull the cases into the shell holder and positively self-center them -- I'm not sure which.
The Deluxe APP case feeder sucks for 223 because the tubes and feeder are hard to optimize for such a skinny case. The cases tilt and wiggle above the feeder because the tubes leave so much wiggle room. Yes, I'm using the small feed hole, not the large. Frequently, they fall into the feeder jaws tilted. Part of the problem is the feeder is too short. The feeder on my ABLP is taller and I added a height-extension to mine to raise it another 1/8". This tall pusher supports tall cases without letting the tip over. The Deluxe APP pusher is short and only pushes on the bottom half of the case. Many of the feed problems I see come from the case falling crooked into the jaws. I took some time to tune the jaw opening and try to position the tube drop to drop the cases straight into the jaws. You can see Johnny struggling to do the same thing from 31:52 to 38:50 in this video
I modified by feed tubes by reducing the ID somewhat to try to keep the cases straight. After I did that, I fed some cases, but like I said, not even 1000 before the decapping rod bent. Why did it bend? This is not even crimped primer brass. The case should not have been off-center because the guide fingers and ejector plastic should center the case for the pin. One of the issues I had with using the decapping kit was if the case mouth had a flat on one side it would stick on the decapping rod. It might not be a problem with larger case mouths, but the rod is almost a tight fit in the 22 necks when they're not bent. I wonder if I'm going to use this decapping kit on the Deluxe APP, how many replacement pins am I going to have to order to get through some brass?
I switched to my Lee Universal decapper. The problem with this is there is no X-press shellholder with the Deluxe APP. This press depends on the plastic guide fingers to center the case and it depends on the plastic ejector to push the case out of the die. I was able to do a few hundred cases, but too often a primer would stick on the end of the decapping pin, or a case would stick inside the decapping die, or a case wouldn't center over the primer ejection hole in the black plastic shell plate and I'd have to center it with my fingers.
I've got a few 5-gallon buckets of brass to decap and more coming. I need to be productive. Which of these Lee machines should I get parts for and try to make work?
ABLP with case feeder (ie. Pro 4000)
or
Deluxe APP with decapping kit
Since I don't have a 223 shell plate for my ABLP with its case feeder, I setup my Deluxe APP for decapping. This press uses a different case feeder and I had to adjust it to the 223. That was not simple to get configured correctly, and after less than 1000 cases, I bent the decapping pin. I switched to my Lee Universal decapper and kept going, but it doesn't work too well since there is nothing to hold the cases down or eject the cases from the die. The deluxe model does not use the X shell holder like the regular APP. I quit after fiddling with a few hundred more.
I know from experience with other cartridges the ABLP case feeder can be made to work reasonably well. Occasionally, I'll have a case bounce and double feed. Occasionally, I get a case that fell in the collator upside down. Overall, it works fine. On the other hand, the red plastic ramp the case slide towards the shell holder on my ABLP is warped in a convex arc. Too often, the case rim collides with the shell plate and it tips over. If it doesn't do that, the case will frequently only go into the shellholder half or two-thirds of the way. Larger cases will self-center in the decapping die, but I'm concerned the 223 won't. Another method I use with previously decapped cases is to leave station 1 empty so as the shell plate rotates to station two, the case is pushed the rest of the way in. That makes the press useable but won't help with decapping which requires station 1. I could get the Lee "Heavy Duty Guided Decapper" which will either choke on cases not fully inserted into the shell plate, or it will pull the cases into the shell holder and positively self-center them -- I'm not sure which.
The Deluxe APP case feeder sucks for 223 because the tubes and feeder are hard to optimize for such a skinny case. The cases tilt and wiggle above the feeder because the tubes leave so much wiggle room. Yes, I'm using the small feed hole, not the large. Frequently, they fall into the feeder jaws tilted. Part of the problem is the feeder is too short. The feeder on my ABLP is taller and I added a height-extension to mine to raise it another 1/8". This tall pusher supports tall cases without letting the tip over. The Deluxe APP pusher is short and only pushes on the bottom half of the case. Many of the feed problems I see come from the case falling crooked into the jaws. I took some time to tune the jaw opening and try to position the tube drop to drop the cases straight into the jaws. You can see Johnny struggling to do the same thing from 31:52 to 38:50 in this video
I modified by feed tubes by reducing the ID somewhat to try to keep the cases straight. After I did that, I fed some cases, but like I said, not even 1000 before the decapping rod bent. Why did it bend? This is not even crimped primer brass. The case should not have been off-center because the guide fingers and ejector plastic should center the case for the pin. One of the issues I had with using the decapping kit was if the case mouth had a flat on one side it would stick on the decapping rod. It might not be a problem with larger case mouths, but the rod is almost a tight fit in the 22 necks when they're not bent. I wonder if I'm going to use this decapping kit on the Deluxe APP, how many replacement pins am I going to have to order to get through some brass?
I switched to my Lee Universal decapper. The problem with this is there is no X-press shellholder with the Deluxe APP. This press depends on the plastic guide fingers to center the case and it depends on the plastic ejector to push the case out of the die. I was able to do a few hundred cases, but too often a primer would stick on the end of the decapping pin, or a case would stick inside the decapping die, or a case wouldn't center over the primer ejection hole in the black plastic shell plate and I'd have to center it with my fingers.
I've got a few 5-gallon buckets of brass to decap and more coming. I need to be productive. Which of these Lee machines should I get parts for and try to make work?
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