Helping Girlfriend Choose A Gun

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Not to offend any of the Ladies out there - but in my experience, (most) women generally aren't "into" guns - or anything else requiring an intuitive knowledge of basic mechanics. So simple is better. With regard to handguns, something like an all steel S&W "J" frame size DA revolver loaded with low pressure wadcutters or hollow points is probably going to work best. If she takes an interest, then move on to whatever you like.

Case in point, many years ago I got a Walther PP for my S.O. She shot it well, was pretty accurate with it and seemed to understand safe handling of it (at least as long as I was around to observe). By her self one day, she took it out of the purse and wanted to "make it safe". Screwing with it (with other distractions going on), she ended up shooting a hole in the floor. Fortunately, neither her self or others were in the path of the bullet. She is not a stupid person. In fact, intectually and within her field of expertise, she is one of the brightest people I know. Just not terribly "interested" in basic mechanics. Needless to say, the PP went bye bye shortly thereafter.

Face facts. Wanting to carry a gun around soley based on an immediate perceived threat probably isn't good. If there is an aptitude, willingness and disipline to to practice and use a handgun - then fine. Otherwise, forget it. Figure out something else other than a handgun.
 
"...can't operate a revolver's trigger very long...is there a compromise?" Yep, a trigger job. A well tuned trigger will allow her to shoot and be comfortable doing so.
 
Starting a beginning shooter with a revolver was good advice back in the day when the 1911 was the only semi-auto pistol to choose from. Now that there are so many good semi-autos that work well and are simple to operate, it's no longer necessary to start a beginner on a wheelgun.
 
To my mind, the reason to advocate a revolver is not necessarily the physical ability (to rack a slide, etc.), but because in a pressure situation there is no need to have to think about whether the safety is engaged, or the hammer back. Even with a Glock you have to think about whether a round is chambered (many people keep pistols by their beds in condition 3).

My wife loves shooting my CZ 75 much more than her model 38, but she feels much more comfortable with the 38 because she knows she does not have to be thinking about its status. Many people do not want to have to be making mental checks on their firearms. Sure, we do here at THR, but we have to be realistic about the rest who just want to defend themselves. With a revolver it is point and bang. There is just a lot less to think about.
 
Sven/Steve:

I went through this a few years ago. When we finally meet you will also meet my 4'9" wife. Here is what I went through.

Kahr K9: Can't rack slide Likes Grip
Glock 35: Can't rack slide. Grip overly large
Sig Pro: Can't rack slide. Small grip bit large
Ruger SP-101: Can't pull trigger
S&W Mod 66: Can't pull trigger. Grip bit large
Keltec P-32: Can't rack slide

Other information:

Beretta makes one of the easiest slides to rack

Lightened trigger (trigger job) SP-101: Easy to shoot.

About to try Valtro with thinner grips..for semi-auto. John finished the work on mine and I hope to pick it up Monday.

She currently uses the Mod 66/Miculek Grips/Safariland Comp II & III/Del Fatti Belt and Blade-Tech Offset-Drop Kydex holster and speedloader pouches. I installed light springs from Brownells and put a combination toothpaste/polishing compound into trigger mechanism and dryfired for a few day. The trigger is not easy and smooth. Amy loves this gun.

Sold the Sig. Gave away the Kahr and kept the rest for her husband.

Bullseye in San Rafael will rent you a gun for $10-$12.. They usually let you just try one and then another without any extra charge. Last time there they had Beretta, Valtro, XD, SP-101, K-Frame Smiths, Glock and many others. One of my friends settled on an XD by going through the whole display case and shooting almost every gun.
 
In the process of her practicing loading and performing malfunction clearance exercises, we quickly learned that she cannot operate the CZ 75 slide because the spring is too strong and the serrations too small for her fingers to grasp. Trying the Glock 17, she had no problem grabbing that slide and racking it.


You must not only consider the ability to operate the slide (and other controls) on a semi-auto, but maintenance. If someone can barely rack the slide, they're going to have a lot trouble taking the gun apart for cleaning.

The ability to take apart a semi-auto pistol is something most of us here take for granted. But think about how difficult and confusing it can be for a novice, and/or someone who just wants a gun for protection, and not a hobby.


What's confusing about a semiauto, especially a Glock?


"Put your right-thumb around the backstrap. Grasp the slide with your remaning four fingers over the top of the slide. Pull the slide exactly 0.123141598 inches back. With your other hand, pull down on the stubby take-down levers, etc. etc."

Don't get me wrong, I own six Glocks and love them. But I've seen mechanically inclined guys get confused by trying to take a Glock apart.

After all, just because we drive our cars every day does not mean we know how to take them apart, want to know how to take them apart, or have the time and dedication to learn how to take them apart.



I also agree that a revolver is a good choice, but most of the women I date can't operate a revolver's trigger very long...is there a compromise?

How long will someone need to operate a revolver for in a self-defense situation?

Extended range sessions can be done from a bench (to reduce fatigue from weight of the gun), or in single-action (to reduce fatigue from trigger pull). Also, as somebody noted above, a trigger job can be done to lighten the pull. I would think that you could even put in a lighter mainspring yourself, but I might be wrong about that.

Also, unlike single-action autos or some hammerless autos (Glocks, Kahrs), you can do repetitive dry fire drills with a double-action revolver (and even double-action auto). It should go without saying to make sure the gun is unloaded, first.

Such dry-fire drills can also be used to "grow stronger." Remember in Silence of the Lambs when Clarice was being timed on how many times she could pull the trigger on her revolver per minute, and was expected to improve? Can't do that with a 1911 or Glock.



In addition to all of the advice above (about trying out different guns), my recommendation in situations like this generally is:

A Ruger SP-101 with a 3", not the 2", barrel, in .38 or .38/.357.

Replace the factory grips with something more comfortable (I've found the Hogue soft-rubber grips work for most people. Individual results may vary.)

I belive the advantages of this setup are

1) Rugers are relatively inexpensive
2) You get a small-frame revolver, with enough weight to absorb recoil of most .38 loads.
3) Wide variety of relatively inexpensive ammo available, from light .38s to heavy .357s.
4) The 3" barrel provides a better sight radius than the 2", but makes the gun easier to carry than a 4". This makes the gun work as both a home-defense and carry (in a purse) gun.
5) If she plans on doing a lot of shooting, you can get a the same gun in .22 LR for practice of fundementals. Granted, she'd have to shoot a lot of .22 to recoup the cost of the gun, but it is something to consider.

My only real complaint with fixed-sight revolvers is the rear sight.

That's just my idea, so take it for what it's worth.

If you do go the revolver route, I've found it easier to carry (and learn how to use) Bianchi Speed Strips, rather than mechanical speed loaders.



Not to offend any of the Ladies out there - but in my experience, (most) women generally aren't "into" guns - or anything else requiring an intuitive knowledge of basic mechanics. So simple is better. With regard to handguns, something like an all steel S&W "J" frame size DA revolver loaded with low pressure wadcutters or hollow points is probably going to work best. If she takes an interest, then move on to whatever you like.

After years of watching newbie men shoot, I think this applies to us as well. They think they're "into" guns, but in reality, they've just watched too many action movies. I really wished I'd suggested revolvers for these guys, instead (mainly to avoid the "spray-and-pray" mentality, but for other reasons as well).


Just because the 1911 is the be-all/end-all of handguns does not mean everyone should be forced to use one. As Nick96 said, start them off with a revolver. If they show a serious interest in learning more, then see if something else will work better. After a while, something else probably will.
 
Good grief.

Hey guys, Sven's first post made perfect sense and I'm surprised how many people missed what he said. He said he is working with her to help her choose the gun that she is going to shoot. He also said that she is able and willing to learn a bit more and that is why he is excited to work with her on it.

In a later post, he said that she doesn't want a revolver. Since Sven is a pretty smart guy, he probably won't tell her that she is
  • too stupid,
  • too weak,
  • too lazy, or
  • too female
to learn how to operate a semi-auto. He will instead work with her to find the semi-auto that's right for her and work with her to help her learn how to use it.

That's sure a lot more helpful and a lot less insulting than what a dumb guy would do in the same situation.

pax

Complete masculinity and stupidity are often indistinguishable. -- H.L. Mencken
 
In a later post, he said that she doesn't want a revolver. Since Sven is a pretty smart guy, he probably won't tell her that she is

too stupid,
too weak,
too lazy, or
too female
to learn how to operate a semi-auto. He will instead work with her to find the semi-auto that's right for her and work with her to help her learn how to use it.

No kidding! You can get MUCH better results teaching women (or anybody else) how to shoot if:

a. You don't choose the gun for them, then wonder why they don't take to shooting it.
b. You aren't a patronizing twit.

:rolleyes:
 
Have you shown her a CZ83? All the women who have seen my '83
just love it. Bigger than most .380s and shoots like a dream. The
slide is easy to operate. it is an easy gun to field strip. Pretty awesome
with Glasers or other exotic loads that boost the stopping power. low
price, but high quality. Comes in .32/380/9mm Mak.

The Glock 26 is another gun that women like. I far prefer the smooth
action and recoil of the CZ83.
 

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Don't recommend a revolver for a woman unless she asks for one. I'm a female shooter myself -- 5'2", 114 pounds....small hands. I got a 442, hated it, sold it, couldn't get away fast enough. I have two Beretta type M compacts and looking for a third and fourth soon. They're slim, great for carry and home defense, never jam, easy to maintain. Don't listen to the garbage it's easier than a revolver. Says who? Spend some time with it and it's not rocket science. I found the 9mm to be cheaper ammo and gentle recoil. I LOVE my Berettas -- but it's got to be your girlfriend's choice. It's like with clothes, don't buy people clothes -- give them money so they can buy their own and that way no hassles regarding the returns. Let her try out the guns at a range where she can rent if possible. If not, take her to the shop, let her feel them out and stick with the 9mm to be safe. She'll have a blast....:D Regarding safety -- I always believe it's a great thing especially for a novice. Ask your girlfriend. Maybe the gun she loves, it won't be an issue but her hands -- her choice.
 
P.S.

One of many reasons I love my Berettas is the single/double action. I've used DAO before -- can't pull the trigger or hit the side of a barn with it. Be kind to your girlfriend, if she can't use it first, stick with the 9mm in single/double action and don't buy S&W. They did a story in Women and Guns -- the S&W pistols had the worst trigger pull. Glock 26 was the best, Sig 223 nice -- of course the Beretta M -- hands down winner in my book...:cool:
 
Maybe you should get her a S&W .500, better yet how 'bout a 12 gauge; why stop there? Just get her a big .50 caliber machine gun and she should be safe.
 
My 'significant other' and I just talked on the phone about this. She likes the Glock 17 so far because she could rack the slide and can hang on to the gun when firing. The CZ is a little less ergonomic, also heavy compared to the plastic wonders.

Here's the deal: she told me that she wants VALUE. Sounds like a test drive of the Springfield XP is in order.

One option would certainly be a Valtro... but .45 ACP seems a bit hot for her, so far anyhow. She is holding correctly... she's just sortof a little stunned at the 'BOOM' of the .45 versus the 'CRACK' of the 9mm...

Jardine's Custom shop put out a killer 9mm single stack that I saw in person. It fed flawlessly over the entire IDPA match, and Jardine even made custom mag pads for the customer so that this young lady could strip the mags more quickly.

The Beretta type M compacts sound intriguing, but she likes the full size frame... not that purse carry is an option in SFO.

/

Maybe Jerry Brown's guru (with his CCW - the only CCW issued in the city of Oakland) can come help my girlfriend if someone attacks her on the street.

:barf:

/sarcasm
 
Sven -- if it's "value" she wants, it's nothing a Glock or Beretta can't handle. If she doesn't want the compact size Beretta -- get the classic full size 92FS. At the very least, give it a fair consideration. Either should more than meet her expectations and just because a gun is expensive, doesn't mean it's the best. The best is what's comfortable, reliable, and easy to use. The Glock 17 or Beretta 92FS would be a fantastic choice for anyone looking for value -- but again, it should be her choice. She'll have fun looking I'm sure, especially if your paying for it. :p
 
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