Homeless man takes officer's gun

[alemonkey]

Under what circumstances would an officer remove his duty belt outside of a soup kitchen? I can't understand how this officer still has a job....to me, leaving your weapon on a park bench is extreme negligence and should be punished by termination. No mention of that in the article, of course.

After federal hung jury, state tries for conviction
By the Lincoln Journal Star
Thursday, Mar 13, 2008 - 06:35:06 pm CDT

Two weeks after a federal jury deadlocked in the trial of a homeless man suspected of taking a police officer’s gun, Lancaster County prosecutors filed a state charge against the transient.

The Lancaster County Attorney’s office charged Thomas Livings, 47, with possession of a firearm by a felon in connection with the October incident. A trial in U.S. District Court in Lincoln last month ended in a hung jury.

Authorities said a Lincoln police officer inadvertently left his duty belt under a
street bench near Matt Talbot Kitchen at 19th and R the evening of Oct. 7.
Police got a call a few hours later from someone who said Livings had a police officer’s weapon. Authorities found him the next morning with the gun and magazines in an apartment near 23rd and Q streets.

According to papers filed Thursday in Lancaster County District Court, the police officer who misplaced the belt identified Livings as the suspect.

 

[tpaw]

Under what circumstances would an officer remove his duty belt outside of a soup kitchen? I can't understand how this officer still has a job....to me, leaving your weapon on a park bench is extreme negligence and should be punished by termination. No mention of that in the article, of course.

If it is as cut and dry as you say with no extenuating circumstances (gun to the officers head forcing him to do so or something as bizzare as that), I agree with you. He should be dismissed from the force.

 

[Titan6]

That is really strange. What is he charged with again? Finding a gun belt with gun in it?

 

[Tommygunn]

What is he charged with again? Finding a gun belt with gun in it?

Really, you can't just KEEP a gun you find. "Finders keepers -- losers weepers" works in kindergarten but not in the grownup world.
He might have "found" the gun ... but he "should" have reported it to the police.

 

[inherentical]

That is really strange. What is he charged with again? Finding a gun belt with gun in it?

That type of crimethink is doubleplusungood, citizen.

 

[langenc]

According to papers filed Thursday in Lancaster County District Court, the police officer who misplaced the belt identified Livings as the suspect.

How would the loser of the weapon know who found IT? And he was able to identify him, no less. I suspect it was hours later the the gun was even missed.

 

[Starship1st]

The police are trying to cover up their carelessness in one of its officers leaving a weapon out side of his control.

What if a child had found it and decided to play with it? The city found a homeless scape goat to prosecute; so that everyone will forget about the real fault here?

 

[SHOOT1SAM]

Well Titan6,

The homeless dude (aka-Bum) was charged as a felon in possesion of a firearm, according to the article.


And Tommygunn,

I say......BS. It is indeed "Finder's Keepers". If someone's too stupid to keep track of their guns, they're probably too stupid to have them in the first place. IF I ever found a gun, I would watch for any "lost & found" notices about it. But unless I saw one and the "loser" could identify it to my satisfaction, I would consider it mine.

Sam

 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

You know, the one time I left my weapon unattended during BRM in Army Basic, I felt the pain of it for weeks. And that was an unloaded training weapon in an environment of all Army personnel. This officer left a live weapon with rounds unattended in the real world. He should be fired and possibly charged with reckless endangerment.

 

[akodo]

He might have "found" the gun ... but he "should" have reported it to the police.

ha ha ha this made me laugh. Now, I agree with you but think about it. Lets say you see a cop's duty belt and weapon abandoned at a bustop bench. How do you take control of it and then report it? Take it home and call the police...only works if you are not homelss. Put it in your car and drive to the police station....also only works if you have a car, probably don't have one if you are homeless. Call the cops on your cellphone...hey if you are homeless where do you recharge your cellphone, where do they send the bill?

 

[Majic]

Really, you can't just KEEP a gun you find. "Finders keepers -- losers weepers" works in kindergarten but not in the grownup world.

Actually it does work as there is no law compelling you to report it to the police.

 

[tpaw]

I say......BS. It is indeed "Finder's Keepers". If someone's too stupid to keep track of their guns, they're probably too stupid to have them in the first place. IF I ever found a gun, I would watch for any "lost & found" notices about it. But unless I saw one and the "loser" could identify it to my satisfaction, I would consider it mine.

That's the kind of thinking that scares me!............

 

[tpaw]

Actually it does work as there is no law compelling you to report it to the police.

I don't know if the above statement is true or not, but the mere possession of the firearm is a felony and illegal. Found property is only legal if it is turned in and no one claims it within a certain period of time. In the case of a gun, if it was turned in and not on a hot sheet as being used in a crime, the finder could legally own it if he was licensed.
Perhaps for the poor derelict it was a blessing in disguise. If he does time, as least he's off the street, getting three squares a day, shower, clean clothes, medical care, TV room, gym, and a roof over his head. A true blessing especially if it's winter! A time when many derelicts don't mind getting locked up just to get out of the cold.

 

[TCB in TN]

but the mere possession of the firearm is a felony and illegal.

In the case of a gun, if it was turned in and not on a hot sheet as being used in a crime, the finder could legally own it if he was licensed.

Now the article said the guy was a convicted felon, and I don't know about NE, but here in TN you don't have to have any liscense to own a gun. In fact I think it is that way in the vast majority of states!

 

[MechAg94]

If I found a gun, I would report it. The gun is most likely stolen or will soon be reported as stolen. I do NOT want to be busted for possession of a stolen gun and lose the right to have my other guns. It just is not worth it. I don't care if it is some $3000 special gun, it ain't worth it by a long shot.


Not to mention that if the gun is stolen, some gun owner somewhere wants their gun back. I would want mine back if they were stolen.

 

[MechAg94]

I would also mention the ethical issues here: If you found a gun that you KNOW if not yours and you do nothing to try to determine who the rightful owner is, that makes you a thief the same as if you had stolen it yourself. Unless you have connections, I doubt you would be able to check if it was stolen without reporting it.

Just my opinion though. I know I would not feel right unless I did all I could to find the rightful owner.

 

[Rebailey]

Gun

Same thing happened in Memphis recently. Lady Sheriff's Deputy went to bathroom, took duty belt off and hung on towel rack. Forgot to put it on and left. It was found 30 minutes later and turned in. Bathroom was only 20 feet from Judges' chambers. He was upset.

 

[tpaw]

Now the article said the guy was a convicted felon, and I don't know about NE, but here in TN you don't have to have any liscense to own a gun. In fact I think it is that way in the vast majority of states!

I still believe it is an illegal possession because it's not his rightfully owned property. What if he found a car with keys in it and drove off? Could he legally keep it? Here's a very good point made by another poster.

If I found a gun, I would report it. The gun is most likely stolen or will soon be reported as stolen. I do NOT want to be busted for possession of a stolen gun and lose the right to have my other guns. It just is not worth it. I don't care if it is some $3000 special gun, it ain't worth it by a long shot.

 

[ilbob]

very strange that a PO would leave his gun belt off under a street bench. the only thing I can think is that maybe he had it in a bag or something and was on his way to work and set it down and forgot about it.

 

[tpaw]

very strange that a PO would leave his gun belt off under a street bench. the only thing I can think is that maybe he had it in a bag or something and was on his way to work and set it down and forgot about it.

Or maybe he was bagged?..........

 

[alemonkey]

I just can't think of any circumstance where an officer would take their belt off in public. Even if he was out of uniform and carrying it for some reason, there's still no excuse for leaving it somewhere.

I don't work in a job where people's lives are on the line. But, I have access to personal data (account numbers, SSN numbers, etc) for a LOT of people. If I somehow let that out into public, I'd be fired as soon as it was found out. And rightfully so. This situation is MUCH more serious - what if someone had been killed by the bum who picked up the gun?

I guess the reason this fires me up so much is because the Lincoln police chief was virulently against CCW in Nebraska and tried to get it banned in Lincoln. Apparently he thinks only the police are responsible enough to carry. Yet, he apparently has officers who can't be trusted to keep track of their duty weapons.

 

[tpaw]

Yet, he apparently has officers who can't be trusted to keep track of their duty weapons.

To be fair, one officer.........

 

[siglite]

Reminds me of something that happened long ago.

I was a young lance coolie. Sitting on a big sand berm with another marine. I had sh$tter duty. Yep. Burning them. Along comes this staff sergeant. "You marines find a Beretta in any of these sh$tters?"

The other lance coolie and I exchange a look. "Uh, no staff sergeant, why? Someone missing their Beretta?"

"Yeah. I am. Last I saw it I was using the head. I might've left it in there."

*suppressing volcanic laughter* "Well, staff sergeant, if we find it, we'll let you know. Who you with?"

"Golf 2/5. Thanks marines, I appreciate it."

And then my buddy, being the unit smartass, says "Ok. Well, see ya later PFC."

The staff sergeant kind of half grimaced, half grinned at us as he walked off towards HQ.

 

[Tommygunn]

I say......BS. It is indeed "Finder's Keepers". If someone's too stupid to keep track of their guns, they're probably too stupid to have them in the first place. IF I ever found a gun, I would watch for any "lost & found" notices about it. But unless I saw one and the "loser" could identify it to my satisfaction, I would consider it mine.

To you and others saying to keep the gun:
I am certainly NOT denying that leaving the gunbelt behind was DUMB. The policeman who did it needs to be terminated.
But that does not change the fact that the gun is the property of the department, paid for by taxpayers. Keeping something that does not belong to you is -- not that I'm a lawyer or anything -- but an act of theft. Here, I believe it's technically a type of conversion.
Somethings are just common sense. You do not just "find" and "keep" a car. It's also pretty hard to not recognize what a police officer's duty belt is. Okay, maybe a homeless man can't "drive it" to a precinct house. Maybe all he can do is wave down a marked prowl car and report it to the officers in the car. But keeping the gun doesn't cut it.

 

[Dravur]

I r confused...

First, they found him at an apartment with the gun.... was it his apartment? If so, how is he homeless?

Second.... How did the officer know the "bum" had the gun? If I lost something, I dont wait around to see who picked it up. If I see that, I go get my gun....