Hornady Critical Defense

[JediKnight]

The Hornady Critical Defense line looks very intriguing and I've seen some pretty impressive results in ballistic gelatin however I've also seen pretty disturbing stuff on youtube and heard some equally disturbing stuff in forums about the reliability of this ammunition. Most of the problems seem to revolve around the primers. Whatever the problems are it keep the gun from going bang. you pull the trigger on a loaded gun and it goes click, dents the primer, and nothing else happens. It seems like reliable expansion doesn't mean much if you can't even get reliable discharge. What are your guys thoughts. Would you use this as personal defense ammunition? I would really like to hear some thoughts on this cartridge not "I like Gold Dots" or "just use Winchester PDX1's".

Thanks Guys

 

[Nushif]

Mine works fine.

*le shrug*

Sorry about how little help I am being here, but I think one anecdote is as good as any others, at this point, right?

 

[Loosedhorse]

I've noted that they are popular in NJ gunshops; it was recently explained to me in the legal forum here that that is because they are not considered "hollow nose or dum dum bullets" under NJ law.

Also, there have been some tests against simulated bone-and-tissue targets, posted in under handguns or autoloaders here. They did not do as well as Corbon DPX.

Finally, they tend to penetrate less than 12 inches in gel. Because of that, Hornady is coming out with a new, similar line (Critical Duty), which penetrates a bit more.

 

[hardluk1]

I used it for 2 pistols for some time. I also like to be sure my pistols will shoot and ammo retiably so I will shoot 200 of them to be sure. Not had a problem with them. Not primer problems. I do know use georgia arms 123gr +P loads after changeing carry pistols. As the CD was easier to shot in a KT pf-9 then the +P loads. GA use's the speer GD bullets also. No single bullet from any typical handgun caliber used for CC is guarentied to stop you so reguardless of HP brand pratice double taps and tight well placed groups.

 

[2wheels]

Huh... My buddy carries Critical Defense in his M&P, never heard him mention bad primers.

I don't use CD because all their bullets are light, 115 grains in 9mm, 185 grains in .45, 110 grains in .38 Special. I prefer 124 or 147 in my 9mms, 230 in my .45s, and 158 in my .38 Special. If they came out with heavier bullets, I'd consider them. That's simply my preference, if you like lighter bullets I don't see any problem with using CD.

On that note... JUST USE WINCHESTER PDX1s!

 

[ClickClickD'oh]

Anyone having primer problems with this ammo probably needs to seriously clean their weapon, put the original springs back in it or replace worn out springs. I've used this ammo in a CZ-83, CZ-75 and 1911 and never had a single failure with it.

 

[Shawn Dodson]

A different view: "A Word of Caution about Hornady’s Critical Defense Handgun Ammunition" --
http://www.firearmstactical.com/tacticalbriefs/2006/04/main.htm

 

[strm_trpr]

I only run critical defense in my LCP .380 auto. I have had no problems with them at all.

 

[mljdeckard]

I have always claimed it's gimmick. I don't think that cloth clogging the bullet is as widespread a problem as they claim it is, nor that their CD bullets are any more or less likely to expand through clothing than any other premium JHP ammo. I intend to test this when I happen across a couple of boxes of it, it's a ways down the list of things to do. But yeah, I think it's a fake solution for an invented problem.

 

[brnmuenchow]

I have used the Hornady "Critical Defense" loads (early in their first release to test) and never had a problem, but I actually do carry the Winchester "PDX1", but that just because I am a Winchester guy. -- so no help here, sorry.

 

[hardluk1]

Don't set around your computer try'n to sound so smart showing this or that test or some stupid comment about how they feel just use what ammo you like and stop the whine'n. With so many shooters still carry hardball ammo anything with a hollow point that cycles reliably is better.

 

[smalls]

I carry it. Gimmick or not, I think the rubber helps it expand. Although I havn't seen evidence, it makes sense, and I've never heard of them NOT expanding. I also like bullets that don't penetrate the whole 12 inches, cause I live in a townhouse that's atattched to other townhouses by just walls. I've shot about 4 boxes of it, and haven't had a single malfunction. It's not a lot, but enough to ensure reliable feeding in my gun.

 

[brnmuenchow]

Don't set around your computer try'n to sound so smart showing this or that test or some stupid comment about how they feel just use what ammo you like and stop the whine'n. With so many shooters still carry hardball ammo anything with a hollow point that cycles reliably is better.

I would agree use what you like, but testing something and giving an honest opinion I would say is hardly "whine'n". There is nothing at all wrong with asking questions and people giving honest answers. I also question just how better this new wave of "Defensive" ammo really is over say your everyday production HP loads. I personally have tested both types and like both, they functioned just fine.

Don't set around your computer try'n to sound so smart showing this or that test or some stupid comment

No sounding smart here, no charts, no graphs just an opinion plain and simple.

 

[QUICK_DRAW_McGRAW]

I used to carry it but when I started having major setback issues in multiple calibers I stopped using them. After I rechambered 1round 4 times a 45.acp became the same overall length as a .40, so no longer will I trust or carry that ammo.

 

[NFG2888]

I use critical defense ammo. I started using it in a S&W M&P9. It worked great so I rolled it over to my Glock 23 gen 4 (EDC gun). I did not shoot it expecting the Glock would shoot it perfectly, and it does except one time a few weeks ago.

I was at my ranch and I carry my Glock with me in the field because there are a lot of feral hogs on my property. I had set the traps after the evening hunt they are a cage with a spring loaded door. After the morning hunt I went to check the cages and sure enough there was a pig in there slamming around in there. I pulled my Glock out and got close enough to him to take a head shot. The Glock fired the round no problem but it failed to load the next one. I shot the rest of that mag later that day and all seems fine now.

 

[ClickClickD'oh]

A different view: "A Word of Caution about Hornady’s Critical Defense Handgun Ammunition" --
http://www.firearmstactical.com/tact...06/04/main.htm

There's a world of difference between these two statements:

"...is not designed to shoot through glass, is not designed to shoot through a car door, and is not designed to shoot through a wall."

"...will not shoot through glass, will not shoot through a car door, and will not shoot through a wall."

My Mauser was not designed to shoot deer... does just fine at it.

This sounds like a job for The Box O' Truth. I for one suspect the Hornady ammo will go through glass, car doors and walls just fine.

 

[XD 45acp]

The critical Defense line advertising seems to be aimed at straight person to person impact without any obstructions. I have them in a 357 magnum. So after reading all of the posts and the attatched article about sheet metal, ect., I decided to conduct an experement on a 64 buick I have in my woods. OK... heres the result.... looking at the back of the car, I fired 1 round into the trunk lid just above the rear bumper. It went thru the trunk lid, thru the trunk, thru the back seat, thru the front seat, thru the dash, ricocet off the carburetor, dented the hood on the drivers side top ( with slight split in dent ) and that was as far as I could track it. My conclusion is that it did pretty damned good..

 

[OldMac]

I tested in .380 along with several other hollow points through a jug of water in front of a box of wet phone books. The red rubber plug bullet expanded better and more reliably than any of the others. I suspect it helped expand where the others didn't because of the low velocity. Never had problems cycling.

 

[shaolink9]

I carry it in my wheel guns and my 9mm's non issues at all cycling, I have head (although not seen) it has issues in .45

 

[FMF Doc]

Well, as for primer issues specifically, if I remember correctly, they use CCI primers, which are used by other major brands and are probably as good as any. In general, any ammo can have a failure, and any pistol can cause a bad primer strike. I wouldn't be too conscerned about using any brand that feeds reliably in your pistol. That is the big problem with ammo, feeding. If you get that worked out I wouldn't fret over some internet story about a faulty primer. I have personally used critical defense in .380, 9mm and .38spl all without any failures.

 

[gofastman]

I feel their XTP bullet is better than the FTX (Critical Defence) design.

 

[481]

I feel their XTP bullet is better than the FTX (Critical Defence) design.

I agree. The XTP is one tough bullet and offers wicked accuracy in every gun that I've shot it through.

Because of the barrier and penetrations limitations admitted by Hornady, I doubt that I'll ever use the FTX. I wanna get through an intervening barrier if the need ever arises.

 

[Shawn Dodson]

ClickClickD'oh writes:

This sounds like a job for The Box O' Truth. I for one suspect the Hornady ammo will go through glass, car doors and walls just fine.

Which is exactly why Hornady claims its Critical Defense "...is not designed to shoot through glass, is not designed to shoot through a car door, and is not designed to shoot through a wall." It doesn't perform well in these circumstances.

 

[Pyro]

Is there any testing information on the .22 Magnum FTX bullet? I'd really like to see if that bullet will expand out of an NAA mini-revolver.

 

[jmstevens2]

ClickClickD'oh writes:

Which is exactly why Hornady claims its Critical Defense "...is not designed to shoot through glass, is not designed to shoot through a car door, and is not designed to shoot through a wall." It doesn't perform well in these circumstances.

Is that your opinion, or a fact? Though anectdodal, the post above seems to disagree. As does the Buick he tried it on.