How to destroy America

[Zrex]

Next St. Patty's day and next Oktoberfest I am going to make sure I tell the Irish and the Germans how they are tearing this country apart. And I certainly won't forget Columbus day - those Italians are really going to get it.

Next time I am at a hockey game and see a canadian flag, I am going to BOO cause this is America damn it! Stupid Canadians with their ice and stuff. Foreign flags are evil and hurt our national sovereignty!

And then there is a little town north of here (West, TX) that has a Fest every year to celebrate their Czech heritage.... Friggin Czechs with their delicious beer.... damn them! Destroying this country with their divisiveness!


Oh wait a second.... Those people don't have brown skin like the Mexicans, so its ok for them to celebrate their heritage.

 

[Sindawe]

Its a funny thing, we don't have untold millions of Canadians, Czechs, Russians, Laotains or Ethiopians sneaking into this nation in the dead of night. We don't see untold millions of the them taxing our healthcare system, public education system or public welfare system to the breaking point. We don't see tens of thousands of them in the streets DEMANDING immediate amnesty and full citizenship while waving the national flag of Canada, The Russian Federation, Laos or Ethiopia and carrying banners & signs claiming that North America is "stolen" land. We don't press 3 for Farsi, 4 for Mandarin or 5 for German.

We DO have that from nations south of us on the globe, predominantly from Mexico. Funny thing that.

Lots of Americans are not laughing.

 

[Zrex]

We don't see untold millions of the them taxing our healthcare system, public education system or public welfare system to the breaking point.

Maybe the problem is not the "untold millions" taxing our socialist services, maybe the problem is that we provide those services to begin with. If we got rid of public welfare and public education and let our PRIVATE healthcare system fend for its self, perhaps we wouldn't have a problem?

Is it OK for countless millions of able bodied Americans to be on welfare and tax our public education and heathcare systems?

I pay for my health insurance. I pay for my daughter to go to private schools. I have not now, nor have I ever been on welfare. Why should I pay for anyone to receive those services regardless of their national origin or immigration status? I drive through downtown Waco all the time and I can't tell you how many able bodied adults wandering around hanging out not working. How many of them am I paying for?

The answer is to scrap welfare and public assistance for everyone.

We don't see tens of thousands of them in the streets DEMANDING immediate amnesty and full citizenship while waving the national flag of Canada, The Russian Federation, Laos or Ethiopia and carrying banners & signs claiming that North America is "stolen" land.

They have no standing, who cares what they say? There are lots and lots of citizens of this country that say far worse things and demand worse things. Some of those people have even been elected to congress and the white house.

We don't press 3 for Farsi, 4 for Mandarin or 5 for German.

No, not yet, and somehow I doubt I would get all bent out of shape if that were an option. Besides it doesn't matter what button you push, you are going to talk to someone in India anyway. Maybe they should force you to speak Hindi or something before you get to find out about the error on your phone bill?

 

[cuchulainn]

Sindawe: Its a funny thing, we don't have untold millions of Canadians, Czechs, Russians, Laotains or Ethiopians sneaking into this nation in the dead of night.

No we don't. We've got a huge problem -- and it happens to involve Hispanics aliens.

But all this anger about their flags and holidays and language misses the REAL PROBLEMS -- the criminal and economic damage.

Who cares about flags and language? Focus, people, focus.

Stop giving cover to those who would deny there's a problem at all!

 

[Thin Black Line]

The Mexicans will be the end of America. Or will it be the Chinese? Or the Italians? Or the Irish? Or the French? Or the English? Or the Spanish? What does the woolly mammoth have to say on the topic?

For the most part, the people causing the "end of America" have been
born and (mostly) raised here.

Thanks for re-posting this speech --I've read it before and it seems even
more relevant now. Lamm definitely knew what was going on, but the
"plan" had been posted in ENGLISH and available for public download for
a while now.

Read more about the North American Union under:
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=201786

 

[longeyes]

None of what's happening could be happening without the active support and encouragement of the scoundrels in D.C. and the all too numerous American employers willing to skirt existing law, along with sympathetic home-grown leftists. Yes, we are being undone by our own.

 

[LAK]

Language and culture are important - two key elements in any nation.

While we have had pockets of Irish, German, Italian (etc) people in some places in this country in the past, they were quickly assimilated largely due to our shared European civilized culture. Quickly learning the language - those who did not already speak it - accelerated this process.

Much of the enormous sprawling communities in places like L.A. do not share our parent culture and many of them are not learning the language. Many of these people have not the slightest interest in American history and culture - only creating their own.

The language problem is not just the elderly, it is evident in the juvenile and young adult age groups as well. And many of them are indifferent and obstinate with it. It is not unlike the drop out black subculture who not only speak "ebonics" - they have extreme difficulty understanding much real english.

This link between language and culture can not be overstated. Even a very poorly educated person that speaks and understands fluent english can make themselves understood by anyone else, and can communicate with even the most educated person. When a large number of people that do not speak the common language occupy defined geographical areas that simply increase in size, this is a recipe for disaster.

---------------------------------------------

http://ussliberty.org
http://ssunitedstates.org

 

[Selfdfenz]

Low-Sci

Hmmm...where shall I begin? Since we are on flags discussions…..

I think you outline with some accuracy the 1st amendment protections accorded people in the US when it comes to the range of debasement they can heap in the US flag as a form of free speech and expression. That's one of the wonderful aspects of what the Founding Fathers did with the US Consitiution.

On the other hand, I can think of several neighborhoods that, if it were the Mexican flag on fire etc. , there is a chance someone might decide to let the air out of the free-speech advocate in short order.

Funny how you and I respect the 1st amendment and others don't seem to care one whit. It's almost like they don't know the laws or came from someplace else of something. Weird.

BTW do you know where I can find any numbers of the ratio of US citizens to illegals in the Madison area? I’d find it of interest.

TC and have a great weekend.

S-

 

[Phetro]

Nope your definition would be that of a "democracy". Britain of course is a parliamentary democracy rather than a pure democracy in the Athenian sense, but is still closer to outright majority rule than we are (or arguably than we were).

On the other hand socialism is an economic and structural market term, has absolutely nothing to do with majority rule or democracy, and is defined thusly:

so·cial·ism
n.

1. Any of various theories or systems of social organization in which the means of producing and distributing goods is owned collectively or by a centralized government that often plans and controls the economy.
2. The stage in Marxist-Leninist theory intermediate between capitalism and communism, in which collective ownership of the economy under the dictatorship of the proletariat has not yet been successfully achieved.


Through the 70s and early 80s Britain moved away from the socialist model whereby one took British Rail or drove a British Leyland car to jobs at British Steel.

I understand this is informal web chit chat and not structured debate, but deliberately using terms incorrectly is a sure sign of a weak argument in either case, as well as, in this specific case, being an overused and tiresome epithet for anything to the left of David Duke on these boards. If you are going to be wrong at least be wrong with originality and use a less hackneyed incorrect term.


And we get upset when people call magazines "clips" yet not when people confuse rather more important terms like "democracy" and "socialism"

While you are technically correct, I use the terms interchangably for a reason.

To call a democracy a democracy is in effect praising it, due to the largely successful efforts of the media to pretend that America is and was designed to be such. While democracy is a horrible form of government, most Americans actually believe we have one here, and that it is the most desirable form of government. Mention "democracy" and you'll get cheers. Socialism, on the other hand, gets their attention (though thanks to the dramatic leftward shift across the enitre world, even socialism is becoming accepted by many as legitimate...poor fools). Communism is my favorite term, because it most accurately describes where nations that embrace either of the first two governments are headed. It also is a word that still retains most of its deserved stigma--the other two have been mediafied, and no longer convey the dire warning they should.

So there you have it. I choose to follow practicality and reality rather than technicality in this matter.

 

[Phetro]

Maybe the problem is not the "untold millions" taxing our socialist services, maybe the problem is that we provide those services to begin with. If we got rid of public welfare and public education and let our PRIVATE healthcare system fend for its self, perhaps we wouldn't have a problem?

That is correct, yes.

Is it OK for countless millions of able bodied Americans to be on welfare and tax our public education and heathcare systems?

Not at all. Both systems should be privatized, which would not only decrease their relative costs, but also improve their efficacy.

I pay for my health insurance. I pay for my daughter to go to private schools. I have not now, nor have I ever been on welfare. Why should I pay for anyone to receive those services regardless of their national origin or immigration status? I drive through downtown Waco all the time and I can't tell you how many able bodied adults wandering around hanging out not working. How many of them am I paying for?

The answer is to scrap welfare and public assistance for everyone.

That would be a solution to many of our nation's troubles. However, it would at that time become necessary for individuals to once again concern themselves with the welfare of others, being that the government would not assist. Therefore, the reinstitution and support of private charities would have to return to pre-World War II levels in order to accommodate the change. And unfortunately, along with the Age of the Nanny State has come the encouraged lack of generosity seen to be so prevalent in every generation since the 1960s. This entire trend needs to be reversed, that Americans once again support each other, and also nurture the good will and brotherly love upon which this nation and many of its institutions, both public and private, were founded.

 

[Gordon Fink]

Communism is my favorite term, because it most accurately describes where nations that embrace either of the first two governments are headed.…

Actually, that’s not correct. The nation-states you describe are practicing casual socialism, which will never get them to communism … not ever—assuming communism were achievable in the first place, which we would probably agree is not the case.

On topic, I’ll tell you how to solve the “problem” of poor, brown people “illegally” immigrating to the United States. Stop voting for Republicans and Democrats. All their leadership cares about is power and wealth. The Democrats need poor voters to exploit, and the Republicans need poor workers to exploit, so neither has a good reason to stop the flow.

~G. Fink

 

[Phetro]

Actually, that’s not correct. The nation-states you describe are practicing casual socialism, which will never get them to communism … not ever—assuming communism were achievable in the first place, which we would probably agree is not the case.

We don't agree on that. And banning guns while feminizing entire societies and promoting victimology, and consolidating power from the individual to the government is in no way "casual." That's what most of Europe is doing right now. And that's the brink of communism: where the dictator pretends that the proletariat rules.

On topic, I’ll tell you how to solve the “problem” of poor, brown people “illegally” immigrating to the United States. Stop voting for Republicans and Democrats. All their leadership cares about is power and wealth. The Democrats need poor voters to exploit, and the Republicans need poor workers to exploit, so neither has a good reason to stop the flow.

I'd like to know why you typed the words "problem" and "illegally" in quotation marks. Do you actually think there's not a problem, and that they're getting here legally?

 

[Commissar Gribb]

Mexico is land stolen from the natives by the Spanish. How come there aren't people whining and complaining that they lost their heritage and language to the Spanish conquerors?

RETURN MEXICO TO THE AZTECS!

And banning guns while feminizing entire societies and promoting victimology, and consolidating power from the individual to the government is in no way "casual."

If I was a woman, I would be offended by your use of the term "feminizing". LMAO.

 

[Old Dog]

Phetro, have you actually read Marx? Because your position is ... well, not accurate

That's what most of Europe is doing right now. And that's the brink of communism: where the dictator pretends that the proletariat rules.

... And "feminizing?" Not a verb I'd use for what you're attempting to describe. Spent much time in any European countries lately (with the exception of the U.K.)?

consolidating power from the individual to the government is in no way "casual."

Now then, let's get this straight: you're being critical of government for doing what governments do. Would you have any examples of governments that have actually relinquished their power and transferred it back to their citizens? Government by its very nature evolves toward expanding its power, growing its bureaucracy and making more rules, regulations and laws ... This isn't news.

 

[CAnnoneer]

And "feminizing?" Not a verb I'd use for what you're attempting to describe.

Funny you should mention that. More recently, I have been thinking along the same lines. In a way, Britain weakened and eventually collapsed after they got women voters in the 1870s. Coincidence or cause? Many of the anarchists and intellectual revolutionaries in Russia and Germany were women too. Note that most rabid leftists at home are women as well.

I understand the importance and fairness of equal rights, but cannot help thinking that women are naturally predisposed to softer, less violent, more ameliorative solutions. That is a fine approach when the skies are clear and a nurturing attitude is best. But, in a crisis, I fear a government needs certain callousness and severity, things that many women generally do not possess to the necessary extent.

Go ahead, flame away.

 

[Gordon Fink]

We don’t agree on that.…

So you think communism is achievable? Do tell? I would love to hear a theory for communism that doesn’t come from a Marxist/Leninist/Maoist/eugenicist/etc.

I’d like to know why you typed the words “problem” and “illegally” in quotation marks. Do you actually think there’s not a problem, and that they’re getting here legally?

I don’t think “illegal” immigration is the problem that folks like you claim to think it is. I also don’t think immigration is a crime, which is another story. If there is any problem, it is the welfare state, and I’m all for scaling that back.

~G. Fink

 

[XMP]

I think some of the talk of flags and festivals is off track. Of course most people think others should be allowed to remember fondly and even celebrate (occasionally) their heritage. That is completely different than subsidizing that culture. Generations of immigrants from all over the world have retainied aspects of their culture upon coming here; but, they had to accept and willingly participate in AMERICAN culture, in order to succeed. They had to learn the English language, get a job (or two), show up to work on time, etc. We are now making it possible, even attractive, to avoid this.

This American culture has links to Europe and roots in classical Greece, but one can, if so disposed, simply regard that as incidental. The more important things were that it was grounded on reason (the Enlightenment and the rule of Natural law, not laws) and theism (a belief in a creator God, with latitude on how exactly that was understood). Without those core beliefs inalienable rights to "life, liberty and property", free speech, and to bear arms evaporate or can simply be discarded as archaic at the whim of the 51%. If WE don't preserve those things American will die, maybe not right away, but it will simply be a "dead Nation walking".

On a related note, any good social scientist can tell you that an essential element of culture is language. If we lose a common and dominant language America will no longer exist. Sure there might be a country called the USA with similar borders, but it will be a different entity than the one we celebrate on July 4th.

 

[Low-Sci]

Selfdefenz, I think you're right that some people would quickly advocate turning the first amendment on its head if someone were burning a mexican flag. But those people are just as wrong as people who want to ban the burning of the american flag.

I don't know the real statistics as to hispanic population in madison, but there does seem to be a very large community.

I do think people migrating to this country should learn english. It is the international language of business, and its still this country's dominant language. On the other hand, I don't think they shouldn't be allowed to speak spanish and retain their culture.

 

[longeyes]

Funny you should mention that. More recently, I have been thinking along the same lines. In a way, Britain weakened and eventually collapsed after they got women voters in the 1870s. Coincidence or cause? Many of the anarchists and intellectual revolutionaries in Russia and Germany were women too. Note that most rabid leftists at home are women as well.

I understand the importance and fairness of equal rights, but cannot help thinking that women are naturally predisposed to softer, less violent, more ameliorative solutions. That is a fine approach when the skies are clear and a nurturing attitude is best. But, in a crisis, I fear a government needs certain callousness and severity, things that many women generally do not possess to the necessary extent.

Go ahead, flame away.

Less Ruth more ruthlessness?

 

[dmallind]

I lived under Thatcher for 10 years or so. She had more callousness and severity in one finger than Darth Cheney can dream about having. Anybody can say "^&$% you" to a political officeholder - she made sure it actually happened

I knocked on doors for her second election (I was too young for the first). She was exactly right for Britain at the time, and is the reason the UK is not in anywhere near the economic trouble that France and Italy are now. Indira Gandhi had just a wee touch of political backbone too. Benazir Bhutto as well. Anybody here who would have wanted Golda Meir's job at that time?

Women may have, taken as a whole, slightly different priorities than men, again taken as a whole, but some of the most resolute political leaders of the last few decades have been women.

 

[Ezekiel]

Women may have, taken as a whole, slightly different priorities than men, again taken as a whole, but some of the most resolute political leaders of the last few decades have been women.

Absolute concur: "Maggie Iron Britches" was a personal favorite.

 

[CAnnoneer]

Women may have, taken as a whole, slightly different priorities than men, again taken as a whole, but some of the most resolute political leaders of the last few decades have been women.

It goes without question that there are notable exceptions. But, as a voting mass, they are very different.

 

[Malone LaVeigh]

So I guess burning American flags, turning them over, or ripping them down to replace with foreign flags should also be okay because of 1A?

Well, yes, as a matter of fact.

 

[BFWE]

"cheese-eating surrender-monkey lingo"

I really like that!

 

[Biker]

This whole illegal immigrant thing has been blown out of proportion. As White House Press Secretary Tony Snow said today when addressing the merits of the guest worker program, "If you had a traffic ticket and you paid it, you're not forever a speeder, are you?"

Biker aka an Ex-Republican