Hypothetical Situation: A police officer tells you to help him arrest someone!

[silverking]

These incidents bring up another interesting " WHAT IF" situation. Let's assume that I am in a restaurant or store and in close proximity to a LEO who is having his lunch or shopping. Suddenly a bg rushes in and announces a holdup and is armed and waving his gun in a threatening manner. At this point, the bg hasn't noticed the leo or myself as we have taken cover in hopes of better assesing the situation (or cowering, which sounds a little more realistic in my case). I am in a position that I can get the attention of the officer and I let him know I am in possession of a ccw permit and I am offering my assistance. If he accepts my help and asks that I back him up, am I going down if shots are fired and someone other than the bg gets hit whether it was my shot or the leo's? Keeping in mind that nobody heard the cop ask for my help. It really sounds kinda far-fetched, but, I suppose it could happen.

 

[Duramaximum]

This is an interesting subject. I did a ride-along with our police department in Missoula, MT and the officer I rode with told me that if he was getting the crap kicked out of him, I couldn't help him. I have friend who did a ride along with a friend of his who is a cop in Ronan, Montana. He was told if they got into trouble, my friend had to help or he could charged with something like 'not assisting a peace officer.' It was something to do with our Good Samaritan law.

Just food for thought.

 

[buck00]

The cop who was jumped said thanks, and let me walk off without even asking my name.

In general it would be very embarassing for an LEO to have to admit he needed help from a random civilian because he was physically over powered by a perp, so don't feel too bad he blew you off afterwards.


If I saw an LEO being beat up, yes I would jump in and help him. I think that is our civic duty.

I remember seeing a video of a tiny female cop being attacked by a 6'6" perp in a parking lot... and the struggle went on for a long time, and there may have been people driving by who just slowed down, shrugged, and drove on.

 

[bsf]

........I have friend who did a ride along with a friend of his who is a cop in Ronan, Montana. He was told if they got into trouble, my friend had to help or he could charged with something like 'not assisting a peace officer.' It was something to do with our Good Samaritan law.

Just food for thought.

Yeh, I do not know about this. Would like to seem some law reference that backs this up, both parts. In addition, I thought "Good Samaritan" usually referred to holding blameless someone who was trying to help within their ability, not as a requirement you had to provide assistance.

 

[packnrat]

pending what is up I would help out a leo in need, but only after he asked for the help. or if i saw that the bg is going to hurt the leo very badly, ie: has gun pointed to downed officer.

and i would try to get out of dodge befor others arived, as i do not want to be sued.

 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

taurusowner,

I'm curious, what type of training? Arresting someone? Self-Defense? Combat? Military? LE?

Military police. Not as in depth training as a civilian police academy, but more than enough to help an officer in trouble should that arise. I've made a some apprehensions(arrests) doing garrison work, though none were violent so far.

 

[GuyWithQuestions]

Military police. Not as in depth training as a civilian police academy, but more than enough to help an officer in trouble should that arise. I've made a some apprehensions(arrests) doing garrison work, though none were violent so far.

Are there any techniques that you learned that would be helpful to a non-LEO civilian if they were asked to help an officer, or that they could use if they noticed that an officer was getting beat up by a suspect (providing that the suspect's not armed)?

 

[Macmac]

It depends on what the reasons are. I was asked once. The cops were asking if I knew the guy next door, and when I said he is a friend they asked for help.

My friend was engaged in suicide, with a fire arm, and right out of his mind. The cops were thinking a friend might have a better chance to stop the event. It did..

 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

Are there any techniques that you learned that would be helpful to a non-LEO civilian if they were asked to help an officer, or that they could use if they noticed that an officer was getting beat up by a suspect (providing that the suspect's not armed)?

Non-compliant takedowns and use of OC spray are the best methods. The only type of situation I can see an officer needing help would be where he has multiple non compliant suspects and no backup, like during a traffic stop gone bad. Restraining the extra suspects while the officer deals with them one by one officially with arrests and cuffs. Basically it would come down to using OC spray, which I do carry, and then ground fighting; trying to get in a position where you have the dominant restraint position over the suspect. Use of pressure points, like the calf "dead legging" pressure point, and various arm-bars would be best.

If I were in my car and I saw an immediate threat to an officers life, I would probably just hit the bad guy with my car instead of shooting them. Pulling a weapon around a cop, even if you're the good guy and trying to help, might end up getting you shot by the cop.

 

[Squeeze1off]

I would be inclined to help anyone that I knew to be on the short-end of the BG stick.
Not a lot of ambiguity about who's the BG if one of them is an LEO.
I'm also inclined to follow an officer's commands at all times.

 

[A man with a gun!]

First of all, I don't carry when on the job but....

In my line of work this happens every couple of years. We call a Depuity when the poop starts getting deep and being that we're pretty rural, its fairly likely that we will only get one officer. His back up can be a long-long ways away.

The usual Scenario is the officer goes to make the arrest and a struggle begins. If the Depuity obviously has the upper hand... Great!

If not, without hesitation I'll pitch in and grab on to one of the trouble makers arms, legs, get my knee behind the bad guys head, help hold him down.... Whatever it takes to assist the officer in making the arrest. And I think that it's almost expected of us as good citizens if things happen to swing that way.

Like I said we're rural. Most likely I personally know the Depuity, his wife and probably the names of all his children.

If anybody thinks I'm gonna sit there with my hands in my pockets and watch my friend get thumped by a dirt bag Adam Henry yer dead wrong.

 

[MASTEROFMALICE]

If I'm ever on my back and being beaten unconcious I say anything and everything is fair game. In that situation if a citizen stuck a pickaxe in the guy's back I'd get up and thank the hell out of him.

It really all depends on the situation. If the fight is fairly neutral than using bare hands to turn it in the officer's favor would be good. Even if you just grab on to one hand immobilize that it would be a great help. If the two are squaring off and you move up behind the bad guy and knock him down, that would be great, too.

But again, if the situation is really ugly (I think back on an Ayoob article where the bad guy shot a cop with a hidden revolver and went to the cop's car to get a machinegun) all bets are off.

Clearly, if you engage a suspect who is using lethal force against me I'll do everything I can to ensure it is completely understood that what you did saved my life and was well within the confines of the law.

Are there any techniques that you learned that would be helpful to a non-LEO civilian if they were asked to help an officer, or that they could use if they noticed that an officer was getting beat up by a suspect (providing that the suspect's not armed)?