"I shot him. ...I can't believe I did this..."

[RubenZ]

Bottom line is the threat was gone. The minute the threat left the building the clerk should have just said its ok officer, the left blah blah. I can understand if the threat continued to loot around the store or hang out there but they werent. They were loading up the kids and leaving.

Bottom line fellas is the Clerk is going down big time. He has so much going against him and rightfully so.


Man, I bet the guy didn't even ask nicely. Too bad I doubt we'll ever know the truth.

 

[nemoaz]

Man, I bet the guy didn't even ask nicely. Too bad I doubt we'll ever know the truth.

Wow! I take it you have been thrown out of a few stores, Ruben. You sure are reading a lot into this. And apparently assault victims cannot call the police and report the criminals vehicle tags in your neck of the woods.

Bottom line fellas is the Clerk is going down big time. He has so much going against him and rightfully so.

Sorry. Don't see it that way, but time will tell. What you forget (or don't know) is that the defendant gets the benefit of the doubt and has the right to fully examine and expose to the jury any criminal character of the dead guy. I'm sure this is going to be interesting.

Final thought. A good defense attorney doesn't really care whether the gun was drawn or not. Why? Because at worst that supports a charge of brandishing and nothing more. If the dead criminal rushes someone with a gun drawn on him, it usually means he intends to take the gun from him which further supports a self defense claim. This BTW is going to be a hard sell for the prosecutor because no sane person rushes someone with a gun... so he's either blind with rage or hell bent on more crime. If the jury believes the store owner, then the gun was holstered until the guy attacked him again....

My strategy and tactic is to follow the guy outside to ensure he isn't further damaging my property and to get a kind of description of the vehicle and direction of flight and to defend myself if the maniac attacks me again.

 

[Fred Fuller]

In several threads here it has been mentioned that, given the opportunity, it's a good idea to dial 911 and 'let the tape run' during the course of your burglary/assault/home invasion/whatever.

That is exactly what this young man did- he let the tape run while talking to the 911 dispatcher. There is a record of what he said.

So far that is all the electronic data that has been presented. It may be the store had security cameras that gave a view of events in the parking lot- that has not yet come to light. But the 911 tape IS there. Unfortunately the young man's words sound more incriminatory than exculpatory in this case, on first review.

Skip Gochenour is going to start demanding royalty payments from me as much as I post this, but be that as it may... . PLEASE go read the lecture notes at http://www.teddytactical.com/archive/MonthlyStudy/2006/02_StudyDay.htm . And study them carefully. If there is any chance you might ever have to use a firearm in defense of yourself or your family, you NEED to think about what's included in those lecture notes.

You need to think about your behavior post- incident very carefully. You do not need to talk yourself into trouble.

Stay safe,

lpl/nc

 

[RubenZ]

OK well, I'm sure if he was on the phone when he stepped out the 911 dispatcher SHOULD be able to hear the other man verbally assault him or at least something to hint that the clerks life was in danger. I have yet to read anything about that.

 

[JaxNovice]

It really does not matter if any of us think that the shooter followed proper protocol. All that matters is what a jury is going think.

That being said, I will bet almost anything this guy gets convicted. No if, ands or buts about it.

 

[hacksaw]

Update

The Shooter was arrested yesterday afternoon. He and his father rented an Escalade and tried to flee town. Violation of bail agreement I think.....

 

[SKeefe]

I didn't realize it at first, but there is a copy of the transcript in one of the links above. I will post it here so everyone will see it.

Transcript of 911 tape

Here is a transcript of most of the tape of a call a man who identifies himself as Eli Eliyahu made to 911 on Friday. The Sun News deleted curse words and, for clarity, cut out some dialogue of the 911 operator asking the man to describe his surroundings in order to locate the beachwear store.

Eliyahu | I need a cop right here right now

911 Operator | Alright, hold on just a second right here, if you tell me where you are...

Eliyahu | 3055 S. Kings Highway.

911 Operator | 3055 S. Kings Highway?

Eliyahu | Yeah, this guy just assaulted me here.

911 Operator | Ok. Are you there down in Myrtle Beach or -

Eliyahu | The big shark store. I need a cop here right now.

911 Operator | Well, Sir I got to get your location before-

Eliyahu | 3055 s. Kings Highway.

911 Operator | I have, I have that sir, just calm down. If it’s Myrtle Beach I’m going to send you a Myrtle Beach police-

Eliyahu | It’s not Myrtle Beach, it’s Garden City.

911 Operator | It’s Garden City? So that would be Horry County.

Eliyahu | Do you want to write down his license plate?

911 Operator | 305 - Did he already take off?

Eliyahu | Get the ... out of here.

911 Operator | Give me a - Give me a tag, in case he gets-

Eliyahu | License plate is ...

911 Operator | That doesn’t sound like South Carolina.

Eliyahu | It’s North Carolina.

911 Operator | A North Carolina plate. I got that put down here. Now give me your name please.

Eliyahu | You’re going to get it, bro.

911 Operator | Give me - Listen to me.

Eliyahu | Hey, Get the ... out of here.

911 Operator | Talk to me, sir, talk to me. Listen to me sir. Talk to me give me a name and a number to call you back.

Eliyahu | Get the ... . Get the ... out- Get off-

Eliyahu | You better send a cop here.

911 Operator | I am sir, I’m trying to get your name sir. You said you’re down in Garden City? (In the background, a woman screams, "Oh my god.")

Eliyahu | Get the ... out of here.

911 Operator | Sir. Sir, please focus on me.

Eliyahu | I shot him.

911 Operator | Sir, please-

Eliyahu | I just shot him.

911 Operator | Excuse me?

Eliyahu | I just shot him.

911 Operator | You just shot him?

Eliyahu | Yeah, he ..., he came at me. He already pushed me. He was swinging at me.

911 Operator | You’re at S. Kings Highway there in Murrells- in, uh, Garden City?

Eliyahu | Yeah. You gotta send a cop here. I just shot him.

911 Operator | I will sir I’m – I’ll send an ambulance right away and the police.

Eliyahu | I felt like he was going to ... kill me.

911 Operator | Alright. Sir, focus on me. What store are you in front of?

Eliyahu | It’s the shark store, the one with a big shark.

911 Operator | The one with the big shark?

Eliyahu | Yeah.

911 Operator | Shark store. And you said you’re in Garden City though?

Eliyahu | Yes.

911 Operator | At 3055 S. Kings Highway, is that correct?

Eliyahu | Yes. Can you get a cop here quick, this girl’s going crazy on me.

911 Operator | I’m going to do that. I’m going to send an ambulance there as well, sir.

Eliyahu | Are you going to ... (muffled) (Horn beeps.) Get out of here. He was coming at me. And he was - He already pushed me in the store.

911 Operator | I think you just need to get a - Where’s the gun now, sir?

Eliyahu | It’s on, in my, it’s concealed.

911 Operator | Well, sir, I think you need to put it in your car, in your, residence, before the, not in your residence, but put it in your…

Eliyahu | No, I have my concealed permit. I have a license to carry.

(Muffled voices)

Eliyahu | You need to bring an ambulance right now.

911 Operator | I’m, I’ve already, I’m dispatching something. I’ve already dispatched something, sir. Hang in there. I want to get your name there, too, and everything.

Eliyahu | I don’t want to get arrested.

911 Operator | Sir, I don’t know what’s going to happen.

Eliyahu | He told me he was going to ... kill me. He started coming at me, and I told him to leave the store. I went to get his license plate.

911 Operator | Yes, hold on one second. (That’s what he said, garden city but that’s the address he gave me, sir. He said that it’s some kind of shark store.) Give me something else that’s around it.

Eliyahu | It’s the big shark. It’s next to Inlet Square Mall

...

Eliyahu | People are looking at me like I just ...—

911 Operator | Just calm down.

Eliyahu | I’m trying. I’m trying. Oh my god. Until then, I’ve never had to use my gun before.

...

Eliyahu | He’s on the ground. He’s bleeding. But I’m not getting next to him because his, I don’t know, his girlfriend, she started running after me and I started running away. He starting coming at me. He said I’m going to ... kill you. I just wanted him to leave the store and I wanted to get his license plate.

...

911 Operator | Where was he shot?

Eliyahu | I don’t know, in the chest? Can you send a cop here, please?

911 Operator | Alright, everything’s already been dispatched. I just gave…

Eliyahu | These people are about to come kill me or something.

911 Operator Put your gun in your car.

Eliyahu | I can’t put it in my car, it’s in my holster. I don’t have my keys and I’m not going back in the store.

Eliyahu | I have a license to carry. He threatened my life and he already pushed me in the store. He came at me like he was going to kill me … He told me to get out of here. He started coming at me and told me he was going to … kill me. I can’t believe I did this. I never wanted to pull my gun out. I pulled it out and he kept coming at me.

911 Operator | I understand sir.

Eliyahu | Nobody understands something like this.

911 Operator | I know. I know.

 

[TallPine]

He threatened my life and he already pushed me in the store. He came at me like he was going to kill me … He told me to get out of here. He started coming at me and told me he was going to … kill me. I can’t believe I did this. I never wanted to pull my gun out. I pulled it out and he kept coming at me.

Sounds like basically what is always recommended for folks to say after a defensive shooting.

Too bad that he tried to skip town though ...

I can't believe how some folks here on THR rushed to condemn the shooter

 

[HippieCrusher]

Don't want to look like I'm condemning Eliyahu, but I have personally witnessed run-ins with his family in a previous life. Just because someone has a clean record it doesn't mean they're clean. It just means they're slick. In this case, slick and well connected.

I'm a SC CWP holder, and this bodes poorly for us all giving hippies and liberals more ammo to throw at us. The situation occured less than half a mile from my office, on a stretch of road that I drive down everyday. The backdrop of the incident was a very highly traveled road in a heavily visited tourist community.

Had he shot one of the children during his adrenalin pumped moment or into a mini van full of vacationers, would there be so many people rushing to defend his actions or quoting the castle law. Surely not.

It will be up to a jury to decide Eli's fate. It was a poor, immature decision on his part. Part of the SC CWP classroom training indocrinates that you never present your weapon until you have made the concious decision to use it if need be. I don't buy into he claim that he never wanted to fire.

 

[TallPine]

Had he shot one of the children during his adrenalin pumped moment or into a mini van full of vacationers, would there be so many people rushing to defend his actions or quoting the castle law. Surely not.

But that's not what happened. Apparently he shot very accurately.

I suppose that he could have fired a warning shot into the air and shot down the space shuttle, too.

I don't buy into he claim that he never wanted to fire.

You have a CCW - do you want to shoot somebody? (I didn't think so)

Now I wasn't there so maybe he didn't act properly, but from the report I can see how it very well could have been justified self defense.

 

[RubenZ]

Man that whole transcript is just going against him. I knew I knew it. He's going to be toast. If you did everything correctly and how you were trained, why would you FLEE.

 

[Im283]

This just goes to show that you should never escalate a situation.
So what he got pushed, the tourist took his family and was leaving. The threat was over. A push is hardly a reason to chase someone down to shoot them.

It might not be easy but sometimes you have to swallow your pride a little, he should have let it go and stayed indoors.

When carrying we all have to learn to be more tolerant.

 

[Jeff White]

If you did everything correctly and how you were trained, why would you FLEE.

We don't know if he was trained at all. We don't know if he did everything correctly. You could fill volumes with what we don't know about this case.

This thread was started so we could discuss how he handled himself with 911. THAT is the subject. Guilt, innocence and all the other aspects are off topic. THIS IS THE STRATEGIES AND TACTICS FORUM. IF YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE OTHER ASPECTS OF THE CASE FEEL FREE TO START ANOTHER THREAD IN LEGAL AND POLITICAL.

Jeff

 

[CountGlockula]

His 911 phone is empirical evidence of the situation, but it didn't save him from being in control of the situation.

Adrenaline + getting pushed = situation gone bad.

Being focused + getting pushed = a chance to difuse from going to jail.

 

[mortgagegirl]

I'm not going to say anything about the shoting. But I knew Bradley and he worked for my dad and was like a son to him. So with that said here is the update on Eli. Please don't say anything about me being on here b/c it is helping me see all side. I thank you for that. I also have a lic to carry a gun. So I do understand the class and what it takes to have my lic. Plus can see why you might say Eli had a right and on the other hand I know what the family and other customer said to the cops. With that said THANK YOU FOR WHAT YOU HAVE TO SAY. I WILL NOT GET MAD ABOUT YOU POST AFTER THIS.

The man who police say shot a customer outside a Garden City beachwear store last week found himself back in court Wednesday.

Myrtle Beach police arrested Eli Eliyahu Tuesday.

Police say he tried to rent a car; prosecutors say he was headed out of the country.

Eli Eliyahu marched back into court Wednesday morning to face charges of violating his bond.

Myrlte Beach police stopped Eliyahu and his father in Myrtle Beach Tuesday.

Police searched his car and found luggage in the back seat.

Prosecutors say Eliyahu planned to run.

Eliyahu's lawyer told the court, that's not the story.

"This is laundry that was in his mother's vehicle, this is not a rental vehicle. He and his father went to this place to rent a vehicle for his father or something," Eliyahu’s lawyer told the court Wednesday.

That something, the prosecutor told the court, was the first step in Eliyahu's plans to leave the country.

The judged doubled Eliyahu's original bond to $80,000.

Plus, Eliyahu will wear a GPS monitor on his leg that tracks his every move.

“I don't think it's right that he can walk around his house and my grandson can't walk around his," Brad Pope’s grandfather, Lloyd Georges told News13.

Brad Pope's family got the news of Eliyahu's arrest late last night.

"We thought this would keep him in jail until this could go to general sessions. Like I said, this is a little better than what it was anyway," Lloyd said following the bond hearing.

"If there's any violation of the law and he is convicted of any misdemeanor, anything from here to the court date, he will be brought back and his bond will be revoked and he will be denied by me," Horry County magistrate Chris Arakas told Eliyahu.

Eliyahu's new bond condition allows him to leave home to travel to and from work only.

The GPS tracking unit allows authorities to track Eliyahu to within six inches anywhere he goes.

Eliyahu's general sessions court date should be set within the next few weeks.

 

[T. Bracker]

The guy couldn't look out the window into the parking lot for the license plate and description of the vehicle for the police? Have to wonder about following a agitated individual outside??? I think I would have tried to see what I could from indoors.

 

[BullfrogKen]

You know, one year at the NTI we had a scenario set up where the Practitioner came home to an active home invasion. We showed the Practitioner pictures of his children, his wife, and Bill - his next door neighbor/best friend dressed in a suit. He was told his neighbor was a Class 3 afficianado.

The scenario unfolds . . . Most guys pull out the cell phone, dial 911, and leave the phone on as they enter the dwelling "to record my actions."

Their neighbor Bill was in the kitchen, dressed in the suit with an Uzi. He announced, "I heard your family screaming for help and grabbed my gun to help them."

One Practitioner told Bill to drop the gun. "Bill!! Drop the gun!!!" Bill did. The Practitioner then stepped around the corner and shot Bill twice. This was all "recorded" on the 911 dispatch tape.


Dialing 911 is a good idea. Dealing with an imminent problem that MUST be dealt with RIGHT NOW is also a good idea. I'm not convinced having everything you say recorded on the 911 tape is. I've seen way too many folks state things during scenarios or right afterwards that would seem to condemn them.


None of us know if Eliyahu acted properly or not. There isn't enough evidence. The 911 tape is going to be used against him, though. Dial 911 and ask for help. Or deal with the problem. But I don't think having everything you stated recorded helps. If anything, this proves statements made in the vacuum of context and without all the facts are harmful.

 

[RubenZ]

I'd like to hear the recording. That would be neat. Because if the guy was close to Eli, I'm sure you would hear his threats on the phone. That will be another piece of wood added to the fire.

 

[fireflyfather]

We don't even know if there are any windows at the store, much less ones that offer a good angle to see where the deceased was parked.

That transcript is a little telling, but without hearing tone of voice and background sounds, it would be hard to say if there was escalation or not. I can see the owner saying that stuff if the guy was glaring in a menacing way or loitering in the parking lot. Personally, if I am told to leave a property, and I see the property owner on the phone saying REAPEATEDLY that "you need to send a cop here", I think I would make an effort to leave quickly without making a scene, particularly if I already had laid my hands on the owner. The fact that he didn't leave in a timely way is pretty telling.

Having said that, repeatedly screaming obscenities at the guy as you are telling him to leave does not look good on a police transcript. It certainly is not high road. Nor is it smart from a psychological point of view. You already know the dude is willing to be physically violent.

All in all, looks like a Jury trial for sure now.

 

[Sir Aardvark]

This whole thread is hilarious!

Someone posts limited information on a shooting, and yet that scant amount of info is enough for some members here to call the shooter a murderer-
and then on the other hand, there are members saying that it was a legit shooting.

I would hate to have most of you guys on a jury that was going to decide my fate - it looks like you would already have your minds made up before you even showed up at the courthouse.

(P.S.: I said that this thread was funny, not the fact that someone - innocent or guiltly, mind you - was killed)

 

[SSN Vet]

absolutely stupid, unecessary use of deadly force and loss of life.....for what purpose? to file a complaint that someone pushed you?

he went out of the store looking for trouble and he found it.

if he had come out of the store towards me and my children with a drawn gun......I would think the worse, that he was in a rage of anger and going to shoot at my kids for running around the store.

then again.....on the flip side, parents today let their kids run all over the place reeping havoc and destruction and then go balistic when told to get their kids under control.

 

[BullfrogKen]

Jeff White said: This thread was started so we could discuss how he handled himself with 911. THAT is the subject. Guilt, innocence and all the other aspects are off topic. THIS IS THE STRATEGIES AND TACTICS FORUM. IF YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE OTHER ASPECTS OF THE CASE FEEL FREE TO START ANOTHER THREAD IN LEGAL AND POLITICAL.

Jeff, I think I'm just going to start deleting posts.

This is Strategies and Tactics. This is NOT Legal and Political.


If you don't know the difference . . . If you can't figure out how to separate the legal issues to evaluate it from the standpoint of strategies and tactics . . . Don't post a response.

 

[TallPine]

I apologize for getting "off-topic" - it is just so natural to respond to what others are saying.

I still don't see how the 911 transcript is so condemning ... the shooter states several times that the other guy had threatened to kill him. The 911 tape is just one piece of evidence, and it could go either way depending upon other evidence.

What bothers me is that now I'm really confused in an S&T sort of way. About a year and a half ago, we had someone at our door and I told them to leave right now and they didn't - we went back and forth for several minutes before they finally left. I came pretty close to drawing on him. Since then, I have been kicking myself because I didn't pickup the phone (which was right next to where I was standing) and dial 911 after he failed to leave, in order to get the further exchange on record. (It would probably take 30 minutes for a deputy to even get here)

Now it seems like everybody thinks that is a bad idea ...????????????

(and this is not an academic question for me, because we are once again on "red alert" this week and next )

 

[buzz_knox]

In your specific situation, calling 911 is a very good idea. It allows you to get on record that there is a trespasser who is refusing to leave, and (if true) that you are afraid the confrontation may escalate. Also, the first one to dial 911 has the advantage in getting their side of the story out first.

And, depending on officer availability and dep't responsiveness, you might actually have an officer arrive if you call.

 

[Elmer Fudd]

This whole thread is hilarious!

Someone posts limited information on a shooting, and yet that scant amount of info is enough for some members here to call the shooter a murderer-
and then on the other hand, there are members saying that it was a legit shooting.

I would hate to have most of you guys on a jury that was going to decide my fate - it looks like you would already have your minds made up before you even showed up at the courthouse.

(P.S.: I said that this thread was funny, not the fact that someone - innocent or guiltly, mind you - was killed)

+1.

What would be better to post in this forum would be old incidents which have already been adjudicated (sp?) and are considered closed, either through having gone through the legal system or having no charges filed and there is a much more extensive factual record. I find that press accounts rarely rise to the level of "factual record." They are usually written by people who have no subject matter expertise, wear their political bias on their sleeve, are written in the immediate aftermath, and are edited for length by an editor even further removed from the "facts."

I would love someone to post the initial scenario of an old case for comments, then gradually release more info from trial or further investigation. It would probably show a lot of us that our initial impressions/judgements are incorrect.