earplug
Member
25/20 in a pump action like the Remington Model 25. Imagine life without needing a 22 LR.
If you could resurrect a dead cartridge, which one would you chose?
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Cannibul
Member
I've wanted a .25 cal straight wall round for a long time. 25/20 brass is thin. Something that will move a 75 gr bullet around 2000 fps would be awesome.
6mm Lee Navy 3300 fps in the 1890's.
I think it would work today as the reasons it failed before have been taken care of.....metals are better, and you can push bullets that fast now without the issues....or issues that bad.
But again why....it was a good answer for what the navy wanted it for back in that time, but today....past the cool factor, you just don't need it.
earplug
Member
We might be able to live with the 32/20
lastofthebreed
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I own a Remington Model 673 in 6.5 Rem Mag. It's a fun gun to shoot and works well on the whitetail deer where I hunt.
Don McDowell
Member
25-20 single shot in a stevens 44 1/2 will do pretty close to that.
tark
Member
Uhhhh....wrong!
The original load was a loooooong 135 gr bullet at 2550 FPS. This was found to be to erosive on the bore and a 112 grain bullet was adopted at 2560. didn't really help much. The 75 grain bullet was never loaded in any factory rounds that I know of. It is true that the cartridge WILL achieve 3300 FPS with that weight bullet, using modern powders (3031, 37 gr. ) but that is not a factory load and it is extremely doubtful that one was ever assembled or fired before 1907.You mean one of THESE??!! One of the most fun guns I own, Slick as greased lightning, ten round mag and inch groups at fifty yards. Bore is a tiny bit rough or it might do better. Hornady makes a wicked little 60 gr JHP that 12 grains of 4227 will push along at about 2100 FPS. Blows up gallon jugs full of water about as well as any hornet. I get four reloadings out of a case.
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Uhhhh....wrong!
You mean one of THESE??!! One of the most fun guns I own, Slick as greased lightning, ten round mag and inch groups at fifty yards. Bore is a tiny bit rough or it might do better. Hornady makes a wicked little 60 gr JHP that 12 grains of 4227 will push along at about 2100 FPS. Blows up gallon jugs full of water about as well as any hornet. I get four reloadings out of a case.
Yes you are WONG....75 grain at 3300fps....and it was a factory loading UMC loading, not a Winchester loading.
You have to understand it was made to poke holes in torpedo boats....at the time a real issue to larger ships....this is why the Navy wanted something small fast and hard hitting for those lightly armored torpedo boats.
Read up more and don't get all your info from wikipeda.
CraigC
Sixgun Nut
I'd love to see a resurgence of the .25-20. Or legitimize the .25Hornet or the .25Flea (Hornet blown straight and slightly shortened).
I have a thing for itty bitty boolits goin real fast.....it is just fun to me.....then on the other hand I like great big fat bullets going slow (historical arms).
It is the unique that drives my gun interests.....what was it like to shoot this....this is some of the fun to me.
It is the unique that drives my gun interests.....what was it like to shoot this....this is some of the fun to me.
aarondhgraham
Member
I am not quite certain this is a dead cartridge,,,
It's certainly scarce if it is still being made somewhere.
.218 Bee would be my choice.
I dunno what the rifle's make/model was,,,
But my neighbors dad had one with a HUGE scope on it,,,
He used to sit out on his back porch and pop field rats in the evening.
It's pure nostalgia but I was always enamored with that little cartridge,,,
I know where I could buy a bolt rifle but it would hurt my heart to not be able to shoot it.
Aarond
.
It's certainly scarce if it is still being made somewhere.
.218 Bee would be my choice.
I dunno what the rifle's make/model was,,,
But my neighbors dad had one with a HUGE scope on it,,,
He used to sit out on his back porch and pop field rats in the evening.
It's pure nostalgia but I was always enamored with that little cartridge,,,
I know where I could buy a bolt rifle but it would hurt my heart to not be able to shoot it.
Aarond
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CraigC
Sixgun Nut
As I've said numerous times, they are not always good reasons. You give the fickle shooter way too much credit. Lots of good ideas fall by the wayside for seemingly ridiculous, bewildering or unknown reasons.
The .280 British was a great concept at the time and way ahead of US military thinking, but today not so much. It's too long to fit into an AR15 magazine and under powered compared to the latest craze in the form of the 6.5 Creedmoor. Hornady factory 6.5 Creedmoor loads push the 140gr and 143gr ELD bullets to 2,700 fps and my handloads are up around 2,800 fps so I don't see that the .280 British offers anything that consumers would want. Heck, you could probably download a 6.5 Creedmoor 140gr load to 2,550 fps if you wanted a softer shooting load with a better BC compared to the equivalent 140gr .284 cal bullet in the .280 Brit.
As for anything else, I don't see a need for any new cartridges let alone resurrecting old ones.
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Craig I think you're right. This same thing happens here as far as the debates go. One cartridge has a slight advantage (such as velocity) and some will discount the slower cartridge as useless and they can't understand why anyone would own such a cartridge. But sometimes that's all they consider. But they fail to take barrel life, brass life, amount of powder needed to achieve such advantage, recoil, etc. Some also don't don't think about the fact that that lesser cartridge may have 100,000 one shot kills or hundreds of thousands of 10 ring bullseyes in competition.
Now, some cartridges have been so far eclipsed by others, and at a lesser price, that the lesser cartridge simply can't survive. But many still find a way. Some are only available in certain platforms. That can hurt or help depending on the popularity, or limiting capabilities, of the platform. For others, the cartridge design is the limiting factor.
Some people just read something on the internet that has been written by someone with a degree, or a thesaurus next to their keyboard, and they take it as gospel no matter how absurd it appears to those with real knowledge.
That being said... I'd like to see the 45-80 Sharpshooter, 358 WCF, and the 50-140.
CoalTrain49
Member
I had a 218 Mashburn Bee for a while. Nice quite little varmint shooter. Sorta like a 223 with a can on it.
Or sometimes they completely disregard the faster cartridge (6mm Rem.)
I don't care at this point how much powder is burned to get the extra 200 fps. Just like in some situations you dont care how much more gas your Camaro is using.
tark
Member
I cannot find a source for this loading and I may well be wrong, lord knows that I have been wrong often enough in the past ! Can you give me a source because I can't find anything at all mentioning a 75 gr bullet being loaded by anybody, at any time, other that handloaders,for this cartridge. Also it seems rather odd, the idea of using a .25 caliber bullets to knock holes in torpedo boats. I assume they were meant to hit the crew, not sink the boat. Sinking any boat with with a 25 caliber rifle would be a rather time consuming exercise in futility, I think.
My sources are Wiki, cartridges of the world, Small Arms of the World, U.S Military Bolt Action Rifles, by Canfield, and everything I can find on U.M.C. cartridges, along with others. My cartridge collector friends tell me that factory loaded 75 grain 6mm Lee Navy ammo does not exist. Make a fool out of me and prove me wrong
You wouldn't be the first to do so....We can both agree on this: The 250-3000 A.K.A. the 250 Savage, most certainly is NOT the first to exceed 3000 F.P.S.
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Which in the end brings it down to personal preference. And luckily, we live in a country that gives us freedom to choose, and offers so many choices. Sure, some have fallen by the wayside. And there are a few who wish certain ones hadn't. But as was stated earlier, so many cartridges overlap. It's (almost) absurd. Most wish a cartridge was resurrected due to nostalgic or sentimental reasons. And some newer cartridges fell because they didn't really offer anything better than what was already available. It was just new. Snd some people view "new" as "better". And they just simply weren't. Reminds me of the EtronX rifles from Remington several years ago.
CapnMac
Member
Well, one has to remember how it was aborned.
FN wanted the PDW contract pretty badly.
They had committed to transverse orientation to keep magazine capacity while not increasing overall lenght.
Their initial product testing had identified 3cm as the widest magazine ergonomics would allow.
At which point they are looking at 9mm Win/9mm longo/9x22, ecept they want a bullet with a far, far better BC.
Which basically sent them looking down the road of the various .223/5.7mm rounds, on a vague theory that it would "seel" better to military agencies already using that diameter round.
They probably could have gone to, oh, 6.5x25 and still called that an "intermediate: round (with limited handgun potential).
Maybe.
Perhaps.
The 5.7 Johnson would have been as logical as a spitzer-pointed .30 carbine (which was what some critics of the P-90 suggested as an 'instead').
The idea of electric ignition has real merit. Instantaneous lock time
That didn't work out too well for Remington.
Deaf Smith
Member
.32 Winchester Special. Update it with Ackley Improved case, Nosler bullets, and LeverRevolution power.
Bet it would get a 190 gr SP Nosler at 2400 fps from a 20 inch barrel.
Deaf
Bet it would get a 190 gr SP Nosler at 2400 fps from a 20 inch barrel.
Deaf
zb338
Member
I'm still mad about the loading companies stopping the making of 25/20 ammo
and brass. The 25/20 is a fine little small game cartridge.
Zeke
and brass. The 25/20 is a fine little small game cartridge.
Zeke
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