If you have to force it - don't

Status
Not open for further replies.
d31tc

d31tc

Member
Joined
Sep 18, 2019
Messages
584
Location
MN
Sometimes I have to kick myself. So, even though I've been reloading for years, the reality is those years have been relatively low volume and somewhat sporadic. Early on in my experience, I bent my first decapping pin like the one pictured. I was a newbie. It was literally the first time I was using a dedicated RCBS decapping die as opposed to the cartridge specific die and didn't know how much force should be applied with a crimped primer, used too much force and, BAM, done decapping when I bent the pin. I had to order replacements. Then it was a challenge to unscrew the retainer cap, but I finally figured it out.

WELL, yesterday I was decapping 9mm brass and the decapper hit resistance. Pulled out the brass, inserted another, no problem. Inserted the problem brass and still hit resistance. Pulled it out again and tried another, no problem. Thinking just a stubbornly crimped primer, I figured I would used just a little more force. You guessed it, I bent my decapping pin again. You'd think I would have learned from my very first experience, but sometimes you have to beat it into me with a hammer. (Note: I was busy looking for new pins and haven't looked at what the problem was with the piece of brass. I'll have to look at that when I get home from work)

I set the brass aside and went looking for the replacement pins I have. Our house underwent a remodel and addition the last few years and my reloading room has moved twice and all my stuff is scattered. Do you think I have any clue where those tiny replacement pins are? If you think I don't have a clue, you would be right. Decapping session terminated.

A couple rules that I tell my kids ALL THE TIME:

1. If you have to force it - don't.
2. If you THINK it will be a problem - it will be a problem.

Now do as I say, not as I do....



1700573518589.png
 
N555 said:
What was it a berdan case?
Click to expand...
I don't know yet. This was just last night and I was more concerned about finding those damn replacement pins :uhoh: and ran out of time. I haven't had a chance to go back and look, but I will when I get home from work and post the results.

This kind of goes to my cheapness/stubbornness. It's not like this piece of brass was a piece of Norma 505 Gibbs brass (yes, I had to look that up on Ammoseek to find an example of really expensive brass). It's a $0.01 piece of 9mm brass! Just chuck it to the scrap bin! I think I learned my lesson and reset my priorities - maybe.
 
Two is one, and one is none.

That rule applies to decapping pins and dies... Very likely most of us have been where you are, and that's why I have a backup decap die. I also have a backup .308 sizer die... for when I stick a case. That also circles back to the original premise of 'if it doesn't go, don't force it.' ;)
 
d31tc said:
Sometimes I have to kick myself. So, even though I've been reloading for years, the reality is those years have been relatively low volume and somewhat sporadic. Early on in my experience, I bent my first decapping pin like the one pictured. I was a newbie. It was literally the first time I was using a dedicated RCBS decapping die as opposed to the cartridge specific die and didn't know how much force should be applied with a crimped primer, used too much force and, BAM, done decapping when I bent the pin. I had to order replacements. Then it was a challenge to unscrew the retainer cap, but I finally figured it out.

WELL, yesterday I was decapping 9mm brass and the decapper hit resistance. Pulled out the brass, inserted another, no problem. Inserted the problem brass and still hit resistance. Pulled it out again and tried another, no problem. Thinking just a stubbornly crimped primer, I figured I would used just a little more force. You guessed it, I bent my decapping pin again. You'd think I would have learned from my very first experience, but sometimes you have to beat it into me with a hammer. (Note: I was busy looking for new pins and haven't looked at what the problem was with the piece of brass. I'll have to look at that when I get home from work)

I set the brass aside and went looking for the replacement pins I have. Our house underwent a remodel and addition the last few years and my reloading room has moved twice and all my stuff is scattered. Do you think I have any clue where those tiny replacement pins are? If you think I don't have a clue, you would be right. Decapping session terminated.

A couple rules that I tell my kids ALL THE TIME:

1. If you have to force it - don't.
2. If you THINK it will be a problem - it will be a problem.

Now do as I say, not as I do....



View attachment 1180768
Click to expand...
Words of wisdom 👍
The mistake I can’t seem to stop making is decapping using the universal die then forgetting to tumble before resizing. I have labels just to track the progress of a batch and either forget to mark them or forget to read them.
I switched to Lee dies for decapping after the Lyman dies I had since my teens got lost on US1 somewhere between Sebastian Inlet and Vero Beach. 😞
 
The easy vs hard decaping is a hard matter, because mil crimped rifle brass is hard to decap. I run both a lee universal and an rcbs universal decaping die. I don't worry about the Lee I just power through. The rcbs has the small pin for 6br and other special cases and I'm very light on the touch. The little pin is replaceable on the rcbs is changeable as the entire decaping assembly on the Lee for about the same price. I just happen to have piles of the rcbs pins because I remove them from my dies.
 
AJC1 said:
The easy vs hard decaping is a hard matter, because mil crimped rifle brass is hard to decap. I run both a lee universal and an rcbs universal decaping die. I don't worry about the Lee I just power through. The rcbs has the small pin for 6br and other special cases and I'm very light on the touch. The little pin is replaceable on the rcbs is changeable as the entire decaping assembly on the Lee for about the same price. I just happen to have piles of the rcbs pins because I remove them from my dies.
Click to expand...
New pins are on the way from RCBS. We’ll see if they arrive before I find the ones I have stashed- somewhere? I’m competitive, so I consider this a challenge.

I don’t think it was an issue with a crimped primer but I’m just guessing until I get home. Maybe a small flash hole, eccentric flash hole, berdan flash hole. During the process of trying to power through, I just assumed it was a crimped primer and I tried to power through.
 
d31tc said:
New pins are on the way from RCBS. We’ll see if they arrive before I find the ones I have stashed- somewhere? I’m competitive, so I consider this a challenge.

I don’t think it was an issue with a crimped primer but I’m just guessing until I get home. Maybe a small flash hole, eccentric flash hole, berdan flash hole. During the process of trying to power through, I just assumed it was a crimped primer and I tried to power through.
Click to expand...
The worst are boxer off center. Should work based on the visual inspection but raises heck on your gear.
 
My solution, after bending my first RCBS decapping pin, was a bit on the lazy side. II ordered a Lee Universal Decapping die and paired them with Squirrel Daddy (tool steel) decapping pins...these were the first Lee dies I had ever purchased.

Haven't had any issues since. If I encounter a Berdan case, the pin will push out (up) in the collet rather than bend. I'm reloading on a Hornady Progressive press, so a quick 1/8th turn on the die/bushing removes that die and another 1/8th turn to insert the backup get me back in business
 
There was also just a recent thread about stuck sizing dies. Same wisdom applies there, if it don't go then don't force it. Force is just asking for trouble. From my perspective no piece of brass is worth damaging a die or sticking a case. Throw away the defective brass and move along.
 
kmw1954 said:
Throw away the defective brass and move along.
Click to expand...
Yep, especially a 1¢ to 2¢ piece of brass. When the issue came up, it was clearly a problem with the brass. Why I didn’t just chuck it into recycling, I’m not sure. I wasn’t analyzing costs at the time, just trying to get the job done. Then I went and made it a big job. Never again 😬 …
 
Even if it $1.00 piece of brass. just not worth the effort to have to stop the process, repair a die or struggle to get a piece of stuck brass removed. Or worst case to have an expense to replace a die.

I seem to have found that if I need more than one hand on the lever to resize or decap a piece of brass something is wrong. And I am using a simple leverage single stage press.
 
The brass was likely NORMA 9MM. They have a smaller, 057" flash hole than normal and the regular .078" flash hole. I ran into this issue a number of months ago when resizing a large number of 9MM range pickups.
 
No clear answer. Maybe the photos here can help. Looks like the flash hole was centered. Maybe small flash hole? Maybe the pin being off center (RCBS Pow’r Punch Decap Pin) because of a broken spring? Looks like the web was punched or pushed out on the side of the flash hole from the pin. ETA, the weird thing if was the pin, is that it worked on two other pieces of brass normally, just not this one, as I was trying to check to see if it was the pin or the brass.

IMG_3615.jpeg

IMG_3616.jpeg

IMG_3625.jpeg
 
Last edited:
d31tc said:
No clear answer. Maybe the photos here can help. Looks like the flash hole was centered. Maybe small flash hole? Maybe the pin being off center (RCBS Pow’r Punch Decap Pin) because of a broken spring? Looks like the web was punched or pushed out on the side of the flash hole from the pin. ETA, the weird thing if was the pin, is that it worked on two other pieces of brass normally, just not this one, as I was trying to check to see if it was the pin or the brass.

View attachment 1180874

View attachment 1180876

View attachment 1180878
Click to expand...
If the spring is sprung it will not center the pin. I found a Spring used in AR'15's and cut it down. It's stronger and does not take a set when fully compressed like the factory one. When you hit a tight primer it launches it with authority. I contacted RCBS and they sent me a complete assembly to replace the one I had. It did the same thing the reason I went looking for a stronger spring. Since my replacement does not take a set I expect it to out last me.
 
kmw1954 said:
There was also just a recent thread about stuck sizing dies. Same wisdom applies there, if it don't go then don't force it. Force is just asking for trouble. From my perspective no piece of brass is worth damaging a die or sticking a case. Throw away the defective brass and move along.
Click to expand...
I was resizing some 9mm brass a couple of weeks ago while setting up a new press. The cases were headstamped Xtreme, which i've loaded many times before without issue. The resizing die was a Lee "U" die and I encountered more pressure than I expected...it was a 10 station progressive with great leverage. I stopped and pulled the case to discover that it had developed a mid-riff budge...it looked like a budge you'll sometimes see when someone wears too tight pants under a cut off tank top.

I just pulled the rest of those cases and switched the resizer to a Redding.

The most memorable instance of "forcing it" was a buddy loading on a Dillon 650. He was priming and must have encounters some resistance. The next thing you heard was the pop of a primer being set off, followed by the rest of the column going off and launching the primer tube into the ceiling of his garage
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

A
  • Locked
To lube or not to lube?
2
Replies
27
Views
2K
Steelworker
Steelworker
S
  • Locked
Spent primers not coming out of 10mm brass
Replies
6
Views
655
beatledog7
B
P
  • Locked
breaking decappings
Replies
5
Views
342
Scimmia
S
J
  • Locked
Broke my Hornady decapping pin.....Bummer.
Replies
14
Views
4K
Josh45
J
R
  • Locked
RCBS - Great service!
Replies
3
Views
419
LiquidTension
L
Back
Top