If you were to design a new cartridge for concealed carry!

[BLACKHAWKNJ]

IMHO the 9MMP is basically the semiauto version of the 38 Special.
If i were to design a new round it would be a hollow cavity bullet-filled with poison!

 

[Anchorite]

IMHO the 9MMP is basically the semiauto version of the 38 Special.
If i were to design a new round it would be a hollow cavity bullet-filled with poison!

I’ve said for years that the 9mm is the 38 Special of the semi automatic pistol world.

 

[Old_Grouch]

IMHO the 9MMP is basically the semiauto version of the 38 Special.

Actually, the .38 A.M.U. is literally the semi auto version of the .38 Spl.

 

[wcwhitey]

He clearly never heard of the 9mm

In his day 9mm was a foreign round and concept, we had the .45, 9mm was Un-American! As far as Police agencies few choose a different caliber for investigative duties, usually something akin to a Glock 26 instead of a Glock 17. As far as off duty not many places issue! They may authorize and it usually falls along the line of a list of guns that are okay to own and carry. Quite a few places are very strict with that list. Some not so much but may require you to qualify with it and use your own ammo. Too much liability in todays world for departments be seen as endorsing things.


It’s part of the reason everyone relies so much on the FBI ammo standards. It’s as much to remove liability as it is anything else. It’s so easy to answer the question about why you chose a round for a major department by saying “The FBI said it was good”. Not much room in the legal world for thinking outside the box.

 

[WisBorn]

It’s part of the reason everyone relies so much on the FBI ammo standards. It’s as much to remove liability as it is anything else. It’s so easy to answer the question about why you chose a round for a major department by saying “The FBI said it was good”. Not much room in the legal world for thinking outside the box.

I have to agree. It doesn't seem to matter what round you choose for carry it is going to fall into the magic gel penetration test if the load is designed for conceal carry or duty use. 9mm, 40, 45, 38, 357 all seem to be 12-18" of penetration....

 

[BLACKHAWKNJ]

There won't be any sort of "new, improved", "breakthrough" round until someone develops a powder that can produce magnum velocities with the pressure of, say Unique and kicks like a 38 WC.

 

[21H40]

I’m not that fond of the shield plus or shield EZ so until some other manufacturer picks it up it’s kind of a non starter for me. If S&W put it in a CSX or if ruger put it in a max 9 I would probably buy both. Unless someone else picks it up it looks like it’s dying on the vine though. I’m not really interested in it for self defense, just as a plinker and maybe for small game around the farm.

Like I said earlier in this thread I think they badly misjudged the market in trying to make a 9mm replacement. I think they should have been making a 380 acp replacement.

Maybe that's next year. 30 Supershort Cartridge.

I would like to see someone come out with caliber conversion kits - like we have for 22LR. I think a G17 with 25 round magazines sounds like fun.

 

[RetiredUSNChief]

"If you were to design a new cartridge for concealed carry!"

If I could do it, I'd design a 100% consumable cartridge such that firing left nothing but the bullet traveling down the barrel.

It would have some pretty awesome military applications, too, if this could be done.

Other than that, I think we've already hit whatever "sweat spots" in terms of calibers and terminal ballistics with the great variety we already have available.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

I personally feel that a modernized 38-40 (38wcf) would be a very effective cartridge at short to medium ranges. Maybe make it without a rim for semi-auto use.

And call it the .40 S&W?

 

[SundownRider]

And call it the .40 S&W?

No, keep the bottleneck case and work up better loads.
Christ, I need to be clearer in my posts to avoid the inevitable.

 

[Old_Grouch]

No, keep the bottleneck case and work up better loads.
Christ, I need to be clearer in my posts to avoid the inevitable.

How would it differ ballistically from the 10mm?

 

[Oninotaki]

I really like to ponder the possibilities of where revolver tech would have gone if magazines had never been invented. So I would probably approach a new cartridge from that perspective.

This being the case I would like to see something like a .25 magnum. Maybe even go with a .27 caliber bullet to help distinguish it from other exisitng pocket pistols. A long but thin centerfire cartridge that you could get a 9-12 shot capacity with, 12-18" penetration from a 2-4" barrel, while still being able to use a breaktop revolver frame if you want. Would probably go with a Winchester silver tip style break apart bullet over a hollow point if a bullet other than a fmj was to be offered in the caliber.

However if I was really let loose on a new cartridge it would probably be to design a whole family from the ground up with as many different platforms in mind with backwards compatibility. Sort of similar to the organic growth of the .32, .38, and .44 family's, just planned out from the get go.

While we are at it an unrimmed shotgun cartridge might be interesting, but that would be a whole different thought experiment from a new concealed carry caliber.

 

[ilbob]

There are plenty of cartridges available and plenty of bullet designs. Just pick something and learn to shoot well enough that it does you some good.

 

[Jim Watson]

I personally feel that a modernized 38-40 (38wcf) would be a very effective cartridge at short to medium ranges. Maybe make it without a rim for semi-auto use.

Back in the days of cheap surplus, a guy did that for an M1 Carbine. He cut .30-06 cases off and crammed them into a .38-40 die to form the bottleneck. He did not thin the new neck zone, so it accepted .376" bullets instead of .401". Ballistics were close to .35 Remington.

 

[Jim Watson]

IMHO the 9MMP is basically the semiauto version of the 38 Special.
If i were to design a new round it would be a hollow cavity bullet-filled with poison!

The 9mm P only postdates .38 S&W Special by about three years, gun development was moving right along at the dawn of the 20th century.
There was an Internet Inventor who proposed a "9mm Auto" at the same case and OAL, same velocity as 9mm P, but in a straight wall case that he said would be a smoother feeder than the tapered 9mm P.

Our friends who used to be our enemies did a good bit of work on poison bullets. About what you would expect from a Nazi.

 

[Ks5shooter]

30 Carbine in a semi auto.Hello Glock can you here me?

 

[Vern Humphrey]

It's been done -- AMT Automag III.

 

[C0untZer0]

I think if you start with 294 ft-lb of muzzle energy which is 380 Auto +P (for a 100gr bullet), there has to be a bullet profile between .354 and .312 that has better penetration than the 380 Auto bullets.

Even if the energy involved was too much for straight blow-back, if I could get a locked-breach pocket pistol that wasn't too much snappier than your average 380, and the bullets penetrated deeper than current 380 hollow points and expanded some - I'd buy it. I think it can be done with the correct sectional density.

 

[daniel craig]

I would just personally be happy with a resurgence of the 7.62x25 with better bullet design and more available firearms.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

I would just personally be happy with a resurgence of the 7.62x25 with better bullet design and more available firearms.

Kind of like the .327 Magnum?

 

[daniel craig]

Kind of like the .327 Magnum?

Right in a semi auto pistol not a revolver.

 

[Charlie Martinez]

I agree that a new cartridge can be invented but most probably it wouldn't do anything an existing cartridge doesn't do. My "invention" would be a compact CC pistol chambered in 38 Super. I have no experience with this cartridge but Ive read that performance is near the 357 Magnum, recoil is less than 45 ACP and magazine capacity would be same as 9 mm. It sounds (to me) like a great CC/SD cartridge yet aside from a few 1911 pistols there are no others.

 

[Haywood]

My Gen One Shield

 

[Hikingman]

New design?
I would come to my senses and realize that's there's enough already.

 

[daniel craig]

Personally as far as new designs go I would love to see viable solutions to gunpowder-based projectile ammunition that we have now. Maybe something that uses fewer resources or is easier to manufacture or something, I have no idea what that would even look like because I'm not that smart, but that would be cool.