I know "Signature Required" or even "Adult Signature Required" gives more protection in shipping but I just wonder if really necessary while already insured with "Declared Value". Any reason to spend the extra? I know folks do "Adult Signature Required" when shipping firearms and some FFLs insist at least "Signature Required".
Insured vs Signature Required when shipping
- Thread starter HankC
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Outlaw75
Member
Signature Required means that someone has to sign for it (in theory) and it won't just get left on somebody's porch. That's all. It won't protect you if your package never arrives and I believe UPS and FedEx will only assume liability up to $100.00 unless you declare the value and insure. I don't know what USPS does.
JJFitch
Member
Shipping a firearm requires a declaration and "Signature Required" provision. Additional insurance is optional!
Although the big red "Firearm" sticker is no longer required, shipping a 3.5# box the size of a pistol "Overnight" and "Signature Required" sticker SCREAMS FIREARM INDIDE! That's why so many guns disappear during shipment!
Smiles,
Although the big red "Firearm" sticker is no longer required, shipping a 3.5# box the size of a pistol "Overnight" and "Signature Required" sticker SCREAMS FIREARM INDIDE! That's why so many guns disappear during shipment!
Smiles,
silicosys4
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Signature required does not guarantee delivery. If someone opens the box and steals your gun while in transit, then seals the box, the box will be delivered empty and you will be signing for an empty box. Insurance is your best guarantee if things go sideways. That and paying by credit card.
All signature required does is make sure the package isn't dropped on your porch and left to the wolves if you aren't home. It doesn't even ensure that your package isn't delivered to your neighbor, or to the crackhead across town. It just means it was left in a human beings hands...hopefully it's intended recipient, but no hard guarantees on that.
All signature required does is make sure the package isn't dropped on your porch and left to the wolves if you aren't home. It doesn't even ensure that your package isn't delivered to your neighbor, or to the crackhead across town. It just means it was left in a human beings hands...hopefully it's intended recipient, but no hard guarantees on that.
CapnMac
Member
This is more about shipping than firearms, and thus, will not last very long.
Only FFL can use USPS, and as the shipper/receiver, they get to define the terms.
The rest of us are limited to Common Carriers, and we must abide by the rules they use.
Anecdotes about the vagaries of common carriers are just that--anecdotes, hearsay, and of only that value.
Only FFL can use USPS, and as the shipper/receiver, they get to define the terms.
The rest of us are limited to Common Carriers, and we must abide by the rules they use.
Anecdotes about the vagaries of common carriers are just that--anecdotes, hearsay, and of only that value.
patmccoy
Member
For handguns, yes. I've shipped several rifles USPS in the past year, to an FFL, while I do not have an FFL.
dogtown tom
Member
Neither offers "protection" or more careful handling than shipping without a signature. It just means the carrier had a live person sign for acceptance of the package.
Signature Confirmation means anyone can sign, Adult Signature means the person signing is 21 or over (important for a firearm).
Declared value or Insurance have little to do with Signature or Adult Signature. It is the carriers means to assign a value if the package is lost, stolen, damaged or destroyed during shipment.
Of course.
1. the carriers tariff may require it for certain items.
2. it is the responsibility of the seller to deliver the item to the buyer in the condition as advertised.
3. No SC or AS on delivery means the carrier can leave the package at the addressees door, mailbox, with a neighbor, exposed to rain, porch pirates, etc.
Insurance
protects the seller from claims brought by the buyer. If you can absorb the loss of a gun as well as reimbursing the buyer for the total paid, then skip the insurance.
This FFL never ships without Adult Signature on delivery.
SlowFuse
Member
There are different "levels" of signature required options that carriers offer.
I have had packages delivered by USPS, FedEx and UPS that clearly said signature required that were left on my doorstep. So depending on the individual delivering your package the basic "signature required" isn't a guarantee it will be handed to someone.
I have had packages delivered by USPS, FedEx and UPS that clearly said signature required that were left on my doorstep. So depending on the individual delivering your package the basic "signature required" isn't a guarantee it will be handed to someone.
This is why I asked. If already protected by the insurance, why still need to do signature? Insurance does not need "signature" as proof, correct? I do understand without signature to have a warm body receive the package, it can be left in the rain and damaged or left outside and stolen, etc. Does insurance cover such?
I asked because I recently had a transaction with a guy, I was going to add "Signature Required" but find out his location is remote and UPS would charge a higher "signature required" fee than normal. I asked the guy to cover it, he would not and said no one would come out the gate to sign for it. I asked him to send me a reply email stating he would be responsible to process the insurance if stolen when left outside or damaged in rain, he would not. I did not proceed with the transaction. This was not a firearm, just gun parts, a part kit. I have confidence if a FFL! But I kind of wonder exactly what insurance needs, I have never process a claim before but always add "Declared Value" when I ship. Only do "Signature" when I ship firearm (long guns), either USPS, FedEX or UPS.
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dogtown tom
Member
Again, its two different things. Insurance covers the loss, damage, theft, etc of the item. Signature/Adult signature is proof that the item was received.
If you ship with insurance and no signature/adult signature on delivery.........what you gonna do when USPS/UPS/FedEx denies your claim because their records show they delivered the package? Insured only or the completely useless Delivery Confirmation means the carrier can leave the package on the porch.
It does not.
Nope. Once "delivered" the carrier is no longer responsible.
Again, insurance, declared value coverage, signature/adult signature.......are protection for the seller, not the buyer. If the buyer doesn't receive the item as described, he is due a full and complete refund. Sellers need to remember this in calculating shipping cost.
I wouldn't either. You sold it to me, now get it to me.
Have YOU ever purchased anything and it was delivered to you? If so, what were your expectations?
What does that mean?
I ship everything of value, not just guns, with Signature or Adult Signature required. It eliminates any claim by the buyer that they never received the package.
dogtown tom
Member
If "signature required" and left without signature the carrier didn't fulfill their own terms of service. Both UPS and FedEx have temporarily halted any signature guarantees because of COVID. USPS has not.
I've caught a USPS letter carrier forging my name on a Adult Signature Required delivery that he left on top of my mailbox.
Outlaw75
Member
The shipping contract, including the insurance coverage, would be between you and the shipper. He would have no way of filing a claim.
Cannibul
Member
Right now all the carriers are allowing their delivery persons to sign for things. Avoiding contact and all that.
I get medication delivered every month that requires an adult signature. The USPS is allowing their carriers to sign for these packages right now. Thankfully my letter carrier brings that package to the door and hands it to either my wife or I.
FedEx is allowing their delivery people to sign for things also.
I get medication delivered every month that requires an adult signature. The USPS is allowing their carriers to sign for these packages right now. Thankfully my letter carrier brings that package to the door and hands it to either my wife or I.
FedEx is allowing their delivery people to sign for things also.
Jesse Heywood
Member
I just received a signature required via FedEx. Driver told me he typed in my name, but had to ensure that someone received the package. He could not leave the package on an unoccupied doorstep.
dogtown tom
Member
Yesterday I'm at school when I hear the screaming goat (sound file I use for Ring doorbell). Its a UPS driver. He reads the sign on my door telling him not to leave packages at my door or with neighbors. He looks at the box, looks at the sign again, then leaves the rifle box leaning against my door but far enough away from the door it gets wet from the rain. 
I called the UPS Customer Service Center and told them I have video of a driver leaving a firearm unattended and if he doesn't go back and get it my next call is to ATF. Seventeen minutes later the same driver comes back......reads the sign again, looks at my camera and shakes his head as he takes the wet box back to the truck.
I called the UPS Customer Service Center and told them I have video of a driver leaving a firearm unattended and if he doesn't go back and get it my next call is to ATF. Seventeen minutes later the same driver comes back......reads the sign again, looks at my camera and shakes his head as he takes the wet box back to the truck.
Jesse Heywood
Member
Would be interesting to find out if his only stop today was at the unemployment office.Yesterday I'm at school when I hear the screaming goat (sound file I use for Ring doorbell). Its a UPS driver. He reads the sign on my door telling him not to leave packages at my door or with neighbors. He looks at the box, looks at the sign again, then leaves the rifle box leaning against my door but far enough away from the door it gets wet from the rain.
I called the UPS Customer Service Center and told them I have video of a driver leaving a firearm unattended and if he doesn't go back and get it my next call is to ATF. Seventeen minutes later the same driver comes back......reads the sign again, looks at my camera and shakes his head as he takes the wet box back to the truck.
Wonder what the distributor does with a wet gun? UPS insurance will buy it, I assume.
wiscoaster
Member
The story above about the UPS and the wet rifle is pretty funny, but it does remind me that I'm getting concerned about package delivery. Especially USPS. I've had packages sit in distribution centers going nowhere for five days. Today the mail carrier put a package in my mailbox. I went out and brought in the mail. Five minutes later he came back and put another package in my mailbox. Incidents like these are not unusual and are getting more usual. I wonder if package delivery and transportation is starting to get adversely affected by all the crazy stuff going on. Whether it's one sign of society starting to crack around the edges.
dogtown tom
Member
I think a lot of problems in the last six months is due to the whopping increase in volume of packages.
When driving , what is a better attitude -
I will do everything I can to avoid getting into a crash , or
I'm not worried about crashing because I am insured ?
lightman
Member
I don't think it makes you weird. You have the right to be who you are and the courage to talk about it. And Thank You for your Service!
lightman
Member
Deleted reply. Wrong thread.
Cannibul
Member
It happens when someone is dealing with a hundred packages or more. Even though they might have routed the packages one could get lost easily in the vehicle.
wiscoaster
Member
It just burns me how UPS and FedEx dump their small packages onto USPS. USPS isn't charging them enough for that service and the shipments that originate with USPS suffer.
dogtown tom
Member
Does it burn you when a UPS or FedEx airplane carries USPS mail? 'Cause they do.
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