Is Savage poised to take over Remington's

[RugerOldArmy]

Yoda,

Where do you live in Indiana? NW? Just for laughs, or side bets if you wish. I'll take you as a guest to the ISRA range. http://www.isra.org/range/about.shtml

We can have a contest, just for laughs, or side bets if you wish. I'm a single dad, but maybe a Saturday, in the next month or two. You pick the range (100 yards, 100 meters, 300 yards.) and wether we shoot for aggregates or score.

PM me if interested. You can bring a camera, post results as you see fit.

 

[22-rimfire]

Everyone likes what they like. It's a free country. I'd choose a Remington any day over a Savage if I have the money. My first centerfire rifle was a Mossberg. They were about equal to Savages at the time. Fine rifle actually. Most Savages then were stickly utilitarian. However, now Savage has some real nice looking rifles and I have been tempted over and over again to buy one. I hear the accuracy is just fine. Triggers are good.

I keep my rifles pretty much stock and have little interest in modulation. I'll pay a gunsmith to build me a custom rifle if I want one.

The AR platform is useful if you like to tinker with add on's and so forth. I still pretty much buy them the way I want them and shoot them. Buy another if I want another rifle or caliber.

Is Savage poised to take over the Remington market? No way. They will slaughter Ruger though.

 

[MarshallDodge]

Gee whiz....Arguing over Glocks vs 1911's in the Pistol forum and Remmy's vs. Savages in the rifle forum.

I have come close to buying a Savage several times. Why? Because their resale value is terrible and you can pick up a used one really cheap. Someday this may change.

I have not bought a bolt action rifle in a long time. My first bolt action is a Rem 700 VS in .223 that is a tack driver. The factory adjustable trigger is a really nice feature as well. Later I bought a 700 VLS in 6mm and did not do as well with it, whether it was me or the VLS stock I never figured it out.

If Savage put that fat receiver of theirs on a diet and supplied it with a good adjustable trigger then I might think about it. For now I will stick with a Remmy and you can have your Savage.

Remington will be around for a long time for several reasons besides the name.

 

[YodaVader]

Yoda,

Where do you live in Indiana? NW? Just for laughs, or side bets if you wish. I'll take you as a guest to the ISRA range. http://www.isra.org/range/about.shtml

We can have a contest, just for laughs, or side bets if you wish. I'm a single dad, but maybe a Saturday, in the next month or two. You pick the range (100 yards, 100 meters, 300 yards.) and wether we shoot for aggregates or score.

PM me if interested. You can bring a camera, post results as you see fit.

Actually that sounds pretty good to me. To meet others that shoot for precision is always a treat. At my range there is only a couple of shooters who are really serious about accuracy shooting. One has given me a lot of great advice.

I did not read the link yet. The range I shoot at is in the Muncie / New Castle area. It is limited to 100 yards. If you are near there you are more than welcome to be my guest as well.

With the crappy weather we are having I would rather shoot in decent weather although I did it make it outdoors for the first time this year last weekend.

Since my range is 100 yards and I never shoot on a scoring target , 100 yard for group size is the only type of centerfire rifle shooting that I do. All my rifles are stock except for triggers on all , even the the Savage. And the SPS has a HS stock. The 700LTR has been my most consistent performer and that is what I would use.

In fact I would love to be able to shoot another Savage too! In all the years I have shot at my current range there has only been one time where there was another Savage on the line and it too was a 12BVSS , although in .22-250.

Let me take a look at the link and I'll send PM.

 

[JohnL2]

This is almost like arguing which is better, Coke or Pepsi?

I own a Savage in .22-250 and it is a damn fine rifle for the money. But I would be hard-pressed to purchase another one.
I must admit, handling a factory mass production firearm is just hard to get excited about. No matter how well it may stack up against more established reputation firearms.
Sometimes you just want something custom built just for you. One that is to your satisfaction with no compromises. And I think I have gotten to that point.

Oh, I prefer Pepsi by the way.

 

[jbech123]

if it ain't broke...

From the sounds of it, savages have come a long way in recent years, who knows maybe they will dethrone Remington at some point. To date, though, Remington has given me no real reason to switch. I am not a hardcore benchrest shooter shooting a rail gun with a 2 oz trigger, so depending on what your goals/interests are, my experience may not amount to much. I do not handload, and tend to shoot for bragging rights or brewskis with my friends rather than win any type of competition, and we pretty much shoot stock rifles with a few mods but definitely guns we hunt with. SO my experience is more from a very accurate hunting rifle standpoint more than a benchrest perspective.
That said I have owned 7 remington 700's, the worst of which shot .8moa, and that was an ADL 7mm mag that I bought new for $299 when a shop near me was liquidating their ADL's. Plus that thing kicks like a mule so recoil aversion probably makes me the limiting factor more than the gun. The best one was a .223 700 classic, with a wood stock, that on many occasions produced .25" 3 shot groups. I currently have a pss that will do about .6" and a 5R that will do sub .5". The only thing I have ever done to any of them is adjust the trigger, and I am no pro gunsmith by any means! On the other hand I have had 3 rugers, none of which would hold under 2 moa, 1 savage(from the early 90's, with a wood stock and pencil barrel) that shot about 2 moa, a winchester 70 in 375 H&H that shot just under 1 moa, and an Encore rifle that was at about 1.25 moa. So for my needs, I can go to the local gunshop and plunk down $850 for a 700pss and get a rifle that is virtually guaranteed to do .75 moa out of the box, and very likely better than that. Every rifle I've had of any brand has been reliable, so I can't give one an edge over another in that respect.

 

[jbech123]

if it ain't broke...

duplicate

 

[Tarvis]

I think Stevens is better than both of those. Way better.

 

[MinnMooney]

Copper fouling - Try the Tubbs bullets

Tubbs makes a set of grit bullets - 5 stages of grittiness - that should do several things for any barrel. First, they smooth the bore so the cleaning process goes much easier and second, your accuracy should improve given the eveness of the bore. I've read a very scientifically followed routine to test for before/after changes to the barrel while using the Tubbs grit bullets. It improved the accurace and ease of cleaning tremendiously.

 

[jbech123]

"I think Stevens is better than both of those. Way better."
Any actual data to go along with that, or just an opinion?

 

[Schleprok62]

To answer the OP's question. I doubt it mainly because of government contracts...

That said, I have 2 Stevens model 200's that are quite accurate sub 1" @ 200 yards with my handloads... haven't fired any factory stuff through either of them. I have owned one Rem M700 and it was about 1" @ 200 yards with factory stuff - before I got into reloading.

I think Savage has come a long way, but still has a way to go before they approach Remingtons market share.

Is Savage capable of it? Sure!!

Remember when Sears was the RETAIL GIANT??? Where the hell did Wal-Mart come from?? a small produce stand in Arkansas...

 

[Geno]

About 1.5 to 2 years ago, I saw the Savage Mark II .22LRs. The price was such that I thought, if it's as good as they claim, great, and if it isn't, it was dirt-cheap anyhow. It's a tack-driver...literally. I can press 10 tacs into a piece of pine board, set the "targets" at distances of 20 to 30 yards, and drive all 10 tacks with Remington Thunderbolts. The scope is an equally cheap BSA Sweet 22 3-9 power. Due to my recent past surgeries, I didn't have the opportunity to hunt with it. I will soon this summer on varmints. Can you say POAPOI(1)?! It hits precisely where I point. Watch out varmints!!

Not to be outdone, my Remington 700 SPS varmint in .223 Remington is equally accurate. At 100 yards it is printing groups that measure 0.182" at 100 yards. Ergo, that rifle is my other POAPOI(2). Again, watch out varmints.

In my estimation, Remington and Savage have become co-equals for quality. For the money, they are my best accuracy rifles to take against nasty varmints, that unchecked, could destroy quarter-million dollar tractors' axles. As soon as my surgery is over this summer, I have plans for a 4 to 6-weeks venture in target-practice/varmint hunting.

 

[Gewehr98]

I dunno...

COME ON! It's not like a synthetic stocked Remington is a stellar example of the finest quality fit and finish envied by riflesmiths worldwide.

Krochus, I'm surprised at you. My 700PSS would beg to differ:



And if you want to break out of the Savage/Remington price range and head for that riflesmith's ever-so enviable fit and finish, I'll sell you my Remington 40X in .308. It wasn't dropped straight from The Mothership like your Savage was, but it's a damned fine rifle, with no tweaking needed once delivered from the factory - including the accuracy guarantee from the folks who made it.




I still have a Savage 340 and a Savage 110. They're deer guns, and the former is one heck of a fun gun for a bolt-action .30-30. However, after witnessing a Savage separate the bolt head from the bolt body in a sniper competition and thereby disqualifying the owner, I'll steer clear of them for serious target/tactical use, thank you.

 

[Ash]

Yeah, but compare a bottom-end synthetic ADL, not a more expensive kevlar model. As I have said before, there is far more in common between the two actions than differences. After all, they are both rifles designed around the most economical means of production envisioned at the time. They are round-bottomed tubular steel receivered rifles encorporating a separate recoil lug between the barrel and stock with adjustable triggers, dual forward-locking bolts and rear sliding safeties (albeit different locations) that lock the sear.

Very literally, and probably a better example than any other firearm of this comparison, they are Chevy versus Ford. A Chevy man might vehemently argue the superiority of the C-1500 over the F-150, but in reality they are both so similar in design and construction that is is really just brand loyalty.

Ash

 

[dak0ta]

Savage Model 14 American Classic vs. Rem 700 CDL..

Who wins...

 

[MCgunner]

I won 'cause I own both brands. I agree that the Remingtons are the better rifles, but I still can't say the Savage doesn't work. It's 1 moa accurate and gets the job done. So, it ain't pretty, don't sit there looking at it!

The Savage is so easy to work on, it could become the 10/22 of bolt action centerfires if the aftermarket allows.

Why do I get the feeling guys with Kleingunthers and Sakos and Weatherby MkVs and such are reading this thread and laughing their butts off?

 

[USASA]

Quote:

Hmmmm. If the Savage is so great, how come everybodys ordering the Shilen barrels?

Seriously, Savages are ugly and have terrible fitting/feeling stocks. At least I have some pride of ownership with the Remington.
__________________
Best Regards,

Ron

USASA 1965/69

Hmmm. A lot of Remington folks order after-market barrels also. USASA ? I suspect that might refer to U.S. Army Security Agency. See my Member name. 1960/1963

 

[R.W.Dale]

Hmmmm. If the Savage is so great, how come everybodys ordering the Shilen barrels?

Because WE can have a shillen for $300 installed or about half what it costs the Remington guy's

Stevens 200 + Select match Shilen barrel = Less than a rem 700 by itself.

If you 700'ers could have a shilen for that you'ed be silly not to. Minus the optics I have less in my Stevens 200 than a bottom of the line SPS varmint 700 costs. But unlike a stock 700 my Stevens shoots in the .3's constantly

You guy's are just jealous! Your pro 700 arguments kind remind me of the pie in the sky touchy feely emotional rhetoric Harley guys resort to in order to justify paying twice as much for an inferior product.

 

[RugerOldArmy]

And if you want to break out of the Savage/Remington price range and head for that riflesmith's ever-so enviable fit and finish, I'll sell you my Remington 40X in .308. It wasn't dropped straight from The Mothership like your Savage was, but it's a damned fine rifle, with no tweaking needed once delivered from the factory - including the accuracy guarantee from the folks who made it.

"ever-so enviable fit and finish"...Are you serious? A 40Xs is not a Cooper. Let alone is it a custom on a BAT/Stolle/Stiller/Nesika, but it approaches the price tag, and gives you a Remington factory barrel. (Oh Joy!!! The Green lawyers picked my chamber reamer!) A 40X is a semi-custom, and it's three times the price of a Savage LRPV:

http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/custom_shop/40-x/model_40-XB_rangemaster_thumbhole.asp

Come now, how could you make a worse deal than to get a 40X? $2900 for a Rem 700 with $20 of glass bedding and a marginally better trigger? (It's surely not a Jewell.)

Over that, I'd take a Savage LRPV (or their F/TR), buy a Nightforce NSX Scope, and pocket $750 (or get two Shilen barrels to my specs.) ...And the fugly old Savage will probably still outshoot that Remington 40X...even though the Remington would still need to fund the $cope.

No wonder you're trying to sell it!