BlackJackal
Member
+1 im board' the .357 train 
Is the 357 fading away?
- Thread starter Slamfire
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The Bushmaster
Member
Oh damn...I guess I need to turn in my Mod 19 2 1/2" that I carry in the winter...Any suggestions for a replacement in plastic?
wristtwister
Member
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2008
- Messages
- 419
I carried a .357 as an LEO, and it never failed me. While I now carry high capacity pistols, it's for the amount of fire I can put downrange... not just the stopping power of the cartridge.
My .40 cal Smith and 9mm put a lot more rounds down the line than the Model 19, but one hit with the .357 and the game's over... anywhere. I'm sure that is the consideration of LEO's who have quit carrying revolvers and don't want to be outgunned on the street. Only carrying six in your pipe won't get it done against BG's with lots of rounds to throw at you.
If I'm carrying concealed something with "limited fire", the .357 is without a doubt one of the best choices as a BG stopper. There's a new .327 round out that is supposed to be very close to the .357, but I don't see fooling around with the caliber just to have something else to sell. The .357 has a well documented history, and it's ballistics are well documented. Personally, I wouldn't change a thing about it.
.357's are a handful to shoot, but they get the job done. "Following shots" take a bit of recovery time, but once you get the techniques down, it's definitely a superior self defense round... and it's noisy enough to shut down the crowd around you too...
WT
My .40 cal Smith and 9mm put a lot more rounds down the line than the Model 19, but one hit with the .357 and the game's over... anywhere. I'm sure that is the consideration of LEO's who have quit carrying revolvers and don't want to be outgunned on the street. Only carrying six in your pipe won't get it done against BG's with lots of rounds to throw at you.
If I'm carrying concealed something with "limited fire", the .357 is without a doubt one of the best choices as a BG stopper. There's a new .327 round out that is supposed to be very close to the .357, but I don't see fooling around with the caliber just to have something else to sell. The .357 has a well documented history, and it's ballistics are well documented. Personally, I wouldn't change a thing about it.
.357's are a handful to shoot, but they get the job done. "Following shots" take a bit of recovery time, but once you get the techniques down, it's definitely a superior self defense round... and it's noisy enough to shut down the crowd around you too...
WT
papajohn
Member
Every caliber has its uses, but I think the 357 has more than most. I wouldn't hunt big bears with it, or elk, but aside from that, it will do just about anything you ask of it. Call me a romantic, but I think a good 357 sixshooter and a matching levergun is about as good as it gets.
I own a lot of autos, and practice with them because it's a good idea, but my duty gun is still a revolver, and that's okay. I shoot it well enough to know if there's gunplay, six shots is plenty as long as I do my part.
38+P's are a wonderful option, but when you want all the power a smallish sixgun can provide, the 357 has it in spades. Bullet weights from 110-180 grains cover a lot of potential uses, varmints to deer to bad guys to cougars and the like. I think everyone should have several handguns, but they're missing out if they don't own (and shoot) a 357!
Papajohn
I own a lot of autos, and practice with them because it's a good idea, but my duty gun is still a revolver, and that's okay. I shoot it well enough to know if there's gunplay, six shots is plenty as long as I do my part.
38+P's are a wonderful option, but when you want all the power a smallish sixgun can provide, the 357 has it in spades. Bullet weights from 110-180 grains cover a lot of potential uses, varmints to deer to bad guys to cougars and the like. I think everyone should have several handguns, but they're missing out if they don't own (and shoot) a 357!
Papajohn
22-rimfire
Member
Revolvers have experienced quite a lot of interest in the last 3-4 years. All you have to do is look at the Smith & Wesson catalog. Historically, interest in revolvers waned in the late 1980's through early 1990's as police agencies switched to the wonder nines. Normal shooters were no different and you could buy revolvers for a song compared with today's prices. Those were good years if you were interested in revolvers. Those that "knew" bought and are now experiencing a substantial increase in value of their collections in the last 5 years.
Attend gunshows and you see that they sell when they are fairly priced. The fair part is the issue as prices have been going up faster than the ocasional gunshow attendee and general interest shooter is aware of. Hence, they see prices that seem awfully high on used revolvers in good condition.
There are few calibers more versatile than the 357 mag. It is far from obsolete.
Folks say here that 357's don't have much recoil. Well compared to what most people shoot, which is the 9mm, 40 S&W, or 45ACP, it has considerable recoil. It is one of the reasons I caution new shooters who are inclined to choose revolvers to learn to shoot 22's first and then gradually move up in the power scale. Folks see others shooting or say they are shooting all these 44mags and 454's, and they think the 357 mag must be pretty tame. It is not as tame as they think, but it really is manageable with practice.
Attend gunshows and you see that they sell when they are fairly priced. The fair part is the issue as prices have been going up faster than the ocasional gunshow attendee and general interest shooter is aware of. Hence, they see prices that seem awfully high on used revolvers in good condition.
There are few calibers more versatile than the 357 mag. It is far from obsolete.
Folks say here that 357's don't have much recoil. Well compared to what most people shoot, which is the 9mm, 40 S&W, or 45ACP, it has considerable recoil. It is one of the reasons I caution new shooters who are inclined to choose revolvers to learn to shoot 22's first and then gradually move up in the power scale. Folks see others shooting or say they are shooting all these 44mags and 454's, and they think the 357 mag must be pretty tame. It is not as tame as they think, but it really is manageable with practice.
The Bushmaster
Member
Well hi Papajohn...How's the surf?
You are absolutely correct...I have three. A Colt, Ruger and S&W. The Colt SAA has taken two deer for me when I was living the left coast...
You are absolutely correct...I have three. A Colt, Ruger and S&W. The Colt SAA has taken two deer for me when I was living the left coast...
The Tourist
member
I don't think the "use" is changing, but I do think the "users" might be.
When I was a younger man, most shooters had several revolvers, and perhaps an automatic or two. That was a good collection. And they were all common calibers, everyone had a .38 SPL and a .357 Mag.
About the late 1970's and the early 1980's I noticed a change in my shooting as well as the shooting of my friends.
If a guy was a revolver shooter, he bought better revolvers. He switched to Colts or Smiths, got into handloading and added a .44 Mag. They also took advantage of Wisconsin's new handgun deer hunting.
The guys who identified more with pistols (and that includes me) were more the "beer can shooters" or the IPSC guys. We started shooting more with autos for a change of pace or the action. As our expense in "toys" increased, our collection of revolvers diminished.
At this time, I own only one revolver, a SW Classic, lug barreled 629-5.
However, the use of the .357 Mag by my revolver friends continues. In fact, if we went to the range with several revolvers, the .357 or the .38 would probably be the one shot the most. I know they handload the caliber the most.
When I shoot my SW, my "style" changes. I sit more. I shoot slower. I punch more paper. I reach out at greater distances. In many ways, my use of an AR as opposed to a bolt action rifle mirror the same thing.
When I was a younger man, most shooters had several revolvers, and perhaps an automatic or two. That was a good collection. And they were all common calibers, everyone had a .38 SPL and a .357 Mag.
About the late 1970's and the early 1980's I noticed a change in my shooting as well as the shooting of my friends.
If a guy was a revolver shooter, he bought better revolvers. He switched to Colts or Smiths, got into handloading and added a .44 Mag. They also took advantage of Wisconsin's new handgun deer hunting.
The guys who identified more with pistols (and that includes me) were more the "beer can shooters" or the IPSC guys. We started shooting more with autos for a change of pace or the action. As our expense in "toys" increased, our collection of revolvers diminished.
At this time, I own only one revolver, a SW Classic, lug barreled 629-5.
However, the use of the .357 Mag by my revolver friends continues. In fact, if we went to the range with several revolvers, the .357 or the .38 would probably be the one shot the most. I know they handload the caliber the most.
When I shoot my SW, my "style" changes. I sit more. I shoot slower. I punch more paper. I reach out at greater distances. In many ways, my use of an AR as opposed to a bolt action rifle mirror the same thing.
22-rimfire
Member
The major changeover to semi-auto pistols was started with the introduction of the Glock 9mm. It was double action and the average shooter could shoot it good enough with a little practice.
All you have to do is look at Colt and Smith & Wesson's history to see in hindsight the changes in the firearm industry.
Colt in recent years went through three significant changes to their inventory and production: 1969 when many of their older hand fitted revolvers were discontinuted; 1986 when Colt dropped production of all their 22's and many of their revolvers; then in 2000 or there abouts (I would have to look up that date.) when they went into bankruptcy and a new buyer was eventually found who introduced unsuccessfully a few of the old line revovlers and a few new ones such as the Ananconda. These also didn't work out and now they only producte the single action army revolver.
Smith and Wesson was also experiencing problems during those years. The company was sold twice. They just pulled out of it better and the owners/production people had a bit more forsight as to what the market was going to do in the future.
All you have to do is look at Colt and Smith & Wesson's history to see in hindsight the changes in the firearm industry.
Colt in recent years went through three significant changes to their inventory and production: 1969 when many of their older hand fitted revolvers were discontinuted; 1986 when Colt dropped production of all their 22's and many of their revolvers; then in 2000 or there abouts (I would have to look up that date.) when they went into bankruptcy and a new buyer was eventually found who introduced unsuccessfully a few of the old line revovlers and a few new ones such as the Ananconda. These also didn't work out and now they only producte the single action army revolver.
Smith and Wesson was also experiencing problems during those years. The company was sold twice. They just pulled out of it better and the owners/production people had a bit more forsight as to what the market was going to do in the future.
I have not read all the posts here, so I may be repeating some of what others have said, unintentionally. First of all, most people shoot mostly .38s in their .357 revolvers. Once one is used to the recoil, it is not necessary to shoot all that many magnums anymore. I actually use a K-frame .22 for most of my practice, and shoot magnum ammo in my magnum revolvers.
Secondly, some ranges discourage the shooting of magnum ammo, or do not allow it, period. One indoor range I frequent prefers that those using magnums show up on slower weekdays, when they can have the range almost to themselves.
Thirdly, much of what I see and hear at a local indoor range is rapid-fire, and even bump-firing, with little attention paid to accuracy or real-world-relevant defensive practice. Poly-nines are great for such play, but that is a world removed from what I want to do with a weapon. I don't play mutant ninja combat evil resident super martial artist pacman on computers, so I don't play it at shooting ranges, either. Not that computer games are bad, but I don't like them for myself.
Meanwhile, any loss of popularity of the .357 helps me in my quest for nice, pre-owned Ruger Speed Sixes.
Secondly, some ranges discourage the shooting of magnum ammo, or do not allow it, period. One indoor range I frequent prefers that those using magnums show up on slower weekdays, when they can have the range almost to themselves.
Thirdly, much of what I see and hear at a local indoor range is rapid-fire, and even bump-firing, with little attention paid to accuracy or real-world-relevant defensive practice. Poly-nines are great for such play, but that is a world removed from what I want to do with a weapon. I don't play mutant ninja combat evil resident super martial artist pacman on computers, so I don't play it at shooting ranges, either. Not that computer games are bad, but I don't like them for myself.
Meanwhile, any loss of popularity of the .357 helps me in my quest for nice, pre-owned Ruger Speed Sixes.
Seancass
Member
I'm young and i own a .357. it was my second pistol after my first single six. all my friends like it(GP100) and they all enjoy shooting it. they all want a good .357 revolver, it's just not very high on their list. there are other "cooler" guns to buy first.
i think mines pretty cool. especially when i out shoot their semi-autos.
i think mines pretty cool. especially when i out shoot their semi-autos.
trickyasafox
Member
I think the cost of ammo just is limiting it more to a reloader round. I shoot a lot of 38spl, but thats because I have a lot of 38spl brass. I still work out some good ol' 357s too though. I bought a security six last year and it is one of my most loved pistols. its so nice not having to chase brass around. mine is way older than I am- its a 150-prefix 71 I think, but don't quote me. last year before they came out with 151s.
Titan6
member
Part of the problem is collecters are buying all the quality guns (and hiding them in their gun safes like little squirrels) and not enough makers are making new quality revolvers.
Part of the problem is by and large automatics are better for the wide variety of tasks that handguns are used for, although revolvers certainly have their advantages and are more useful in certain situations.
Part of the problem is that .357 ammo sells for about 40% more than 9mm and when I shoot on my own dime, I often shoot what is cheapest, simply because it is cheapest.
But the .357 is about as dead as the .30-30 lever action, another antique from another age that still provides plenty of enjoyment year after year.
Part of the problem is by and large automatics are better for the wide variety of tasks that handguns are used for, although revolvers certainly have their advantages and are more useful in certain situations.
Part of the problem is that .357 ammo sells for about 40% more than 9mm and when I shoot on my own dime, I often shoot what is cheapest, simply because it is cheapest.
But the .357 is about as dead as the .30-30 lever action, another antique from another age that still provides plenty of enjoyment year after year.
I hope not. I got a Taurus .38 M85, 25 years ago and it has been a good wheel gun. I'm taking my CHL instructors class next month and I just bought a Taurus M66 .357, with a 7 round wheel, for the revolver range requirement. I was amazed at how accurate and easy it was to shoot using only the trigger.
Of course I can use .38's through it but the recoil wasn't any greater than my XD .45acp.
Of course I can use .38's through it but the recoil wasn't any greater than my XD .45acp.
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Green Lantern
Member
- Joined
- Aug 16, 2006
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- 1,665
BTW, Maybe I should mention that I live in a rural area, where the 'knockdown' of the .357 might be appreciated against some 4-legged critters I might run across.
But I mainly want a snubbie to load with shotshells for snakes - on my walks, that's the more immediate concern.
But I mainly want a snubbie to load with shotshells for snakes - on my walks, that's the more immediate concern.
22-rimfire
Member
The 9mm is no 357 mag.
That is your choice. I honestly shoot more 22LR and it certainly is a lot cheaper than 9mm.
That is your choice. I honestly shoot more 22LR and it certainly is a lot cheaper than 9mm.
The only thing that they are better at mostly is throwing a lot of lead downrange quicker. The semi-autos are easier to shoot well which is a big appeal to young shooters. A lot will change before the 357 reaches its old age and needs to be retired to the collector's.
Confederate
Member
You can't really go by what you see at shooting ranges, especially indoor ones. I can't deny many people are buying Glocks and overpriced 1911s, but when it comes to camping and hiking, a good .357 is awfully hard to beat.
At the range, I see quite a few people going through 15+-shot clips of 9mm like they were .22LRs. Brass is flying all over the place and bouncing around the floor. I guess some people get their kicks that way, but with the price of ammo....
In my opinion, the .357 is a gun everyone should own and know how to shoot.
At the range, I see quite a few people going through 15+-shot clips of 9mm like they were .22LRs. Brass is flying all over the place and bouncing around the floor. I guess some people get their kicks that way, but with the price of ammo....
In my opinion, the .357 is a gun everyone should own and know how to shoot.
1911Tuner
Moderator Emeritus
I'll second that.
No big secret where my affiliations lie on the question of my personal sidearm...but if I had to pick one platform for come what may...for the rest of my life...I'd have to go with a 4-inch .357 revolver.
tinygnat219
Member
Titan 6:
Saw your post and had to comment:
My latest gun purchases are as follows:
686-5 4 inch S&W in .357 Magnum.
Ruger Blackhawk Convertible in 357/9MM with a 6.5 inch barrel.
686-3 6 inch S&W in .357 Magnum.
Walther PPS in 9MM.
I think the .357 will be around for quite a while.
Saw your post and had to comment:
I feel your pain. I switched from .45ACP to 9MM for plinking, and now I am going to .22 LR. 9MM isn't exactly cheap anymore either. If .357 is too expensive for you, then grab .38 SPL, it's at the same price as 9MM. One solution I found was to get the Blackhawk Convertible in .357/9MM. It's FUN.
Took me a minute to sort through your thinking (I think it's your thinking anyway). I wouldn't call the .357 an antique from another age as it's younger (introduced in 1935 I think) than any auto cartridge, except the .40 S&W (which balistically matches the old 38-40 WCF Cartridge) and .357 SIG (which was created to match the effectiveness of the Magnum round). I think what you meant to say is that the PLATFORM is the antique as the revolver has been around for what, 150 years minimum? Please correct as needed.
My latest gun purchases are as follows:
686-5 4 inch S&W in .357 Magnum.
Ruger Blackhawk Convertible in 357/9MM with a 6.5 inch barrel.
686-3 6 inch S&W in .357 Magnum.
Walther PPS in 9MM.
I think the .357 will be around for quite a while.
I am a revolver fan, and I think you're right. I love my Blackhawk, but the average Joe looking for a gun for SD or plinking these days is going to buy an autoloader. I may think that's a mistake, and you may think that's a mistake, but that is what is happening.
So I think the 357 mag is fading - because the platform that made it what it was - DA revolver is fading.
I am glad I reload - I don't need to be very concerned about what is fading and what isn't (i shoot 45 LC mostly).
Mike
neviander
Member
There are too many bumper stickers/T-shirts with, "I don't dial 911, I dial .357", emblazoned on them for the mighty .357 to ever go away
OAKVILLE SHOOTER
Member
- Joined
- Sep 19, 2007
- Messages
- 352
Is the 357 fading away?
Not at my house.
Not at my house.
If the trend is to auto pistols, big magazine capacities, quicker reloads and less muzzle flash/noise, I can understand the reduced presence of the .357 magnum.
Here in California the magazine capacity of the auto loader is limited to 10 rounds. Personally I prefer .357 magnum to either .40 S&W, or .45acp. I carry, use in matches and practice weekly with a S&W 627 8 shot revolver. I just bought a .357 magnum Desert Eagle that holds 10 in the magazine. It is not a carry pistol, but it sure is a sweet shooting .357 magnum.
I suspect there is little .357 magnum brass found at the range simply because revolvers do not scatter the brass all over the neighborhood. I reload mine, and suspect most other .357 magnum shooters do also ... two bits, or less, for a reload beats 40, or 60 cents a shot, for factory loads, any day in my book.
Here in California the magazine capacity of the auto loader is limited to 10 rounds. Personally I prefer .357 magnum to either .40 S&W, or .45acp. I carry, use in matches and practice weekly with a S&W 627 8 shot revolver. I just bought a .357 magnum Desert Eagle that holds 10 in the magazine. It is not a carry pistol, but it sure is a sweet shooting .357 magnum.
I suspect there is little .357 magnum brass found at the range simply because revolvers do not scatter the brass all over the neighborhood. I reload mine, and suspect most other .357 magnum shooters do also ... two bits, or less, for a reload beats 40, or 60 cents a shot, for factory loads, any day in my book.
Guy B. Meredith
Member
I reserve use of .357 Magnum rounds for showing the great unwashed masses at the public ranges who think a bottom feeding niner is cool where the real "cool" is. Nothing like a few rounds of .357 Magnum out of a 4" M66 punching tiny groups on the target to cool the testosterone down the line.
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