Keltec PLR 16 as CCW Truck Gun (NC)

[rantingredneck]

I see a lot of posts here and at TFL talking about carrying rifles in vehicles for SHTF scenarios and it's got me thinking about my situation.

NC's gun laws are schizo to say the least. I can legally carry a handgun on my person or in my vehicle under my permit, but I cannot carry a rifle or shotgun unless it is unloaded and in a locked case or locked in the trunk.

I drive a 2001 Dodge Ram quad cab. I have no trunk other than a truck toolbox (black plastic, not metal). I don't trust the locks there to contain a long gun for very long. I may be wrong there, but I'm just not comfortable with that idea.

I haven't yet found a lockable container that fits well under the foldup rear seat of my truck. I would need something that would slide in and out easily because I have two child seats in the back on a daily basis. So far no way to legally store a locked rifle back there. Also concerned about it being seen and therefore stolen. In a locked case it is not easily deployable if needed either.

So my thinking has led me to the PLR 16. It's a handgun (by the ATF's definition anyway). I theoretically could put it in an unlocked soft case and be OK. Only place this (or any truck gun) would not be OK is my daughter's school and I've got a solution to that problem already (I don't park on school grounds, mother in law lives across the street. This will work till she goes to middle school in 3 years).

The advantages: 1) effective caliber!, 2) High capacity, 3) takes AR mags, 4) can be accessorized with sights/lights, etc.

The disadvantages: 1) LOUD, or so I've heard, 2) FLAMETHROWER, or so I've seen pictures of, 3) EBR looking, questionable consequences if used defensively 4) EBR looking, questionable consequences if stopped and disclosed to LEO

So am I barking up the wrong tree here? Is there anyway to mitigate the noise and flame of the PLR short of a suppressor? Would NC consider this a handgun and therefore legal for CCW in a vehicle? Would the EBR nature of it be asking for trouble? Should I be looking more toward a cheap milsurp (SKS, Mosin carbine, etc.) to store in my truck box and forget the rest?

Opinions gentlemen? and ladies?

 

[gbran]

It's a great truck gun.

 

[browningguy]

Any AR flash suppressor will fit of course, but I haven't seen one up close so don't know how effective they are on the short barrel. It makes an excellent truck gun though.

 

[RecoilRob]

Yes, the PLR would make a dandy truck gun. Small size and all of the advantages you listed. And, all the DISadvantages you listed.

They ARE loud. With the KT factory muzzle brake....VERY LOUD!! Outside of a silencer, I don't know what you can do to quiet it down, but I'd stay away from muzzle brakes at least to not make it any louder.

The various flash hiders do an excellent job of eliminating the fireball. So you won't have to worry about singing your paint.

Only other thing I'd mention is the possibility of running afoul of the Law if you use AP ammo in the pistol. Would be a no-no methinks.

And, the way the pistol looks can only be an advantage in a hostile situation....might even get you out of the jam without the need to fire it, which would be good for all involved.

 

[rantingredneck]

I've never shot one of these things so I've got to ask exactly how loud are we talking? Is this .454 Casull loud or .44 Mag loud?

 

[M2 Carbine]

I'm retired now and drive very little but if I were on the road I'd have a PLR in my vehicles.

They are so loud it's guaranteed you will have hearing damage if you fire them in an enclosed place, house, car, etc, without hearing protection.
I have forgot my ear muffs a couple times when firing the PLR outside. It's LOUD and I don't want to do it again but didn't make my ears ring.

A good flash hider, like a Phantom will do away with the flash and myself and friends think there is a very slight reduction in noise.

PLR without a flash hider.


PLR with the Phantom flash hider.

 

[rantingredneck]

That helps answer the loudness question. I've shot .454 Casull outside hunting without muffs. It made my ears ring for awhile afterward. I'm guessing the PLR is probably a bit less potent than that from your post.

Thanks,

RR

 

[Jim Watson]

Maybe a little OT, but I just today heard of a local guy who had his gun and other gear stolen from his car in a company parking lot. Leave your gun in your car and arm a criminal.

 

[rantingredneck]

While that is true and is always a risk, they can also be stolen out of your house/safe while you are at work. Here I have the choice of leaving a gun in my vehicle or not carrying to/from work. I choose to carry, therefore I choose to leave in my truck.

 

[M2 Carbine]

rantingredneck
That helps answer the loudness question. I've shot .454 Casull outside hunting without muffs. It made my ears ring for awhile afterward. I'm guessing the PLR is probably a bit less potent than that from your post.

That's probably not the best measure.

I've had my ears ring bad from the quieter 45ACP.


Near the PLR's I have in the house I have a pair of ear muffs.

 

[copaup]

Purely a personal opinion, but I've always found the rapid and violent high pitched crack of 5.56, even out of a short rifle, to be much more unpleasant than the very loud but lower pitched boom of a 44 magnum out of a pistol, even through plugs. I wouldn't want to touch off either without protection. This is why I have a set of those 2 sided plugs (magically, with the yellow side in your ear you still hear normal sounds, but gunshots are muffled) clipped to my rifle bag and another set in a pocket at work. If I've got time to get to the rifle and prepare for the threat, I hopefully will have time to put in plugs. If not, I'd rather be deaf than dead. At the house I have a pair of muffs on top the safe for the same reason.

And before anyone asks, no, I didn't get a chance to put them in before my recent encounter with Fluffy, the Amazing Wonder Pit. I have used them clearing buildings, on barricades, and other calls where gunfire was possible but not imminent. They aren't real comfortable, but they work.

But back on topic, my only concern would be just how effective would 5.56 be out of that super short barrel? Its still a pistol and it fires a round highly dependent of velocity to be effective. You might actually be better off with a heavy scoped revolver as a reach out and touch em kind of gun if a rifle isn't an option. If you want a rifle, my reccomendation for a truck gun has always been as short barrelled a lever action you can find. Something like the 16 inch Marlin in 30-30 is ideal. Its relatively inexpensive, effective out to any range you could justify using it in defense, and absolutely benign in appearence. Even non gun people see one and think "cowboy" instead of "Rambo". Such things make a difference sometimes, like when you are explaining to officer friendly that you had been out sighting it in for a hunt earlier and forgot it was still back there.

Again, all of this is my personal opinion, and is worth about what you paid me for it. If the PLR makes you happy, and you want to justify owning it, then it makes a perfect truck gun and I promise not to tell your wife, girlfriend, life partner, or Chief Financial Officer any different.

 

[M2 Carbine]

copaup
But back on topic, my only concern would be just how effective would 5.56 be out of that super short barrel?

I've done some backyard experimenting with the effectiveness of the PLR.

The muzzle velocity is 2550+. This is a very hot (pistol) round. Not up to rifle velocity but still very fast.

1/4 inch steel plate. Not bad for a 9 inch barrel.
The chipped paint is from "normal" 9mm, 45ACP, etc, pistol bullets.


IMO, FMJ ammo is for practice and JSP should be used for defense.
This is a Remington 55gr JSP 2,350 fps reload shot from the PLR, compared to a 45ACP Gold Dot.


The PLR is VERY accurate from close up to much further out than normal pistol distance.
Blasting while standing at 100 yards.
Fun.


For serious practice the PLR will do as well or better than many AR rifles.

 

[MachIVshooter]

I've never shot one of these things so I've got to ask exactly how loud are we talking? Is this .454 Casull loud or .44 Mag loud?

Hows about much more than either. The PLR is the loudest firearm I own, save only my AR-50 .50 BMG. It is noticeably more obnoxious with ear protection than my 16" AR-10 (though this could be percieved rather than real, due to being that much closer to the muzzle).

Put it this way, I hope to god I never have to fire it w/o ear protection. Will likely be the last thing I ever hear.

 

[The Lone Haranguer]

http://www.kel-tec.com/su16c.html

This little rifle, with its stock folded, is little if any larger than the pistol, can have the stock unfolded to shoot more accurately, or looks like it can be fired with the stock folded in a pinch. And the longer barrel would reduce the roar and blast as well as impart more speed to the little bullet.

Just a thought ...

 

[M2 Carbine]

Hows about much more than either. The PLR is the loudest firearm I own, save only my AR-50 .50 BMG.

One of my neighbors is about 200 ft from my shooting bench. For many years he's heard me shooting everything from 30.06 on down.
The first day after shooting the PLR, when I was walking by his fence he asked,
What the heck are you shooting? I've never heard anything that loud.

 

[rantingredneck]

This little rifle, with its stock folded, is little if any larger than the pistol, can have the stock unfolded to shoot more accurately, or looks like it can be fired with the stock folded in a pinch. And the longer barrel would reduce the roar and blast as well as impart more speed to the little bullet.

Just a thought ...

That's a rifle though and would have to be in a locked case in my truck in NC. Looking for a pistol here, hence the PLR. If I'm going to end up going the rifle route it'll probably be a cheap milsurp or lever gun in the toolbox.

 

[M2 Carbine]

The Lone Haranguer
This little rifle, with its stock folded, is little if any larger than the pistol, can have the stock unfolded to shoot more accurately, or looks like it can be fired with the stock folded in a pinch. And the longer barrel would reduce the roar and blast as well as impart more speed to the little bullet.

Just a thought ...

Got one.
Actually I got the CA model. IMO the stock appears too flimsy on the C model.

It's apples and oranges.
The rifle has a 16 inch barrel and the PLR is a pistol with a 9 inch barrel.
It just depends on what someone wants.
Or get both.

(the CA model won't fire with the stock folded)

 

[Steelcore]

Install a locking tonneau cover.If your tailgate has a lock on it your good to go.If you don't have a locking tailgate,check with the parts guy at your local dealership and see if he has one that will fit.Unlike a cap,no one can see whats in there.

 

[BADUNAME13]

It's still a pistol.

I'd put an SKS in the toolbox and forget about it.

 

[Soybomb]

Well I'm not much of a truck gun guy myself anyway so fair warning anyway...

1) effective caliber!

Remember much of the effectiveness of 5.56 is due to its velocity. You'll certainly want to use jsp's and not expect any fragmentation from fmj rounds. I've yet to see a gel test on anything like 75gr tap rounds from a barrel this size but I'd look for them before buying one.

 

[M2 Carbine]

Soybomb
Remember much of the effectiveness of 5.56 is due to its velocity. You'll certainly want to use jsp's and not expect any fragmentation from fmj rounds. I've yet to see a gel test on anything like 75gr tap rounds from a barrel this size but I'd look for them before buying one.

Considering that one of the reasons for the PLR is to stand in for a rifle, accuracy at distance is a important consideration.
I didn't write down the info but so far the hundred yard accuracy of heavier bullets has been disappointing.

I had thought that heavy JSP bullets would be the way to go but I'm not sure. The jury is still out on the accuracy and lower velocity of the heavy bullets. First chance I get I have to load a large sample of heavy mushrooming bullets.

One thing that hasn't been said about the PLR yet is the gun is just a heck of a lot of fun.
It's probably the all around most interesting gun that I've bought in a long time.

 

[Soybomb]

I didn't write down the info but so far the hundred yard accuracy of heavier bullets has been disappointing.

I wonder if the 1:9 twist can be blamed for that.

One thing that hasn't been said about the PLR yet is the gun is just a heck of a lot of fun.
It's probably the all around most interesting gun that I've bought in a long time.

I sure would like one for fun!

 

[M2 Carbine]

Soybomb
I wonder if the 1:9 twist can be blamed for that.

I don't know.
I would think a 1:9 should stabilize about a 60-65 grain bullet (depending on the shape) but like I said so far just loading a few different heavier than 55gr bullets hasn't looked good in the PLR.

I recently stocked up on heavy Hornady and Sierra .223 bullets to.
Well, I've got a 1:7 Colt AR that might like them.

 

[Navy joe]

I've been puzzling the same thing because in the National Forests that surround me I can carry a pistol year round, but no to a rifle unless hunting. I think the PLR would be dandy. I had an AR pisto lfor a short time and my observation is 5.56 pistols are damn loud and I think pretty useless without a dot sight. The PLR less so since it wisely uses a blade rear sight. Right now a pretty constant woods/truck/everyday gun for me is the Glock 9mm platforms. I can carry them easily on person while having a 2nd gun or spare 33rd mags in the truck or Camel-bak. Lots of spare Mags.