DJ E.
Member
Exactly. No sugarcoating here, call it how you see it for once...
DJ
"kind and intellectual" youth shot by police officer!
- Thread starter Weimadog
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Exactly. No sugarcoating here, call it how you see it for once...
DJ
Hkmp5sd
Member
Whether due to panic, accident and/or intentional, the LEOs actions are based on his perceived threat. The same perceived threat by which us non-LEOs defend ourselves. Regardless of the reason the guy decided to drag the LEO along side the car, if the LEO feared for his life, his actions were completely justified.
Any reasonably knowledgeable person knows that such actions taken against a LEO have the possible effect of greatly decreasing their expected lifespan.
All of Ted Bundy's friends thought he was "kind and intellectual" too.
Any reasonably knowledgeable person knows that such actions taken against a LEO have the possible effect of greatly decreasing their expected lifespan.
All of Ted Bundy's friends thought he was "kind and intellectual" too.
We had a very similar incident in Idaho. Perp drove off with the LEO's are in the car. LEO shot the driver.
After much investigation, and much hand-wringing by the media, it was pronounced a good shoot. I can't see how it could be otherwise.
In my experience, "kind and intellectual" people do not drag cops.
After much investigation, and much hand-wringing by the media, it was pronounced a good shoot. I can't see how it could be otherwise.
In my experience, "kind and intellectual" people do not drag cops.
45R
Member
Then he should have been smart enough not to provok an officer of the law to use deadly force against him.
MissleCop...
So there's 'absolutely no reason for a seventeen year old to be out at almost two in the morning'? Jeez, when I was seventeen I was out that late almost every single night of the week! Of course it was because I worked steady midnights in a steel factory.
Point being, bad parenting or not, the guy was not a kid. I got the impression from your post that his 'mommy' was to blame. Not so. The guy was an adult IMHO ...
So there's 'absolutely no reason for a seventeen year old to be out at almost two in the morning'? Jeez, when I was seventeen I was out that late almost every single night of the week! Of course it was because I worked steady midnights in a steel factory.
Point being, bad parenting or not, the guy was not a kid. I got the impression from your post that his 'mommy' was to blame. Not so. The guy was an adult IMHO ...
Archie
Member
What do you expect from Mom?
From the sound of it, it was a legally proper shoot.
I almost said "good"; I really don't think a 17 year old getting killed is "good", even if he caused the problem. Not to say the officer just should have hung on to the side of the car and tried to "bond"....
These things don't happen in one instance. The circumstances for this have been building up for 17 years, anyway.
I especially liked the statement:
Not usually from the mother.
From the sound of it, it was a legally proper shoot.
I almost said "good"; I really don't think a 17 year old getting killed is "good", even if he caused the problem. Not to say the officer just should have hung on to the side of the car and tried to "bond"....
These things don't happen in one instance. The circumstances for this have been building up for 17 years, anyway.
I especially liked the statement:
No kidding?
Standing Wolf
Member in memoriam
I'm sure all manner of "suggestions" have been made.
Don Gwinn
Moderator Emeritus
He was perhaps not a "child," but he was in high school. Definitely a kid.
capt_happypants
Member In Memoriam
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2003
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God, why does every two-bit punk that gets zapped end up being the second coming of Christ? He wanted the thug life, he lived the thug life, he rolled the Darwin Dice and came up snake eyes.
Bring out the poverty pimps and the race hustlers. Hamstring the cops and let the fun begin. The slow death of St. Louis continues...
Bring out the poverty pimps and the race hustlers. Hamstring the cops and let the fun begin. The slow death of St. Louis continues...
duck hunt
Member
Semf and Apple....
and anyone else who may jump to the conclusion that all alternative school programs are "the short bus school for behavioral and learning problems" -- I took the liberty of looking up the kid's school. He attended the Ombudsman Program, for which one has to be recommended, interviewed and approved. It's for students who are self-motivated and learn better in an independent environment. Granted, the kid screwed up big time if the article printed at the beginning of this thread is accurate, but don't judge his school by his actions.
I attended the Open High School, a similar school in Richmond, Virginia. My SATs got me some piece of paper from the National Honor Society (some kinda honorable mention, I don't remember the term) and I went on to graduate from William and Mary with a double major and get an MFA after that. I teach at an alternative school now, so I am a little touchy about the stereotype!
I'll jump on the bandwagon a little with the public school bashing, however -- at the website of the school mentioned in the article, they have a lovely "photo gallary (sic)."
and anyone else who may jump to the conclusion that all alternative school programs are "the short bus school for behavioral and learning problems" -- I took the liberty of looking up the kid's school. He attended the Ombudsman Program, for which one has to be recommended, interviewed and approved. It's for students who are self-motivated and learn better in an independent environment. Granted, the kid screwed up big time if the article printed at the beginning of this thread is accurate, but don't judge his school by his actions.
I attended the Open High School, a similar school in Richmond, Virginia. My SATs got me some piece of paper from the National Honor Society (some kinda honorable mention, I don't remember the term) and I went on to graduate from William and Mary with a double major and get an MFA after that. I teach at an alternative school now, so I am a little touchy about the stereotype!
I'll jump on the bandwagon a little with the public school bashing, however -- at the website of the school mentioned in the article, they have a lovely "photo gallary (sic)."
semf
member
Around here you get to the Alternative School on the short bus after you've been kicked out of every other school in the district and there is no more room in juvy.
The schools you describe are Magnate Schools or Eccelerated Learning Centers ( or something like that).
That he was in such a program makes him even stupider than I first thought. He threw away a chance to better his own life and that of his family. That's if I'm not jumping to assumptions based on his sister's account of the crime rate in their area.
The schools you describe are Magnate Schools or Eccelerated Learning Centers ( or something like that).
That he was in such a program makes him even stupider than I first thought. He threw away a chance to better his own life and that of his family. That's if I'm not jumping to assumptions based on his sister's account of the crime rate in their area.
Wildalaska
member
Sarcasm hat on..
The usual thread here, similar too the basic...
All lawyers are anti american greedy sharks unless they work for KABA or Randy Weaver...
All cops are jackbooted thugs who despoil the innocent, unless the perp is a black rapper....
All guilty are innocent if they are one of us, all innocent are guilty if they are one of them...
No kid shot by a cop is ever good, no cop shooting a kid is ever bad....
Sarcasm hat off
WildletsseewhatagrandjurysaysAlaska
The usual thread here, similar too the basic...
All lawyers are anti american greedy sharks unless they work for KABA or Randy Weaver...
All cops are jackbooted thugs who despoil the innocent, unless the perp is a black rapper....
All guilty are innocent if they are one of us, all innocent are guilty if they are one of them...
No kid shot by a cop is ever good, no cop shooting a kid is ever bad....
Sarcasm hat off
WildletsseewhatagrandjurysaysAlaska
Hey Weimadog....................The link you provided about the rap artist also had another story of interest. It was about a robbery victim who disarmed the perp & beat him with his own gun. Did you notice it??
It was a cool story.
It was a cool story.
twoblink
Member
What the police should do (since they are so unwelcome) is have the Blue Flu there for a month... Then we'll see how much "safer" the streets are..
Yep, he reads to me like a short bus candidate..
Dragging a police officer gets you shot... hm... sounds about right to me...
Yep, he reads to me like a short bus candidate..
Dragging a police officer gets you shot... hm... sounds about right to me...
I think you guys are being a little rough on the alternative school kids,often these schools provide great work-study programs that teach "troubled" kids a trade or skill.
Not everyone fits into the mold exactly and if it helps a kid become a productive citizen than I'm all for these schools as long as they don't become a burden to the tax payers.
This kid did not (seem) to be living in a world of reality and did not realize that with bad actions come bad consiquences..........that is the first lesson my boys were taught when they were young......play with fire you're gonna get burned
Not everyone fits into the mold exactly and if it helps a kid become a productive citizen than I'm all for these schools as long as they don't become a burden to the tax payers.
This kid did not (seem) to be living in a world of reality and did not realize that with bad actions come bad consiquences..........that is the first lesson my boys were taught when they were young......play with fire you're gonna get burned
Frank5, yes, I know the story about the 'victim' beating the criminal with a gun. As I recall, a passerby then stole the gun
Here is an attachment, which is a photo which went along with the original story in this thread. The photo in the photo of the slain rapper, and the guy holding it claims to be his cousin. Notice the beer bottle. What a memorial. I feel dirty posting it,< edited to remove the picture. It was a picture of some lowlife holding a photo of the slain rapper, and a beer bottle, showing the photo to passing motorists as a memorial. It represents the antithesis of "The High Road". Yeeeech.>
Here is an attachment, which is a photo which went along with the original story in this thread. The photo in the photo of the slain rapper, and the guy holding it claims to be his cousin. Notice the beer bottle. What a memorial. I feel dirty posting it,< edited to remove the picture. It was a picture of some lowlife holding a photo of the slain rapper, and a beer bottle, showing the photo to passing motorists as a memorial. It represents the antithesis of "The High Road". Yeeeech.>
duck hunt
Member
I think you mean magnet schools and accelerated learning centers. A "magnet" school is any school which draws students from all over the district, and that can be due to high grades, specialized talents (such as music -- which could include rap -- or art) or different learning styles (need for more or less structure etc.). An accelerated learning center would be something like a gifted program, a Governor's School or, in the case of the kid in St. Louis, an Ombudsman's program. All of the previously mentioned types of schools could be considered Alternative Schools, as they are alternatives to the standard high school for which one is zoned.
I don't doubt that in your area, and in many areas, "alternative school" has come to carry a negative connotation. I've been fighting that one for over twenty years now, and I don't suppose it will ever end. People believe what they want to believe. It seems that a lot of people on this thread wear some preconceptions about rap music on their sleeves, too....but as has been stated before, we are not to turn this into a discussion on music appreciation and the lack thereof....
Back to the topic, the kid dragged a cop and was in possession of a handgun underage. Those are the pertinent facts, not the school he attended or what type of music he made.
semf
member
Then why did the newspaper write those facts into the article. And why did the mother use these as arguments why the cop should not have shot him.
The discussion is more than the events that led to his demize but also of the community's and his family's reation to it.
I gave you the terms used in my area to describe the different school programs here if you don't like them contact our school board. At least they're not still called EMR or Special Ed anymore.
You'll have to forgive my spelling on my previous post I work nights and it was either late or early and we don't have spell checker here, and I'm running out of excuses so just give me detention. (I graduated 22 years ago and still hold the record for consecutive detention. And I still got to ride the big bus )
The discussion is more than the events that led to his demize but also of the community's and his family's reation to it.
I gave you the terms used in my area to describe the different school programs here if you don't like them contact our school board. At least they're not still called EMR or Special Ed anymore.
You'll have to forgive my spelling on my previous post I work nights and it was either late or early and we don't have spell checker here, and I'm running out of excuses so just give me detention. (I graduated 22 years ago and still hold the record for consecutive detention. And I still got to ride the big bus
)MrAcheson
Member
I was in "special ed". When I was younger (elementary school), I was something of a discipline problem. It was mostly because I got bored easily and was usually way ahead of my teacher (who was often teaching me what I considered to be obvious). Long story short, I was put in the "gifted" program and flourished there at the leading edge of the bell curve.
Not all "alternative schools" or "special ed" programs are the same. I was one of the smart kids. Many of the "dumb kids" are also fine upstanding individuals I am proud to call friends. Some special eds and alternative schoolers are problem kids, some are not. Please do not paint us all with the same brush.
Not all "alternative schools" or "special ed" programs are the same. I was one of the smart kids. Many of the "dumb kids" are also fine upstanding individuals I am proud to call friends. Some special eds and alternative schoolers are problem kids, some are not. Please do not paint us all with the same brush.
scbair
Member
No kid should ever be shot by the police . . .
Several years ago, in my city (where I once served as a police officer), a police supervisor shot & killed a youth at a nightclub. Disregarding the facts that (a) the kid was underaged to be a a nightclub and (b) the kid had a handgun, the press immediately reported bystanders' complaints that the kid was NOT pointing the handgun at the officer, and the officer shot for no reason. The officer maintained the handgun WAS pointed at him (the officer) when the officer fired in self defense. A number of "witnesses" disputed this.
Enter the forensics folks. An old buddy of mine, during autopsy/medical exam, noted a number of lead dust particles imbedded in the "victim's" skin, about the upper chest, throat and head. The bullet struck the chest. Closer review of the "victim's" handgun revealed a lead smear on the topstrap.
The officer's bullet had glanced off the top of the "victim's" handgun, and then struck and killed the youth. The lead particles had sprayed into the upper body after the impact with the weapon.
The coroner revealed this, and suddenly all "witnesses" declined to testify under oath that the "victim" had been in a non-threatening posture at the time of the shooting. Thank heavens for an alert forensics technician!
Several years ago, in my city (where I once served as a police officer), a police supervisor shot & killed a youth at a nightclub. Disregarding the facts that (a) the kid was underaged to be a a nightclub and (b) the kid had a handgun, the press immediately reported bystanders' complaints that the kid was NOT pointing the handgun at the officer, and the officer shot for no reason. The officer maintained the handgun WAS pointed at him (the officer) when the officer fired in self defense. A number of "witnesses" disputed this.
Enter the forensics folks. An old buddy of mine, during autopsy/medical exam, noted a number of lead dust particles imbedded in the "victim's" skin, about the upper chest, throat and head. The bullet struck the chest. Closer review of the "victim's" handgun revealed a lead smear on the topstrap.
The officer's bullet had glanced off the top of the "victim's" handgun, and then struck and killed the youth. The lead particles had sprayed into the upper body after the impact with the weapon.
The coroner revealed this, and suddenly all "witnesses" declined to testify under oath that the "victim" had been in a non-threatening posture at the time of the shooting. Thank heavens for an alert forensics technician!
Sportcat
Member
Cool... I thought they only got that detailed on CSI! Good job by the forensics person/ team.
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