NYC cop shot, partner runs...

[WT]

FWIW, The New York Post reports that Marrero has 30 arrests in the past 12 years. I don't know if that is average, above or below, whatever ......?

Other officers said that Marrero was a very quiet guy, sort of withdrawn.

The Post also reports that the BG had an H&K .45 ACP. Nice piece.

The NYC local TV media is all over this case. Marrero's reputation is ruined.

 

[Vernal45]

Lets not be too mean to the officer, he probably just wanted to go home to his family alive. That is the mantra with todays LEO's. Everybodys rights be damned, even partners, I have to go home alive.

 

[Rebar]

Everybodys rights be damned, even partners, I have to go home alive.

The very definition of cowardess.

 

[Vernal45]

The very definition of cowardess.

Yes , it is. The officer in question is a coward, plain and simple.

 

[middy]

I can't blame him for running. As others have pointed out, you almost never know how anyone is going to react once the lead starts flying, yourself included. I only know this by reading numerous first hand accounts of firefights in war memoirs (thank goodness).

But, failing to return and render aid as soon as possible looks a little chicken for a LEO to me. I wasn't there, maybe he couldn't see that the perp had left the scene, but failing to advance after he had regained control of his feet and called for backup, while his partner lies there bleeding... that's pretty weak for a 12 year veteran.

Then again, maybe he's been in the thick of it for too long, seen too many dead and lost his nerve. He probably needs to retire, and I think they should let him make an honorable resignation.

I'm not saying I could do any better, but I haven't shouldered the responsibilites of a sworn LEO.

 

[torpid]

Couple of questions for the keyboard commandos


How many folks here have been shot at? Without question the person shooting was indeed shooting at you and you knew it.

How many folks here have had to return fire or just fire upon a full-blown threat?

How many folks here can honestly stand here today and predict just how you will react in any given situation where you are in complete and total fear of dying?

Fair enough.


However, if I ran from my wounded partner and stayed back until after the guy who shot him left, and waited for a police van with another officer arrived on the scene several minutes later before I came out again (if accounts are to be believed), I'd expect the opinions to be a tad on the critical side (though so far Officer Marrero isn't whitewashing his inaction, to his credit- he's likely taking it to a heavy heart).

Understanding and sympathizing with the realities of why he reacted that way is important to consider, but it may be better to have the attitude (at least for future officers) of "never- EVER leave your partner behind in a world of s*** " than to say "well, if you run away and leave your partner to his fate, that's just unpredictable human nature, who are we to say how you should react in these kinds of situations".

In a nutshell- yes, I'm just a guy on an internet forum, so I'll just wait and accept the opinion of the recovering Officer Caprice as the final word on this one, though I anticipate it is going to be a rather forgiving one in his public statements.



.

 

[Cosmoline]

This is one of those stories where I strongly suspect we have only some of the facts, or the facts have been mangled by the press. At any rate I'm not going to judge someone for trying to find cover in a gunfight. Running up boldly to save your partner, only to be shot yourself, is idiotic Sillywood tactics.

 

[Elmer]

FWIW, The New York Post reports that Marrero has 30 arrests in the past 12 years. I don't know if that is average, above or below, whatever ......?

Hard to believe that figure. 30 arrests would be considered an OK month in most large west coast cities. On a busy beat, you could double that.

As far as the running officer, I too, won't judge him, not knowing every detail. But similar stories, although still rare, are not unheard of.

But I do think there's something else going on here. Law enforcement has been breeding out aggressiveness for many years. Officer's who react quickly in stressful situations are judged harshly by the departments, the legal system, and especially the media. Even occasionally on boards like this one....

All the downsides of their possible actions are constantly in the back of their minds. I truly think that fear of the ramifications of using force, may be greater than the fear of the real danger, in many cases. A split second decision that turns out to be wrong, can ruin your life. This scenario seems so cut and dry, and all the armchair "combat masters" are sure of how they would have reacted. We don't know what was in Marrero's mind, or if his brain was even processing it. I've been shot at from a few feet away, and never heard the gunshot, although I saw the gun and the flash.

Lots of good cops, who reacted differently in similar situations, were hung out to dry. The cities are far more worried about litigation from "bad" shootings, then they are about protecting the public or the officers. The psychological tests, and background investigations have been designed to weed out aggressiveness and individual thinking for many years.

We get exactly the law enforcement we ask for and deserve.

 

[Vernal45]

Lots of good cops, who reacted differently in similar situations, were hung out to dry. The cities are far more worried about litigation from "bad" shootings, then they are about protecting the public or the officers. The psychological tests, and background investigations have been designed to weed out aggressiveness and individual thinking for many years.

That, we agree on.

 

[Spreadfire Arms]

i dont know if there is a NYPD policy about dereliction of duty but when i was an LE officer there certainly was.

dereliction of duty could have been something simple like failing to assist a citizen or refusing to do your job like writing a report when policy required it. but it can also be failing to render aid to your fellow officer(s).

the issues that will be brought up are:

1. when he ran, did he at least call for help on the radio and advise that his partner had been shot? or did he just run and not advise anyone?

2. is this a training issue? was the officer properly trained? you would think as a 12 year veteran he had alot of training.

3. was he in a position to shoot at a BG? sometimes you can't due to your background.

we'll see how this plays out. but if my partner ran like hell i dont think i'd be too happy with him.....

and 30 arrests in a 12 month period is extremely low. That is 2-3 arrests per month, or less than 1 a week.

 

[WT]

Spreadfire - that was 30 arrests in 12 YEARS.

 

[GRB]

I will not judge the officer for seeking cover when the shooting started. I will not judge him for not firing back as he moved to cover, nor once he had attained cover or concealment. I will not judge him for doing almost nothing as the perp turned and went back to try to finish off the fallen officer. I will judge him, based on the info I have, for not going to assist his brother officer once the threat had departed. If what has been portrayed so far is true and correct, then this guy committed an act of blatant cowardice regarding his reported failure to assist the fallen officer once the threat had departed.

If it is all correct, then I would hope that his conscience would hound him for the remainder of his life and, I would hope he is too much of a coward to off himself so that he will have to suffer through years of remorse. I don't care how scared one may be, the thing to do, the thing to prepare yourself for, the thing to live for, the thing to die for in any such situation is the protection of your partner because he is doing the same for you. The thing about cowards is that they get scared and just react to the fear and let it overwhelm them. A brave man is scared too, sometimes more scared than a coward but, the brave man does the right thing and takes action despite the fear instead of just reacting and succumbing to it. If the reports were correct, then I have no pity for this guy - he had a choice to make and made it; now he has to live with it for the remainder of his forever.

Sincerely,
Glenn B

 

[Old Guy]

One must really read the police after action report with the scene played out as a scenario, or rather what the news story said, and it was not contradicted.

Shot fired on drivers side, from inside of the car, aimed over shoulder, shot Officer would have been approaching from the adrenalin rush of a high speed chase, his Glock 17 would have been gripped in both hands, the passenger side would have been approached by the other Officer, also gun in hand, I would almost guarantee that, sequence of events “Bang” partner vanishes from sight, automatic reaction, flash light up, commence firing, at the threat, he, the runner was not being fired on!!

The above is not retreating for the reason to go to cover, you are at more risk offering your back to a shooter, if he still has a job after this he will never have another partner, ever.

 

[PATH]

Never leave your buddy. Never. Your life depends on him and his depends on you. That is the way I was raised.

It is very easy to sit here and try to monday morning this episode but the final judge is Officer Caprice. I sit in judgement on no man save myself and maybe there but for the grace of God go I. I have never left a buddy in a pinch. Then again maybe I lose my nerve someday for whatever reason.

Don't pile on Marrero. You could not make him feel worse. Trust me. He has to live with his actions captured on film. He may have to face Caprice and explain his actions. Damned if I am going to cast the first stone.

Thank God Officer Caprice is going to make it! At least there is that piece of good news.

 

[RaggedClaws]

I sit in judgement on no man save myself...

I guess you've never served on a jury then?

 

[Ed]

Kinda off topic, but not really, If he had a Glock 9mm and emptied the magazine and shot 14 rounds.... Did the reports get it wrong or does NYPD for some strange reason download?

 

[PATH]

raggedclaws,

For some reason I always get cut from the pool early on. Go figure!

 

[Spreadfire Arms]

WT wrote:

"Spreadfire - that was 30 arrests in 12 YEARS."

Wow. in NYC you have to make an effort NOT to arrest people i'd think.

that takes extreme talent to arrest less than 4 people per year. that is the equivalent to one arrest every 3 months.

i think even the desk officer has higher arrest stats than that. :banghead:

 

[WT]

The good news is that the wounded officer was released from the hospital and sent home. Outside of the hospital, IN DRESS UNIFORM, 300 NYPD officers were there to provide support and a round of applause.

Hopefully, this shooting incident was an anomaly.