Kit 1911?

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hatchetbearer

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I have broken down and realized the only way I am ever going to get a 1911 is build one myself. I am that "anytime I save money, something bad happens" type so i was looking at a doublestar frame from centerfire and a parts kit from sarco inc.


i assume this is doable in theory, but I'd like to put it together myself, for the sake of saying "It's MY gun, I built it" I know its not for the faint of heart to mess with the fiddly internals of a gun, but if I do get in over my head, I could always let a real gunsmith take over.

A few questions,

are the parts good enough to make it go bang when i pull the trigger? I realize I'll have a half ton trigger pull and be doing good to get a 4" group at 10 yards but accuracy will come later with better barrel and whatnot.

Any one have actual assembly instructions? all i can find are dis-assembly and its inconvenient to work backwards like that.

should I expect to do some final filing and fitting? ive heard the horror stories of people blending the feed ramp to the frame and giving themselves a nice paperweight, but will all this supposed "mil-spec" stuff actually go together?

thanks.

(I just noticed they sell an armscor frame in stainless for $20 more anyone else think it would be neat to have a two tone gun?)
 
I am that "anytime I save money, something bad happens" type so i was looking at a doublestar frame from centerfire and a parts kit from sarco inc.
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It's about to happen to you again. :eek:

Best bet? Buy a Springfield GI and learn your way around the gun. Shoot it until you know what you need to do (if anything) to make it perfect for YOU.

Believe me, you'll save frustration and money in the long run.:banghead:
 
Best bet? Buy a Springfield GI and learn your way around the gun. Shoot it until you know what you need to do (if anything) to make it perfect for YOU.
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I built my 38 super from a rock island gi its cheaper than the springer. But I still have roughly 1k into the gun counting parts upgrades and machine work oh, and the price of the gun.
 
If you are mechanically inclined you can do it.

Assembling a 1911 from a kit WILL require hand fitting of most parts for proper function. That means bending, filing, dremeling, etc.

Replacing a simple part like an extractor in a factory complete gun takes hand fitting. It is a fact of life with 1911s.

Remember to take your time, consult an exploded view - www.okiegunsmithshop.com has lots - use the proper tools - this means you will probably need to buy some new tools that you don't have, don't force things, and remember, take your time. Did I mention to be patient and take your time?
 
Yeah I seen that frame was stainless and not "In the white" as i originally thought which would give a cool two tone look. what is wrong with the slide in the auto builders kit? it and the slide they offer separately look to be the same.
 
I've been down this road before:

are the parts good enough to make it go bang when i pull the trigger? I realize I'll have a half ton trigger pull and be doing good to get a 4" group at 10 yards but accuracy will come later with better barrel and whatnot.
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You can make a working gun -- I did it with a Fed Ord kit, but wound up spending more than if I'd bought a new gun. For example, I later installed a Chip McCormic prepped trigger and sear.

Any one have actual assembly instructions? all i can find are dis-assembly and its inconvenient to work backwards like that.
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You need to get a copy of Jerry Kuhnhausen's The Colt .45 Automatic, A Shop Manual first. Read it thoroughly and note the special tools you'll need -- for example staking tools for the front sight, plunger tube and grip screw bushings.
should I expect to do some final filing and fitting? ive heard the horror stories of people blending the feed ramp to the frame and giving themselves a nice paperweight, but will all this supposed "mil-spec" stuff actually go together?
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You will almost certainly have to do some fitting.
 
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=366661

I did it for about $450, gun has the beavertail and hammer installed now. Works great, 3.5# trigger pull too! I think a slide and frame from Brownell's is a better option, the frame already has the plunger tube, grip bushings and ejector installed and with C&R discount was only about $125.

Don't skimp on parts, I ended up not using much from Sarco except the Roto barrel, which so far works excellently. I saw a Wilson drop in barrel somewhere for not much money the other day, which may be an option.

Read the gunsmithing section here and on forum.m1911.org, then reread them. Don't let them scare you off but be aware.


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Try Caspian Arms and look at specials; also their shadow company Foster industries; they are selling contract overrun and cosmetic blem fitted slide and frame kits which are an excellent place to start; especially attractive are the 460 kits from Caspian. Advantage is you can get some of specialist mill work (BT cuts and edge bevel for instrance) done by them. Colt stock barrels tend to "drop in" to Caspian stuff.
+1 on Kuhnhausen manual; best thought seems to be minimize what you would need a Smith for (sorry Ky Smith) or isolate what you would really have a Smith do (match barrel install? nobody does a Bar-sto better than Bar Sto).
Cheers, TF
 
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The slide in the kit is G.I. nd the other seems to have front serrations and Novak type sights..
 
You simply cannot build a 1911 cheaper then you can buy a new one anymore.

Parts prices are off the charts as far as I'm concerned. Especially for quality parts!

rcmodel
 
Brownell's has a five-part series in the techtalk section on building a 1911. Wilson Combat makes a great 4-part dvd series called "Customizing the Combat 1911" (or something like that) that you can rent from www.smartflix.com. Jerry Kuhnhausens book is a requirement, at least volume one.

I've built a couple, it is a lot of work and you will not save any money. Your best bet is a Springer GI, or RIA, both of which can be had for under $500. This is how mine will be built from now on, it's waaay too much of a hassle to start from scratch.
 
Another thing to be said for starting with a Springer GI, or RIA is that you have a working gun (well, hopefully anyway) to learn from.

If you install an aftermarket part and it doesn't quite work or fit, you have a known good "pattern" part on hand to look at, or put back in the gun to get it working again.

When you start from scratch, with parts of unknown quality from say, SARCO, and happen to get tolerance stack on a couple of things, it is very difficult to pin down and fix if you have no experiance, or way of knowing what is wrong.
And no spare parts to swap out to try.

Then in the end, after you have replaced everything to make your perfect 1911, you have all the good parts left over in the spare parts box that are already fitted & tested in your frame.

rcmodel
 
Cost is my major concern, Was hoping I could get away with doing this under $450, since most dealers around here charge $500 for an RIA. And most dealers wont do transfers of items they have in stock, so you are forced to buy them at their markup. I asked about one of the century build AR's awhile back, and the guy wanted all the information on them, the guy said they couldnt do that, and a week later had 3 in for $1000 apiece (their minimum price for an AR.)

Well looks like this one will have to hit file 13 for a while, see if i can work something out in trade at a gun show. Thanks guys.
 
Cost is my major concern, Was hoping I could get away with doing this under $450, since most dealers around here charge $500 for an RIA. And most dealers wont do transfers of items they have in stock, so you are forced to buy them at their markup.
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Make a deal with your local pawnbroker -- mine does transfers for $10.
 
closest actual pawn shops (that deal in guns) are owned by said gun stores, kinda an all-in-one deal. its hard to find a decent store without driving 70 miles one way. think I'll save up and buy a GI springer with something in on trade as well
 
Yes - you CAN build one cheaper than buying new. (buying used is another story). Cheap frame plus a Sarco kit, IS less expensive. You MAY need to do a lot of checking and maybe some fitting, but it's doable. However Sarco parts, tho they "usually" fit and work, may need fitting, and may not last too long. If you plan to fire 500 rds a week, not a good idea. You can buy, a piece at a time, new, top-end parts, and fit them to your gun.
Parts will wear, and parts will break, but they do in any gun, just faster here. Eventually, you will have $600~7000 into it, but in a piece-meal way. You need to have good mechanical skills, and a willingness to buy good tools (or it's 3-4X harder). Among other things which I have done, I have done this.

If you do decide to do this, join m1911.org, and do the forums - 'specially gunsmithing. Don't smart off, and don't tell that you are doing a Sarco kit, just ask about parts fitting. BTW, anything 1911 can be found there (technically, infowise ...)
b
 
Last I heard...

Target World in Cinci would do transfers; at least to or from Ky.
Southern Ohio Gun may or may not still sell to the public?
Cheers, TF
 
Hatchet -

Depending where you are in SE OH..... Ohio Valley Gun in Athens always treated me right when I went to school at OU. That was 5 years ago so I can't comment on their current policies, but in the past they always did me right.
 
Im 65miles away from athens, but i have a friend that goes to school down there. They just built a new mega store about 10 miles up the road from the athens store. should make for a decent road trip.
 
Personally, I wouldn't go through the trouble of building a gun if the only thing your trying to do is save money. Most people that build kit guns are hobbyists that have more fun takings their guns apart than shooting them.

Your typical Kit builder usually gets it in their head that if they build their own piece, its going to be the perfect gun and it becomes an obsession. This coupled with technical problems makes it fairly easy for people to spend more on their kits than a nice factory gun would have cost them.

Don't expect to save much if you succeed in building an Armscore kit gun on the cheap (factory ones are worth about $300 used). And keep in mind that if you ever go to sell it, you'll probly get less than half of what you have invested in it.

I wouldn't build one unless your passionate about having a gun you built with your own hands.

You can get a great deal on a gently used 1911 if you shop around, and you'll lose pennies on resale in comparison with new. You can even transfer the factory warranty with some manufacturers.
 
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