Lead ban preparation.

[bearcreek]

I do shoot at an Indian reserve and I'm not sure how federal rules effect that.

The tribe would set the rules for that. The legislation you're talking about here would not ban lead anywhere outside National Wildlife Refuges. You really should change the OP and poll to reflect that fact. The way you have it worded is extremely misleading.

 

[AJC1]

The tribe would set the rules for that. The legislation you're talking about here would not ban lead anywhere outside National Wildlife Refuges. You really should change the OP and poll to reflect that fact. The way you have it worded is extremely misleading.

Federal lands is the bill. I may have detracted with my reserve comment.

The proposed lead ban on refuges kicks open the barn door to banning lead ammunition and tackle on all federal land, including National Forests, Bureau of Land Management Lands, National Preserves, and other areas

The genesis of the post is do you have a load a plan...

 

[bearcreek]

Federal lands is the bill. I may have detracted with my reserve comment.

The proposed lead ban on refuges kicks open the barn door to banning lead ammunition and tackle on all federal land, including National Forests, Bureau of Land Management Lands, National Preserves, and other areas

No, Federal lands is not the bill. National Wildlife Refuges is. The bill would ban lead for any NEW hunting or fishing opportunities on National Wildlife Refuges. It has no effect on the vast majority of federal land, including NWR's that are currently open to hunting and fishing. I understand the concern, but misleading thread titles and half true poll answer options don't help people intelligently consider the issue and what they want to do about it.

 

[courtgreene]

So, even though it may be misleading, this thread got me thinking about some things.
If there were a ban that was wide reaching, the damage wouldn’t be in not having working options, it would be in finding the components to make those options work. A run on all copper (or some other potential monometal) bullets would put a lot of people out of the game for a long time.
I just cranked out a bunch of .308 and .300wsm loads. They are expensive, but more importantly they were hard enough to find that I won’t be target shooting or practicing much with them.
This is not a doomsday post. I don’t think any sweeping changes are coming (but am humble enough to admit I’m no fortune teller and have zero information). Rather, it’s a reminder that other factors affect shooting/hunting accessibility beyond simply having a plan that works in theory.

 

[westernrover]

I don't share the concerns of some about lead ammunition polluting the environment, but the threat it poses to people's health is real. I don't think it's the proper role of government to decide for people. People should be making choices for themselves to limit their exposure to lead. I only hunt with monos and my choice has nothing to do with bans or threats of bans.

Lead would not be a target of antis if pros would do what it takes to make themselves independent of lead. The firearms industry colludes with antis because bans and threats of bans are good for profits. What both the industry and the antis want are consumers that are dependent on something that can be made scarce. The antis believe they're doing something or they see opportunity to claim credit for doing something to limit 2A activity and growth, and the industry knows it will generate profits. Cling to something, and it will surely be the thing they come for.

 

[jmorris]

This was not the intent of my thread to be politically charged but how we can deal and plan to continue doing what we do. A lead ban kills shooting my old war horses like 7.7 jap.

…on “any new hunting opportunities on National Wildlife Refuges across the country.” From the article you linked to.

Maybe hunt anywhere that’s not a National Wildlife Refuge?

You could also put the smiles on the faces of other 7.7 jap fans and come out with your own non toxic projectiles or even loaded ammunition. If you’re looking for a doorway, instead of a road block.

 

[AJC1]

…on “any new hunting opportunities on National Wildlife Refuges across the country.” From the article you linked to.

Maybe hunt anywhere that’s not a National Wildlife Refuge?

You could also put the smiles on the faces of other 7.7 jap fans and come out with your own non toxic projectiles or even loaded ammunition. If you’re looking for a doorway, instead of a road block.

There are other soft metals that are discussed like zinc. I only got to shoot it 3x a year back home during the military bolt days. It works good getting her out of the safe, pushing a few bullets down the bore and keeping her clean and maintained. I'm curious if sabbots will become popular to fix the problem.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

I have never hunted on federal land before and probably never will. However, I have a small amount of all copper ammo saved up from ongoing testing of various 6.5 Grendel bullets on hogs and such. I have even managed to find a couple I really like.

 

[jmorris]

There are other soft metals that are discussed like zinc….I'm curious if sabbots will become popular to fix the problem.

Who makes 7.7 sabots?

Zinc was used for bullets before zinc wheel weights existed believe it or not. You might find this interesting.

https://hawkbullets.com/prot-x-bore.html

 

[AJC1]

Who makes 7.7 sabots?

Zinc was used for bullets before zinc wheel weights existed believe it or not. You might find this interesting.

https://hawkbullets.com/prot-x-bore.html

You said think up a solution, that's my best guess in a solution. Maybe a 30 caliber would work.

 

[jmorris]

Before I tried to reinvent the wheel, I would try these.

 

[kalielkslayer]

I live in California, but hunt all over the west. My 7mm mag has never fired a monolithic bullet, and never will. It’s my primary out of state gun due to the accuracy of the gun/load.

My .338 has only been fed monolithic bullets for the last 20 years, as well as my .280 and the wife’s 7mm/08.

Right now I’m trying to get a monolithic bullet to shoot in both my 22-250 and my .243. I’ve never had an issue with the other guns shooting them well. I’m at the top of the weight range for my barrels and because they are longer, maybe that my issue?

As far as shotgun. It’s been 30 years since we could shoot lead on refuges here. But I do most of my upland game hunting on BLM in Nevada, and just loaded 12 boxes for this upcoming season. If they try to expand this to all federal lands, {€!#%!! €#!!

 

[Wolfshead]

This is another way to make it more difficult to have a firearm.
If they can’t have a total ban, then they’ll just regulate and/or price you out of it.
They’ve been talking about this in NY on the states public lands for a few years now.
When that began I bought a few boxes of bullets “just in case”.
Actually, I’ve have no problems with this type of bullet. it is just that they are a bit more expensive AND becoming harder to get (like everything else)

 

[Patocazador]

"Filed in the Federal Register on June 8, the USFWS commits to a lead ban on any NEW hunting opportunities on National Wildlife Refuges across the country."

Above is an excerpt from the proposal. It seems to say that it only applies to new hunts allowed on NWRs. If There is an existing hunt on a NWR and nothing changes then perhaps lead is not banned.

 

[bearcreek]

"Filed in the Federal Register on June 8, the USFWS commits to a lead ban on any NEW hunting opportunities on National Wildlife Refuges across the country."

Above is an excerpt from the proposal. It seems to say that it only applies to new hunts allowed on NWRs. If There is an existing hunt on a NWR and nothing changes then perhaps lead is not banned.

Correct. Lead is not banned on federal lands, only on areas of National Wildlife Refuges that have yet to be open to hunting or fishing. Unfortunately, this sort of thread is the thing that gets spread around and taken as gospel by lots of folks.

 

[WisBorn]

A lead ammo ban would be a hunting ban in some areas as you can't find ammo for all of the different cartridges that are popular, let alone non lead....

 

[westernrover]

Don't need ammo to hunt.

 

[bearcreek]

Don't need ammo to hunt.

That's kind of a ridiculous thing to say. True, you don't "need" ammo to hunt. You also don't "need" a house, or a computer or a vehicle or a bow or clothing or any of the numerous things humans have invented since being cave men. You could go live under a rock and eat insects till you learned how to sneak up on a deer and kill it with a rock. That's all you "need".

 

[Fyrstyk]

I only hunt with traditional muzzle loaders with patched lead round ball. I have no intention to switch to a non lead substitute. Lead in bullet & ball form has been used in this country for over 270 years with no detrimental effect on the environment with only rare cases of lead poisoning in animals and birds. Lead shot on the other hand can be harmful to to waterfowl that ingest the spent pellets and use them to grind their food in the gizzard. Most of the lead ingested by mammals and birds is expelled thru the normal digestive process onto the ground where it stays until dug up by someone. Lead does not migrate in the soil.

 

[BreechFace]

That's kind of a ridiculous thing to say. True, you don't "need" ammo to hunt. You also don't "need" a house, or a computer or a vehicle or a bow or clothing or any of the numerous things humans have invented since being cave men. You could go live under a rock and eat insects till you learned how to sneak up on a deer and kill it with a rock. That's all you "need".

That rock better not have any traces of lead in it!

 

[westernrover]

That's kind of a ridiculous thing to say. True, you don't "need" ammo to hunt. You also don't "need" a house, or a computer or a vehicle or a bow or clothing or any of the numerous things humans have invented since being cave men. You could go live under a rock and eat insects till you learned how to sneak up on a deer and kill it with a rock. That's all you "need".

It's not ridiculous. The previous poster said a lead ammo ban would be a hunting ban. That statement totally disregards all the excellent bow hunting people do every season. My statement doesn't support lead bans, but to claim that lead is necessary for hunting is ridiculous. People hunted this continent for thousands of years without using lead, and people every season do better hunting without lead than many people who use it. Forgoing lead hardly leads us back to the stone age in hunting.

 

[Barbaroja]

It's not ridiculous. The previous poster said a lead ammo ban would be a hunting ban. That statement totally disregards all the excellent bow hunting people do every season. My statement doesn't support lead bans, but to claim that lead is necessary for hunting is ridiculous. People hunted this continent for thousands of years without using lead, and people every season do better hunting without lead than many people who use it. Forgoing lead hardly leads us back to the stone age in hunting.

Technically correct which I feel like you were going for, that said it’s also short sighted and foolish

 

[bearcreek]

It's not ridiculous. The previous poster said a lead ammo ban would be a hunting ban. That statement totally disregards all the excellent bow hunting people do every season. My statement doesn't support lead bans, but to claim that lead is necessary for hunting is ridiculous. People hunted this continent for thousands of years without using lead, and people every season do better hunting without lead than many people who use it. Forgoing lead hardly leads us back to the stone age in hunting.

We'd be having a different discussion if you had said "Don't need lead to hunt".

 

[Robert]

Folks, let's leave the pointless politics out of this unless you just want it closed.

 

[mgmorden]

I don't want it to happen, but not the end of the world to me. My target shooting is on a private range/gun club - this only (potentially) affects a small subset of Federal government lands. The amount of bullets I actually send downrange at an animal is in the single digits per calendar year. There are already non-toxic options out there - mostly for handloaders but if this was any significant issue the market would adapt just like it did to produce steel shot for waterfowl use. Yes, they're a little more expensive, but as said with the number of bullets I'm actually shooting at animals the cost of the bullets themselves isn't much of a factor.

I'd moreso be annoyed about my existing supplies. If I didn't care which rifle I was shooting I've got enough hunting bullets to last a lifetime.

Didn't vote in the poll as there was no "much ado about nothing"-esque option .