Lee Six Pack Pro rips extraction grooves resizing 9x19

[Wezzli]

I have just recently started experimenting with reloading 9x19 with my Lee Six Pack progressive press after reloading about a thousand .38 special rounds but i have already run into some issues that i never had with the .38 special rounds. I have searched forums as thoroughly as i can but with not being from an english speaking country i am not sure of the terminology used to describe this issue so i don't seem to find much information about this specific issue.

I loaded about 10 rounds with minimum charge weight without issue but after that i started running into issues with about 10-20% of the cases. All of the cases are from store bought ammunition (Fiocchi FMJ 115 gn/124 gn, cases stamped G.F.L.) fired once in my pistol (Glock 17 Gen 5), cleaned and polished in a vibratory tumbler and i use RCBS carbide dies.

The issues is that the problematic casings cause some excessive resistance going into and out of the resizing die, enough that the shell holder rips the extraction grooves entirely when backing the case out of the die. I looked closer and i could see that the force applied caused the shell holder to tilt slightly, which concentrates the forces applied to a smaller point instead of spreading the forces along the groove. At this point, i got tired and resized all of the brass in my single stage press and even here i could easily feel that some of the casings were much tougher than others. I have not yet tried using lube, since i'm running carbide dies.

Am i the only one that has run into this issue?

Is this an issue with the Fiocchi casing material being hard/thick walled?
Is this an issue with a large chamber?
Is this a combination of both?

Will this batch of casings produce the same issue when i reload them again?

Thankful for any information.

 

[bullseye308]

Check with a magnet just in case you have steel cases. Either way, I’d try lubing them and see what difference it makes.

 

[Wezzli]

Check with a magnet just in case you have steel cases. Either way, I’d try lubing them and see what difference it makes.

I'm positive there are no steel cases. To be honest, i have never even seen a steel case and all of the cases are bought by me, shot by me and cleaned by me. There is not a single range pickup case.

I will try lubing the few once fired cases i still have left and next time i reload the first batch i will try them dry to see if resizing them once changes anything, then lube if it doesn't. It's going to be at least half a year until that happens though.

Thanks anyway!

 

[GooseGestapo]

Do you have carbide dies? If not, standard dies require lubrication.

Even 9mm Carbide dies need lube.
I use Pledge type generic furniture polish (wax based) to lubricate 9mm cases.
I accomplish this by using a plastic container.
I spray an approximately 2second burst of polish into the empty container. I then put approximately 100 9mm cases in and swirl and tumble before using a Lee case collator to fill the case feed tubes. Reduces the effort to size cases by 90%. Eliminates stuck cases.
This technique eliminates getting lube deep in the cases possibly contaminating the primer or powder. Spraying the cases directly will get lube in the bottom of some cases.

 

[1KPerDay]

If you have access to Hornady one shot lube it’s great for sizing pistol brass in carbide dies. You don’t NEED it but it makes things a lot easier. And IMO you don’t need to remove it after sizing. Just load and shoot.

 

[1KPerDay]

Do you have carbide dies? If not, standard dies require lubrication.

OP says 2 times he’s using carbide dies

 

[GooseGestapo]

OP says 2 times he’s using carbide dies

I also said carbide needs lube, too… with 9mm. It’s a tapered case.

 

[Wezzli]

I'm pretty sure i have a plastic container of Hornady solid type lube that i used for rifle cartridges, which would work for rolling on the lube mat, but some type of spray sure would be easier for doing larger quantities. I'm not sure what type of products similar to "pledge type generic furniture polish" we have around here but i'll check what i can find. If it's made for reloading it's more expensive than it has to be.

 

[Bill M]

If the shell plate is tipping, you may want to tighten the plate to the carrier.
I loaded 1K+ 9mm when I got my 6PP, and had no problems, but I don't have any Fiocchi cases, (I have been using their primers!)
(I've never lubed cases with carbide dies.)

 

[Kaldor]

If you have access to Hornady one shot lube it’s great for sizing pistol brass in carbide dies. You don’t NEED it but it makes things a lot easier. And IMO you don’t need to remove it after sizing. Just load and shoot.

This is the way to go. Easy. Just a light spray, let it flash off entirely, and run em.

 

[Wezzli]

If the shell plate is tipping, you may want to tighten the plate to the carrier.
I loaded 1K+ 9mm when I got my 6PP, and had no problems, but I don't have any Fiocchi cases, (I have been using their primers!)
(I've never lubed cases with carbide dies.)

Good point, although i have had problems with the shell plate coming loose, so i have it well tightened. The mechanism itself has some play and even during normal use the shell plate is not likely to run completely true and flat. When i say it's tilting, i pretty much mean microscopically. It's starting to become clear that it's probably just too much force because of running it dry.

 

[Tilos]

If this brass is all you have or can get, it doesn't matter if it's the cause (it is), just try lubing it.
I predict the lube will solve your problem, and the only thing left for you is to establish is a method for lubing.

Many posts here already have unique lube methods/products, as we all have our own.
Lots of good methods have and will be posted here, find what works for you and move on.
All the boutique (made for) lubes are expensive for what they are, and many have found other common products that work and are way cheaper.
Whatever you decide to use, I recommend using the spray-it-into-a-container (plastic tub or Ziplock bag), add the cases and give it a shake, dump out the cases and let them dry...load.
jmo,
.

 

[Wezzli]

A shooter from my club just told me he lubes like every 5th case and that this is enough to keep it lubed during reloaded

 

[Kaldor]

A shooter from my club just told me he lubes like every 5th case and that this is enough to keep it lubed during reloaded

What kind of lube? Thats the issue. Anything that doesnt flash off 100% dry has the potential to contaminate powder and primers. So anything with oil in it has that potential because it never dries.

Buy a can of OneShot as its the only case lube I know of that does flash off 100% and will absolutely not contaminate anything. Then you can lube every case lightly, everything runs very nice and smooth, and you dont have to remove it. And a single can of it will last forever. I think it took me loading over a 100k rounds of 9 and 45 to use up a can of it.

 

[1KPerDay]

A shooter from my club just told me he lubes like every 5th case and that this is enough to keep it lubed during reloaded

If you don’t have access to One Shot or a similar spray lube, this may work. If you have imperial sizing wax or something similar you can just rub lightly on a case with your fingers (very small amount) it may be enough to keep the die lubed and prevent sticking.

However, spraying a few hundred cases in a bucket or zip-top bag and shaking them around is WAY easier and the cases will be more consistently lubed IMO

 

[Tilos]

Good point, although i have had problems with the shell plate coming loose, so i have it well tightened. The mechanism itself has some play and even during normal use the shell plate is not likely to run completely true and flat. When i say it's tilting, i pretty much mean microscopically. It's starting to become clear that it's probably just too much force because of running it dry.

Another problem we have found is range brass can be stepped and have a thicker wall towards the rim.
If this type of case is loaded hot and shot out of a gun with a loose chamber, that thicker wall can be harder to resize.


Those steps are not as visible in cases dry tumbled.
jmo,
.

 

[9mmepiphany]

I'm not sure what type of products similar to "pledge type generic furniture polish" we have around here but i'll check what i can find. If it's made for reloading it's more expensive than it has to be.

A fairly commonly used lube is a home made mixture of liquid lanolin and 99% alcohol...I get both from Amazon, but it should be easy to find in a variety of places at reasonable prices.

I mix mine at 1 part lanolin to 16 parts alcohol in a plastic spray bottle.
1. Put a couple hundred cases in a gallon plastic bag
2. Give it a couple of sprays.
3. Roll the cases around to coat them
4. Spray again
5. Roll again
6. Pour cases out and spread to allow alcohol flash off
7. Wait at least 10 mins before loading


BTW: Welcome to the Forum

 

[LV Gun]

I have just recently started experimenting with reloading 9x19 with my Lee Six Pack progressive press after reloading about a thousand .38 special rounds but i have already run into some issues that i never had with the .38 special rounds. I have searched forums as thoroughly as i can but with not being from an english speaking country i am not sure of the terminology used to describe this issue so i don't seem to find much information about this specific issue.

I loaded about 10 rounds with minimum charge weight without issue but after that i started running into issues with about 10-20% of the cases. All of the cases are from store bought ammunition (Fiocchi FMJ 115 gn/124 gn, cases stamped G.F.L.) fired once in my pistol (Glock 17 Gen 5), cleaned and polished in a vibratory tumbler and i use RCBS carbide dies.

The issues is that the problematic casings cause some excessive resistance going into and out of the resizing die, enough that the shell holder rips the extraction grooves entirely when backing the case out of the die. I looked closer and i could see that the force applied caused the shell holder to tilt slightly, which concentrates the forces applied to a smaller point instead of spreading the forces along the groove. At this point, i got tired and resized all of the brass in my single stage press and even here i could easily feel that some of the casings were much tougher than others. I have not yet tried using lube, since i'm running carbide dies.

Am i the only one that has run into this issue?

Is this an issue with the Fiocchi casing material being hard/thick walled?
Is this an issue with a large chamber?
Is this a combination of both?

Will this batch of casings produce the same issue when i reload them again?

Thankful for any information.

I have noticed the same thing with 9mm , I do use all range brass but do separate it by head stamp for that reason. I have not had an issue with GFL but with some others so I have went to just giving them a light spray of lube One Shot but have even used furniture polish in a pinch. Part of it could be your chamber be a little larger than normal also. I experienced that when a friend of mine gave me brass he had shot in his Glock versus my XDM there was a difference when it came to sizing I use Lee dies too. Hope this is of value to you and Welcome!!!

 

[Tilos]

I'm pretty sure i have a plastic container of Hornady solid type lube that i used for rifle cartridges, which would work for rolling on the lube mat, but some type of spray sure would be easier for doing larger quantities. I'm not sure what type of products similar to "pledge type generic furniture polish" we have around here but i'll check what i can find. If it's made for reloading it's more expensive than it has to be.

Yes, I have used that paste/cream type lube rubbed into a couple of cleaning patches, as tumble lube in a plastic tub with the cases.
Those patches are best used when only slightly lubed, if I can see the lube on the cases after a tumble, I blot off some lube from those patches.

My lube of choice:


.

 

[9mmepiphany]

I've only been loading .45ACP on my Pro 6000 and haven't installed my 9mm plate yet. But something to be aware of is that Lee uses the same shell plate for 9mm and .40 S&W...so it might be a little loose around smaller cases

 

[Wezzli]

I've only been loading .45ACP on my Pro 6000 and haven't installed my 9mm plate yet. But something to be aware of is that Lee uses the same shell plate for 9mm and .40 S&W...so it might be a little loose around smaller cases

I have noticed that it's a bit loose actually and i even checked to be sure it was the right shell holder plate, so that makes sense

 

[LiveLife]

I've only been loading .45ACP on my Pro 6000 and haven't installed my 9mm plate yet. But something to be aware of is that Lee uses the same shell plate for 9mm and .40 S&W...so it might be a little loose around smaller cases

I am using #19S shellplate on SPP/Pro 6000 kit for 9mm - https://leeprecision.com/Pro-6000-Six-Pack-Shell-Plates

Using Lee tapered carbide sizer, even with squeaky clean wet tumbled brass, no ripping of case rim issue.

Try resizing other headstamp cases and if you do not have same rim ripping issue, you can rule out shellplate. If you experience the same problem with other headstamp cases, it could be something else.

 

[Wezzli]

Yes, I have used that paste/cream type lube rubbed into a couple of cleaning patches, as tumble lube in a plastic tub with the cases.
Those patches are best used when only slightly lubed, if I can feel the lube on the cases after a tumble, I blot off some lube from those patches.

My lube of choice:


.

I thought of doing something like that to spread the solid type lube, but now i don't have to experiment too much. Thanks!

 

[Wezzli]

I am using #19S shellplate on SPP/Pro 6000 kit for 9mm - https://leeprecision.com/Pro-6000-Six-Pack-Shell-Plates

Using Lee tapered carbide sizer, even with squeaky clean wet tumbled brass, no ripping of case rim issue.

Try resizing other headstamp cases and if you do not have same rim ripping issue, you can rule out shellplate. If you experience the same problem with other headstamp cases, it could be something else.

I just checked my shell plate and it is the #19S aswell, so it is the right one. I did however quickly check with the G.F.L cases and some Selleri & Bacon cases and even though it was not a scientific test, i'm pretty sure the G.F.L cases were a less tight fit. This in turn is probably not the end of the world but it sure does not help if the cases require some force.

 

[Wezzli]

I found a almost 20 G.F.L casings left untouched, originating from one of the two 1000 round boxes of ammunition i bought.

I cleaned the resizing die with acetone and ran these cases through the resizing die dirty (only wiped off with a paper towel) mounted in my single stage press and they put up about 1/10th of the resistance that the best of the previous resizing session did. I have no idea why.