LEO's--how do you really feel

[harvester of sorrow]

I've been a LEO for 8 years now, and I think ALL people should carry whatever they want to, whenever they want to, wherever they want to, with no permit whatsoever.....the criminals are going to anyways, and the law-abiding are no threat. Limiting where people can carry only creates free-fire zones where the victims are certain to be defenseless.

 

[Autolycus]

Optical Serenity; QUOTE: "......In fact, More LEOs support CCW/2nd Amendment/Gun hobby than the other way around. There's more hatred for LEOs here than most anywhere else on the net I've seen. And before you say it, two of my good friends work for the BATFE, both are NRA life members, both are members of gun clubs, and both support the 2nd Amendment and the gun hobby 100%...
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I've noticed critisism more then hate.

BATFE, NRA life and support the 2nd Amendment? Somebody's confused and it ain't me. You cannot work for that organization, believe in your job and support the 2nd Amendment (or the Constitution for that matter) at the same time.

"Support the gun hobby"? must be a LEO phrase.

I had a good friend (now deceased) who was an accomplished lifelong shooter. He won the National Metalic Sillouttes at 3 Points Range in Arizona with a Ruger SB he customized and ammo he loaded. When one of his sons told him he was joining the BATF in California he said "son, when you visit you come see me after 11pm and leave before 6am." And he wasn't kidding.

I notice that a lot of LEOs on Pro-Gun websites say that. However on the TV, the Newspapers, and some internet sites I see a disdain for people who want to CCW. An example I like to use is the HR218 (the bill that grants Retired / Off-duty/ on vacation LEOs the right to CCW nationally. There was a lot of promises for support for a non-LEO version allowing national reciprocity. I do not hear any support for that. I believe LEAA supports CCW but the majority are not helping. On a few other sites I hear the old, vote in new lawmakers bit. Well the same can be said of those who are members in LEO and Police Unions. You elect your leadership and we do not. The fact is that we are all on the same side (at least I hope!) but the blame cannot be solely placed on either side. I am hesitant to give the LEOs of this nation any more priveledges in this country then I have. I have told the LEOs on one board this... "Its not a right until everyone is allowed to do it." in reference to me complaining that they can CCW and I cannot. (I am in IL for now.)

So I say I will not vote for Police Protection from criminals and non-LEO citizens until I am granted those same protections from criminals and LEOs.

 

[U.S.SFC_RET]

CCW is a responsibility. Before people scream infringment,RBKA, ect. Take it upon yourselves if you wish to educate the uneducated about CCW. That means you the CCW holder. IMHO it is our responsibilty as a whole to disiminate to the lowest level the duties and responsibilities therof. If it is gun familiarization show him. If it's about holsters show em the proper way to wear that holster or make a recommendation to get a better one if the need calls for it but don't just give him a look of comtempt and walk away.
Gun Rights,Gun Rights,Gun Rights. If you are one those that espouses Gun Rights then do something about it to help your fellow man.
LEOs are right about one thing "the lack of training of typical CCWs" I agree. State Required training? maybe maybe not. But training itself is a definite need.

 

[Northwet]

Local sheriff

The local sheriff there was highlighted in Women & Guns magazine. I think she's been the sheriff for three years now.
Also saw where the Tacoma police force is going to, or allows 1911s in .45 ACP for their officers.
North"wet"

in the great city of tacoma. where the PD has the best reputation in the nation.. in fact, just type in "David Brame" in google and just see how cool we are

 

[Molon Labe]

Yes training is always good, but it should definitely not be a requirement.

+1.

Training should never be a prerequisite for exercising an inalienable right.

CCW is a responsibility.

Yes. But more importantly it is an inalienable right.

 

[SSN Vet]

just what exactly do people in NY thing a right is....

Calling all LEO....I love you! Thankyou for stepping up to the plate!

BUT REMEMBER THIS.....

You are the publics SERVANTS!!!

NOT

The publics MASTERS!!!

This is the key distinction between the Gestapo and the police of a free people.

 

[SSN Vet]

JUST WHAT IS A RIGHT ANYWAY!!!

I'm sorry but I have to say it...
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HAS ANYONE ACTUALLY READ THE CONSTITUTION OF THIS FINE COUNTRY???
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Driver's license.... NOT a constitutional right, test me and charge your fees.

Health Care.... NOT a constitutional right, rack that bill up and send me to collections.

Government social services.... NOT a constitutional right, get your hands out of my wallet.
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Freedom from government regulation of my religious faith.... IS a constitutional right...get out of my head (and that of my kids)

RKBA.... IS a constitutional right.... get out of my closet.

Freedom to call politicians crooks.... IS a constitutional right...get your HUSH RUSH gag off my mouth.
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If the constitution secures a specific right for me....... don't tell me I have to prove I'm responsible to exercise it. YOU PROVE that I'm irresponsible and then take it away via. due process.

I'm appalled at the elitist-socialist CR@P that seemingly thinking people so readily buy into...

Oh poor little untrained, uneducated (a.k.a. un-indoctrinated) peon of an ordinary citizen.... let us "professionals" with government credentials take care of you.

HAVEN'T THE LIBERALS/LETISTS FIGURED IT OUT YET.... THEIR IDEAS HAVE ONLY SUCCEEDED IN ONE THING.... DESTROYING THIS COUNTRY!!

 

[Meplat]

I wonder how many NYC cops can go out with an iron sighted .22, and consistently make head shots on squirrels.

I take it sir, that you are not familiar with the great Southern delicacy of squirrel heads, biscuits and red-eye gravy for breakfast?

 

[Meplat]

I've been a LEO for 8 years now, and I think ALL people should carry whatever they want to, whenever they want to, wherever they want to, with no permit whatsoever.....the criminals are going to anyways, and the law-abiding are no threat. Limiting where people can carry only creates free-fire zones where the victims are certain to be defenseless.

Ya know, it seems to me that I run across this attitude far to seldom these days. Too many people don't understand that their birth certificate IS their carry permit. We ARE the "people", no matter what anyone says, and there is no way to "bear" arms without...well...BEARING arms. Last time I looked, to "bear" meant to "carry" or "transport on one's person". I wonder if those fellers in Concorde had the requisite paperwork on them?

 

[Meplat]

BTW, you can't get a driver's license without at least a written and road test. Why shouldn't there be at least one or the other to get a gun license? I'm not a hunter, but if I'm not mistaken, to get a hunting license you have to take a hunter's safety course, right?

Errr...how about this? Driving is not a Constitutionally recognized and protected RIGHT. Nor is hunting.

Next?

 

[Molon Labe]

RKBA.... IS a constitutional right

Does this mean people did not have the right to keep and bear arms before 1791?

The right to keep and bear arms is a natural right. Is does not depend on the Constitution for its existence.

I've been a LEO for 8 years now, and I think ALL people should carry whatever they want to, whenever they want to, wherever they want to, with no permit whatsoever.

++1. Wish more LEOs understood freedom as well as you, harvester.

 

[Zen21Tao]

I just wanted to come in a give my opinion. Let me begin by saying that I am not a LEO so anything I say about LEO training is coming from second accounts from that I have that are or have been in law enforcement. However, I was in the Army infantry so can speak from first hand knowledge in that case.

With that said, I think that many are putting law enforcement firearms training up on a pedestal where it doesn’t necessarily belong. Like in the military many LEOs receive some degree of basic firearms training but after that they only time you see some of them at the range is for periodic re-qualification periods. However, others take what they learned in their basic firearms training courses to the range at least every week (or more). I have known many LEOs and Non-infantry soldiers that knew very little about firearms other than how to operate the specific weapon they were trained on and, in the case of the LEO, they carry.

It has been my experience, (including what I have heard from my LEO friends), that the LEOs who are opposed to civilian concealed carry usually tend to be the under trained LEOs noted above. They think that because they know so little about firearms and train so infrequently with them they think that the average citizen must necessarily know anjd train even less. They fail to see the great number of gun enthusiasts the learn everything they can about firearms and visit their local range very frequently.

Don’t get me wrong. I do agree that average citizens should have gun safety training and visit a range (al least) semi-regularly if they intend to carry a concealed weapon. But to think that a LEO, just because he is a LEO, knows more about firearms than any given citizen is very naive.

Also, I keep my CCW in my glove compartment under my vehicle papers while driving. Every time I have been pulled over I informed the LEO it was there and that I am a CCW holder. Every time I have been cut a break on tickets. I definitely think most respect a CCW holder knowing he (or she) is a law abiding citizen.

 

[Meplat]

I'm a 15 year veteran of LE and I am a constitutionalist. I think you should be able to carry without a permit and the only place you can't carry should be court rooms(not court houses but rooms) and jails/prisons. Cops don't carry in those 2 places either except for those working and doing the job. I would love to see the current hoopla over Katrina bring communities back to having town/city/community sponsored militias. I don't believe in quailification or tests to carry becasue the government has no business saying who may or may not carry.As the saying goes "what part of shall not be infrimnged don't people get"?

http://www.tradergator.com/auctions/auctiondetails.php?id=110226

Currently I am seriously considering leaving LE due to the changes I see in the caliber of the people, the attitudes of the people , and the coming internal problems in america. The police today have an attitude of I will because I can and I am above you. It is an arrogant , damn near facist attitude and it is growing.Do not get me wrong there are good people out ther but they are becoming fewer and fewer. I know what side I am on and it is of the people and constitution so it may be best for me to leave.

Sir, we need MORE people like yourself in LE. From my point of view, I'd hate to see you leave.