Let's Hear It For the Autos That Require Little To No Mods Out of the Box For You

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Please. This was not meant as a backhanded slap at 1911's or BHP's. If you read my post again its more about the things I really gotta have (or want) than things I really need with certain guns.


Most Kimbers and SA "Loaded" series are made with many of those custom touches that owners have been doing to their stock 1911's in the past (still do) And they are priced accordingly. If I were to buy a Kimber or SA "Loaded" I probably wouldn't touch a thing on them either. Except maybe add Nightsights if it didn't come as part of the package already. And maybe a new "bulletproof" extractor just for piece of mind, which costs very little to do.

But if I buy a 1911 it has to be a Colt. Nothing but a Colt 1911 will do for me. I'd rather take a lightly modded Colt than a Les Baer or even an Ed Brown. So when I buy a Colt 1911, I need (or want) that wider beavertail flush with the frame, better sights (Novaks would be great but expensive), a nice trigger job, and maybe new grips at a minimum. So when a I buy a NRM M1991A1 I have to factor in those eventualities when I buy it. I used to own a Colt Gov't Model Series 80, Gold Cup Nat'l Match, and an M1991A1. They all shot great and they were all rock solid realiable out of the box. So why would I have a grudge against the Colt 1911? Which are even more stock than others.


1911 devotees have such thin skin.:rolleyes: :neener:
 
So much I think depends on what you and I expect from a NIB ...... arguably, almost any piece can be ''sweetened'' ... if you have the time and sometimes the $$$$'s too!

For me, nothing much I have bought actually ''needed'' work .... my P97 and P95 are well adequate ..... my 22/45 is pretty acceptable ...... and my FEG is damn near as sweet as the original HP I used to have. Even my cheapo HP-22 was pretty damn good outa the box .. considering it was so cheap!

Unless I have a serious trigger creep prob for instance then i think that all I want is to familiarize and shoot the weapon ... ''get the feel''!:)
 
This is why I am not a fan of Glocks... there are no custom wood grips for them.
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Huh? With a Glock you can use any make, model or style of wood grips you want. It only takes four self-tapping screws..... :neener:
 
Sig P220. I've had Sig Night sites added to it (modern ones are already dovetailed and mine dates back to '87). The only other modification was an internal laser (back-up sight just in case). Same everything else.
 
I guess I'm too picky because nothing out of the box is perfect.

Lot's of people do mods to Berrtta's Sigs, and glocks. "Settling" for something is another story.
 
I don't feel like I've been "settling" when I leave my SIGs and Glocks the way they are (okay maybe except for nightsights :rolleyes: ) That's one of the many reasons I like SIGs and Glocks. They are "just right" out of the box.
 
Settling on what!? :rolleyes:

We can go back and forth about spending heaps of money on aftermarket add-ons and modifications. Will it really make it a better gun? Do all these aftermarket people really know more than Glock or SIG engineers? Or do people make these changes so the handgun fits an individual better? Or out of vanity?


I'll admit it. I'm an average shooter for someone who's been shooting as long as I have. And I don't think I would really benefit that much from one of those super custom guns. Perhaps my groups would get tighter but my shooting isn't just about target shooting.

As for my SIGs and Glocks I've seen all the aftermarket tack-ons, grip modifications, and so on. None of them appeal to me. And I couldn't dream of changing a thing as far as functionality is concerned. If I want a more specialized gun I'd get it. Guns like my SIG P220ST and Glock 23 are combat/defense guns and reliability is premium over anything else. I'm not gonna mess with it if I don't have to. I get handguns for self defense and they must be reliable. Its because I've refused to "settle" for anything less that I chose SIG and Glock. The less I or anyone else has to tinker with it esp. when they haven't let me down, the better.


Your priorities might be different.
 
No Ian11, "settling" is not about parts. It's being happy with what you get whether it's a mushy or creapy trigger or a long pull or plastic sights and so on.

Alot of people say you NEED to spend more on a 1911 or BHP or other make after you buy it but thats not necessarily true, yet they are happy with a creapy trigger on another model which is a double standard IMO.
 
I think we've covered this before. This thread is not about "need" but about "want" And I've never "wanted" to change a thing about my SIGs and Glocks. And thats exactly why I'm so happy with them when I take them out of the box. And yes, I like their triggers. :what:

And again, I'm not saying one has to or needs to make mods when one acquires a new 1911 or BHP. A 1911 is more of a target/range gun for me and that is why I usually try to get a better trigger on them. But, I still don't shoot 1911's any better than my P220ST or a Glock 21. :banghead:

Please read more carefully. Thanks.
 
Alot of people say you NEED to spend more on a 1911 or BHP or other make after you buy it but thats not necessarily true, yet they are happy with a creapy trigger on another model which is a double standard IMO.
Click to expand...

There's some truth to that. I've noticed some of the same folks complaining about the "heavy" 5-6lb pull on their 1911 have no complaints about the heavy, gritty DA trigger on their SIG.

I think it's the "be like Mike" syndrome. We see all these beautiful, absolutely PERFECT 1911s in the pages of American Handgunner and want our pistol to be the same way. We even expect it with out-of-the-box production guns, and get irritable when we find the slide/frame fit is a little too loose, the trigger just a little too gritty, or the wood grips just flat out aren't exotic enough.

Each time I've bought a new Glock I've done things to it, things I felt it needed. I hate the factory sights, I don't like the plastic guide rod, and I mistrust the big hole at the bottom of the frame. As a result I've always bought steel sights, a titanium guide rod, and a grip plug for each Glock I've purchased before even firing it. That doesn't mean the gun was sub-par out of the box. I just don't like certain features.
 
No Ian, it would be boring to be stuck on 1 or 2 or 10 styles of guns but the 1911 is one of my favorites and my cheapo Norinco 1911 is more reliable (100%) than my G-19 was but my G-26 was a goody so can I trust ALL Glocks because of the hype? I've had a Sig 220 gag on my favorite semi wadcutters while the $300 Norinco gobbles them up,, should I trust ALL Sigs? both had a less the stellar trigger out of the box but one could "settle" for them.

Can you read me now?,,,,,,,,,, can you read me now?


Can you read me now? :p
 
Yes, I understand your points. Even the one about the double standard regarding the triggers of 1911's vs. modern European guns. And I agree with you on that to some degree. But those points get lost when the maturity level of the posts go down.

Everyone's experiences are different. How smooth a trigger feels or how cleanly it breaks has not translated into better shooters for me compared to an out of the box SIG. The trigger on my Glock 21 feels mushy but my groups weren't that different compared to my Colt 1911 with a $100 trigger job from King's. You've had better luck with a $300 Norinco than a $700 SIG and I won't dispute that. (The Norinco's were great values.) You are more than welcome to express that opinion. Because these threads after all is about EVERYONE'S experiences and perceptions.


Thank you for your time.:uhoh:
 
I have a G17 with about 20,000 rounds through it. Zero malfunctions. Ever. I just picked up a G26 to carry now that Minnesota passed "shall-issue" finally. I took the G26 straight from my dealer to the range and shot 400 rounds of white box winchester and 200 rounds of my carry hollowpoint load. Zero malfunctions. If I had to pick a handgun to take to a certain gunfight (yeah, yeah, I would WANT a rifle, shotgun, and my old fire team from when I was in the Corps, but bear with me) straight out of the box, brand new, no cleaning, no nothing, then I would take a Glock 9mm. I have had my weapon malfunction in a fire fight before, and I don't want it to happen again. Well, I don't ever want to be shot at again, but that is kinda irrelevant. That said, I like my 1911's as much as the next guy, but I would never in a million years take an unfired, uncleaned, unlubed, brand new, straight out of the box 1911 to a gunfight if I had the choice of an unfired, uncleaned, unlubed, brand new, straight out of the box G17, G19, or G26. They may be ugly. They may be plastic. The trigger might feel like mush. But they WILL go bang. Maybe even KaBoom, but I said 9mm, not .40 hehe :neener:
 
Greeting's Ian11-

The one handgun that I felt never needed any
additions would be SIG-Sauer's "Classic P-series"
self-loader's; and I've owned these four at one
time or the other: P220, P226, P228, and P229.
They suit my needs straight from the factory box!

Best Wishes,
ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member
 
I will have to say best out of box would be my HK usp compact. This gun has eaten every thing I can throw at it, with no mods other than a polishing of the feed ramp. I only own one 1911 and I had several problems with it out of the box. The make is a Dan Wesson Razorback 10mm. Problems went like this first it wouldn't feed anything the barrel overhung the frame feed ramp, it destroyed ejected brass by way of smashing the case mouth up against the slide, the front and rear sights fell off (minor though) and the extractor would not even come close to holding the case in place.



Upon sending and recieving my gun back from DW I had a factory hornady round KABOOM and it still crumpled brass. So the gun goes back again. This time I had a Briley ramped barrel installed and the ejector was shortened to almost nothing. The gun runs great now but it should have run great to start with, considering how much I paid for it.




By the way this is by no means ment to rip on Dan Wesson, they have the best service I have ever delt with. Bob and Phil were very helpfull and quite promt in repair time. I will eventually buy another DW just need to save up.



Nick:)
 
Out of the box shooters:

CZ 75B .40 S&W
CZ 75BD 9mm
S&W Model 29 .44 Mag (I did install Hogue grips to help with recoil)
Colt Det. Sp. .38 Spl.
Ruger Mk II .22 LR 6 inch bull barrel
T/C Contender .223 14inch bull barrel (Super Sweeeet)
Beretta Model 25 .22 LR
Kimber Custom II .45 ACP
Not so hot OOTB shooters:

CZ PCR 9 mm. Trigger feels rougher than my other CZ's. It may shoot in.
Ruger P89 9mm. Rough trigger but it steadily got better with use.
 
I've done something to every handgun I've bought (and kept) so far. Usually aftermarket grips. The only thing I haven't had to buy anything for has been the CZ-100, and I'm busy polishing this and that to smooth up the trigger.
 
sorry to disagree about BHP

FN BHP with SFS.

Trigger smoothing after 600 rounds. Accurate and carry friendly.

Begining to really love it.
 
Let's look at a stock Colt 01991 I had...

Better trigger than either a Glock or a SigSauer or Beretta. Better accuracy. Equivalent sights. Same reliability. Better ergonomics.

Yet if I decide to make it even better, that is somehow taken as an admission by some that it is inferior to those guns, when it was already on par with them when stock. If I take my trigger from 6 to 4 pounds, it proves the gun is lacking "as-is" compared to your gun with a... 12 pound DA trigger that has a pull 3 times as long? Bizarre!

Why do people customize their 1911? Why do bears crap in the woods? Because they can. :D

I don't leave guns stock. I want what I want, not what somebody else thinks I ought to have. That doesn't mean I spend huge piles of money, it just means that I don't leave things "as is" if there is a reasonable way to make it better. Doesn't matter to me if it is a $350 CZ-75B or a $800 Delta Elite that winds up getting another $800 of goodies. :)
 
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