TargetTerror
Member
megistopoda said:
That is the best quote I've heard in a long time.
Lima Ohio Swat team kills mom, shoots infant.
- Thread starter Blackfork
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That is the best quote I've heard in a long time.
Commander Guineapig
Member
aye. Never seen a slice of bread so thin it didn't have two sides.
Quite frankly I'm disgusted at some of the comments made here. Not very High Road at all. Our LEOs have more training then a lot of mall-ninja armchair commandos. Don't be too quick to judge their actions until you have walked in their shoes.
Remember that whole deal with the NFL star who was at a strip club at 3 AM when someone got shot? (who was that? Pacman?)
Jim Rome put it best: "...nothing good ever goes on at a strip club at 3 AM".
Nothing good EVER goes on in a house with MJ and coke inside.
Nothing good EVER goes on in a Meth house.
We are talking about an ILLEGAL substance. WHY is an illegal substance in your house? WHY would you be DUMB enough to live with a significant other involved in such activity? And WHY would you be utterly incompetent enough to RAISE A CHILD in those circumstances?
You run with the dogs you gonna get the fleas. There are risks to illegal activity. There are risks associated with being involved with it on any level.
If you are willfully near such activity, you alone are responsible for the consequences of your decisions.
Bottom line:if she hadn't been dumb enough to live with a druggie and have kids at the house with him she'd still be alive.
I just get so sick of people trashing the LEOs who put their lives on the line for us every day.
And doing drugs is not your own business any more then drinking and driving are: while under the influence you are a danger to others.
GP
marksman13
Member
cassandrasdaddy, you took the words out of my mouth. Monday morning quaterbacks have an answer for everything though. It doesn't occur to some people that a raid like this requires much planning and many, many options and scenarios are discussed prior to the raid. People just assume that police are adrenaline junkies who enjoy a good "shoot-em-up", and because they are cops they will never be help responsible. Put the shoe on the other foot. If a crackhead broke into your house and you shot him should we question your motives? I thought not.
Police officers have a damn hard and dangerous job and get very little recognition for what they do. They want to go home from work ever night just like the rest of us. Do you people really think that cops go to work in the morning with a desire to shoot people? I would imagine this cop is an emotional wreck right now. Monday morning quarterbacks who have never been in his position don't make it any easier.
Police officers have a damn hard and dangerous job and get very little recognition for what they do. They want to go home from work ever night just like the rest of us. Do you people really think that cops go to work in the morning with a desire to shoot people? I would imagine this cop is an emotional wreck right now. Monday morning quarterbacks who have never been in his position don't make it any easier.
RobTzu
Member
All of those are crimes. That is the same train of thought that gun banners use. Either your body is yours to control or it is the government's. So long as you harm no one else, one should use their body as they see fit. Doing drugs is stupid, but victimless in of itself. Most of the damage to society is caused by the criminalization of them. If drugs were legal, the money fueling gang wars would dry up because Tobacco companies would be rolling off joints as cheap as cigarettes (plus or minus excise taxes.) Same for the rest.
atek3
Member
it's amazing how some people on gun boards understand that some inanimate objects are morally neutral and most of the problems with them come from the action of irresponsible users.
However, in one situation, the solution is to allow possession without licensing and in the other the solution is raids, jail time, and asset forfeiture.
Anyone else recognize the hypocrisy?
atek3
However, in one situation, the solution is to allow possession without licensing and in the other the solution is raids, jail time, and asset forfeiture.
Anyone else recognize the hypocrisy?
atek3
Why not have an undercover make some buys from the person[aggravated trafficking].
Then wait untill the person is leaving the house and arrest him.
Sure they might miss some drugs in the house but that would just be possession or intent to traffic.
I don't think possession or intent charges justify the chance of somebody getting killed. be it the police,suspect,or innocent children.
Think about this...Why are most high speed chases called off when entering a congested areas?
Answer....It is not worth the liability, be it the police,suspect,or Innocent
bystanders.
Then wait untill the person is leaving the house and arrest him.
Sure they might miss some drugs in the house but that would just be possession or intent to traffic.
I don't think possession or intent charges justify the chance of somebody getting killed. be it the police,suspect,or innocent children.
Think about this...Why are most high speed chases called off when entering a congested areas?
Answer....It is not worth the liability, be it the police,suspect,or Innocent
bystanders.
SageMonkey
Member
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- Nov 17, 2007
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- 124
I don't know the details here, but it disturbs me that it has become common to kick in doors with SWAT teams when there is no reason to believe anyone's life is in immediate jeapordy. I am personally aware of a child who will spend the rest of his life in a wheelchair due to one of these raids, he was a few doors down and took a stray .223 to the spine, another victim of the war on drugs. I think thats prabably the problem here, the paradigm is war, not law enforcement.
People robbed by junkies are victims of robbery. The criminal should be locked in a cage for a good long time. There is a victim, but the crime was robbery not drug possesion.
People killed in drive by shootings are victims of murder. The criminal should get life in prison or else be hung for that. There is a victim, but the crime was murder not drug possesion.
Many things tear families apart, it is sad, but how is there a crime victim when the troubled person develops one personal problem rather than another. Hitting the bottle too much tears just as many families apart as drug use, yet it is legal.
I feel the comment was hardly foolish, but rather right to the point. Drug PROBITION is far from victimless, as this unfortunate incident shows. We get even worse violence, worse policing, and more problems than we did with alcohol prohibition.
Victimless crimes only result in more social problems than the laws were designed to correct in the first place. I even feel that the very concept leads to tyranny, consider that most firearms laws also create victimless crimes -unregistered machine gun... ccw without a permit... prk unapproved guns... no victims for any of it).
People robbed by junkies are victims of robbery. The criminal should be locked in a cage for a good long time. There is a victim, but the crime was robbery not drug possesion.
People killed in drive by shootings are victims of murder. The criminal should get life in prison or else be hung for that. There is a victim, but the crime was murder not drug possesion.
Many things tear families apart, it is sad, but how is there a crime victim when the troubled person develops one personal problem rather than another. Hitting the bottle too much tears just as many families apart as drug use, yet it is legal.
I feel the comment was hardly foolish, but rather right to the point. Drug PROBITION is far from victimless, as this unfortunate incident shows. We get even worse violence, worse policing, and more problems than we did with alcohol prohibition.
Victimless crimes only result in more social problems than the laws were designed to correct in the first place. I even feel that the very concept leads to tyranny, consider that most firearms laws also create victimless crimes -unregistered machine gun... ccw without a permit... prk unapproved guns... no victims for any of it).
If drugs were legal there would be no pot farms in our national forests.
These pot farms cause environmental damage, are dangerous to legal users of the forests, and some are allegedly run by Mexican cartels.
Legalize drugs and these problems go away. Then we can focus our resources on the remaining problems caused by drug use. I mean "we" personally and socially, not governmentally.
These pot farms cause environmental damage, are dangerous to legal users of the forests, and some are allegedly run by Mexican cartels.
Legalize drugs and these problems go away. Then we can focus our resources on the remaining problems caused by drug use. I mean "we" personally and socially, not governmentally.
spoken like someone that has never been in such a neighborhood... hell, ive known plenty of people that would have fit the description of the above mentioned criminals... and i would have worn kevlar around them if i could...
some of those houses are the most dangerous places in cities... and frankly, im all for the idea of high speed, loud and decisive raids... i mean what do you think is supposed to happen to someone like that? stand outside and ask them nicely to comeout? all the while they are inside, flushing all of the evidence down the toilet and poisoning the water supply... loading weapons etc... i would bet that the late mother of that child was someone that habitually did crack in front of her child... even more possible, she used sex to pay for her habit...
ive seen it happen dozens of times... 20 something females sleeping with their dealer or their dealers friends to pay for a hit... females of the same age stealing, even stealing appliances from their parents kitchen to pay for crack... people "renting" their vehicles for crack ( the dealer gets to use it for an hour in exchange for $100 in rock)... people robbed, beaten,and terrorized... not to mention the absolute waste that their customer's lives becomes... frankly i love the cities that have the policy that lets them bulldoze known crack houses... now if only they could start hanging the dealers from the light posts on the streets they are dealing on...
that woman had her 6 kids inside a house with a known crack dealer?
imo, the kids are better off without a scumbag like that for a mother... sadly her family will ensure that the kids grow up blaming white american and the police and not their criminal mother... and thus 6 more thugs are raised and steered toward a life of crime
imo, the kids are better off without a scumbag like that for a mother... sadly her family will ensure that the kids grow up blaming white american and the police and not their criminal mother... and thus 6 more thugs are raised and steered toward a life of crime
cassandrasdaddy
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i'm pretty much a law and order guy in my dotage but played arounf with better living through modern chemistry as a young stupid feller. and i say leagalize it all and let darwin sort it out. the overall cost to society will be reduced. our current policy is a mistake . on't misunderstand i think getting high is a waste and for some folks fatal i jusdt thiunk we've proven beyond a doubt that our current policy is a failure
Bartholomew Roberts
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Locked pending review by the Legal mods.
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