Logic for regulations on concealed carry Vs. open carry?

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rajb123

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Apparently, some states like Vermont do not require any special permits for open carry of a handgun in public. However, to obtain a concealed carry license, most jurisdictions require a special concealed carry permit and the permit typically mandates, physical training, class instructions, shooting proficiency tests, etc.

Can someone please explain why open carry would not require anything but a concealed carry permit is so often mandated for this method of self defense?

This is baffling to me.
 
Apparently, some states like Vermont do not require any special permits for open carry of a handgun in public.
Actually, "most" states don't prohibit openly carrying a firearm. VT is one of the three that has no laws against concealed carry.

However, to obtain a concealed carry license, most jurisdictions require a special concealed carry permit
Wait, to get a license you have to have a permit? No, no, some states call their carry credential a license and some call it a permit. All the same basic thing.

Can someone please explain why open carry would not require anything but a concealed carry permit is so often mandated for this method of self defense?
This is because only a few states traditionally had laws preventing openly carrying a firearm at all, and many do not to this day! Many states eventually did pass laws prohibiting sneaking around with a gun hidden under your coat, like a bandit. (;))

So when folks realized that good people might have reason to cover up their carry weapon in polite company, exemptions had to be made for the "good people" to hide their guns when out and about. So the laws were written to let folks who could prove they were the acceptable sort to have a permit to let them sneak their guns around.
 
Yikes! I was afraid of getting that answer.

I suppose that means smart "bad guys," should open carry in Vermont and other states that do not prohibit that form of carry.

Maybe we should roll back regulation about 236 years.
 
It actually stems from a time when carrying concealed was something that the culture viewed as more appropriate for assassins and people with something to hide.
While it was felt that an honest man with nothing to hide open carried.
(Government also preferred those who were going to carry do it openly in an easier to manage and recognize way, and restricting open carry worked contrary to that because more would just carry concealed.)

This was a belief stronger in some places than others, so some states restricted concealed carry while others did not.
But Open Carry was generally left alone, that was going too far to regulate at the state level to most, infringing on a man's freedoms.


So assassin carry was restricted and open carry was the right of most men.
Today that traditional view from over 100 years ago is almost reversed, and concealed carry is seen as normal, with some seeing open carry as creating trouble.
(Both types have their merits, and pros and cons the other does not have. Blanket restrictions can also limit changing the way you carry for different environments.)






As far as believing it impacts bad guys, that is not very accurate. Many of the bad guys people associate with the term commit crime on a regular basis. They get caught some of the time and tend to generate a continual criminal record.
They are generally prohibited persons, and carrying openly is letting everyone see they are breaking the law, even if people don't know it.
So it is still illegal for them to carry openly.
It also announces to everyone they are armed, and bad guys generally want the element of surprise, walking around visibly armed just tells everyone else to be ready to deal with an armed person.
It also means any police that know them and know they are trouble will instantly recognize they are breaking the law if they see them walking around with a pistol.

The big trouble makers in an area tend to become familiar to the police who work that same area regularly. Whether it is from seeing them when they respond to loud and suspicious parties, or dealing with them breaking the law. They will learn who they are if they are living the lifestyle of a local macho trouble maker some young men do.
Carrying a gun openly means the police will respond immediately to them in a hostile manner. They may get shot, they may end up on the ground hard, and they will likely be charged.


Criminals prefer illegal concealed carry to open carry. They have the benefits without as much of the risks.
So restrictions on open carry have little impact on how criminals carry their illegal to own firearms on their person.
 
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Read what the Idaho Supreme court said in 1902: (it's a short read, not like a decision today) http://www.guncite.com/court/state/70p609.html

When I was a kid (quite a few years ago) an old man make this statement to my dad..."those that are up to no good conceal their weapons." Still valid. Not everyone that conceals is up to "no good", but those that ARE up to no good, do, invariably, conceal their weapon.

So why do some states (OR, WA, ID, NV, MT, WY, KY etc) have unlicensed OC? Their state constitutions say a individual may bear arms for their own self protection. The Supreme Court has stated you cannot license a "right" or it becomes a privilage...back to the Idaho supreme court statement.
 
hermannr said:
...So why do some states (OR, WA, ID, NV, MT, WY, KY etc) have unlicensed OC? Their state constitutions say a individual may bear arms for their own self protection...
True. The Vermont situations specifically is a result of a 1903 decision of the Vermont Supreme Court applying the Vermont Constitution.

However, laws prohibiting concealed carry go way back. For example, in the 1840s Georgia and Louisiana enacted laws against the concealed carrying or weapons. Both laws were challenged and upheld by the respective State Supreme Courts.

Laws often reflect the attitudes and values of the times. And 19th Century laws prohibiting conceal carry seem to reflect the belief that concealing one's weapons was unmanly or sneaky.

Today we seem to have some preference for "out-of-sight-out-of-mind." Witness the difficulty legalizing open carry in Florida and Texas. Oklahoma recently legalized open carry, but it seemed to have been a tough fight.

Laws limiting or prohibiting the carrying of guns aren't particularly new. Many towns in the West in the 19th Century prohibited carrying guns within the town limits. From the late 19th Century until it enacted its concealed carry law, Texas prohibited the carrying of guns "except when traveling." For an interesting discussion of early gun control, see Adam Winkler's Gunfight: The Battle Over the Right to Bear Arms in America (W. W. Norton & Company, 2011).
 
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