MD - Laurel Man Shoots Suspected Car Thieves, Kills One

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Mark Tyson

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Laurel Man Shoots Suspected Car Thieves, Kills One

Updated: Wednesday, Sep. 3, 2003 - 6:53 PM EDT.

LAUREL -- A 16-year-old boy is dead and a 23-year-old man has been wounded after they were shot by a man who told police they were breaking into his car.

The shooting happened at about 2:30 Wednesday morning at the Fox Rest apartments in Laurel.

A resident tells police he was awakened by his car alarm and saw two people trying to break into his SUV. Police say the man took a gun outside and confronted the alleged car thieves and shot them both. The 16-year-old died at the scene and the 23-year-old was taken to a hospital, where he's listed in critical condition.

The shooter is in police custody and is being questioned. Police say there's a strong possibility he will be released. Police recovered a weapon in the parking lot that they believe belongs to the two men.

State's Attorney Glenn Ivey says he understands how people feel when their cars are stolen because he's an auto theft victim himself. But he says it's inappropriate to use deadly force.

(Copyright 2003 by The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.)
 
Police say there's a strong possibility he will be released

Hmmm.....that would be a strange turn of events here in MD.....my understanding that actually being able to defend your property is forbidden. Person has to be in the house and an imminent threat to bodily safety.

If he is indeed released, that could signal a real change of heart here from the powers that be.
 
State's Attorney Glenn Ivey says he understands how people feel when their cars are stolen because he's an auto theft victim himself. But he says it's inappropriate to use deadly force.

I've got old windshield wiper blades in the trunk that are worth more than the life of any criminal who breaks into my garage. I had no legal right to defend my property when I was a subject of the People's Republic of California, but I live in Colorado now.
 
"Police recovered a weapon in the parking lot that they believe belongs to the two men."
 
"Police recovered a weapon in the parking lot that they believe belongs to the two men."

This may prove to be his saving grace. He can argue self defense if they had a weapon.
 
Obviously, as is the case every single time, there is a lot to this story that the "news" media is downplaying or completely leaving out.
The headline says, car thieves. The part about them being armed is limited to one brief sentence.
But reading between the lines (which you have to do when dealing with the so called "news" media), I think that statement combined with the statement made by the police, strongly imply that there was a threat of deadly force.
 
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A22944-2003Sep3.html


Md. Man Kills Suspected Car Thief
Prince George's Resident 'Had Enough,' Opened Fire on Group

By Jamie Stockwell and Hamil R. Harris
Washington Post Staff Writers
Thursday, September 4, 2003; Page A01

It happened at 2:30 yesterday morning. Glenn R. Ellis said an alarm alerted him that someone was tampering with his blue 1999 Chevrolet Tahoe, parked outside his Laurel apartment. Like other residents of the Fox Rest complex, Ellis said later, he has been a victim of thieves before. This time, he said, he "had had enough."

Ellis, 37, a tow truck driver, said he grabbed his 9mm Ruger handgun and rushed outside. "Things just went crazy," he recalled. He said he opened fire on four young men who were near his SUV. Police said later that the four were in the process of stealing it. Two were standing next to the Tahoe and the other two were in it when Ellis pulled the trigger.

Ernest Sockwell, 16, was killed. A 23-year-old man, whom police declined to identify, was hospitalized in critical condition. Two other men, who were uninjured, were questioned by police and released while the investigation continues.

Ellis was questioned by Prince George's County homicide detectives for hours yesterday, then was released pending the outcome of the investigation. Late in the afternoon, he stood outside his apartment, in the 13800 block of Briarwood Drive. He stood not far from where the blood had spilled, and he spoke slowly, appearing to fight back tears.

"My biggest regret is for the families of the two kids," said Ellis, wearing pressed tan slacks and a brown dress shirt. Friends and supporters stood with him. "One is dead, and one is fighting for his life. If I could do things over again, I would."

Ellis said he had installed a device in his Tahoe that alerts an alarm company by wireless signal if the vehicle is tampered with. The alarm company then pages Ellis to warn him.

"The pager went off," Ellis said. "It tells me that something was in my truck. I came out, and things just went crazy."

A county police spokesman, Cpl. Joe Merkel, said such devices "can be very useful in helping to notify potential victims that a crime is being committed." He said, however, that victims should call the police. "We would not recommend the victim confront the suspect," Merkel said.

It was unclear yesterday whether Ellis shouted a warning to the four young men. Police said he has a permit for the gun.

"I don't want to say too much," Ellis said after arriving home from police headquarters. "I need to get a lawyer."

Ellis, who works for the D.C. Department of Public Works, said he lives at the complex with his girlfriend and his three children. He did not elaborate on his decision to open fire but voiced regret.

"I feel bad," he said. "I have a 16-year-old. I'm crushed about this."

According to police, two of the suspected thieves fled in the Tahoe after the shots were fired, and another fled on foot and was apprehended later. Sockwell was found on the parking lot pavement. The two who were in the vehicle stopped at an Extra Mart at Fort Meade Road and Ethel Drive in Anne Arundel County, where they called authorities, because one of them had been wounded.

Police said none of the suspected thieves had a weapon. Police said a screwdriver was found on the ground near where the Tahoe had been parked outside Ellis's apartment.

State's Attorney Glenn F. Ivey said the case would be reviewed by his office after detectives complete the investigation. He said that it was unclear whether Ellis acted in self-defense and that it was "premature to talk in those terms."

"We want to make sure the facts are in, and then we will make a legal decision," he said. "We want to be careful not to rush to judgment. We want to make sure we are very deliberate in how we handle it."

In the interview, Ellis did not say whether he believed his life was in danger.

Robert C. Bonsib, a defense lawyer and former prosecutor, said a person is allowed under the law to use a reasonable amount of force to defend his property but "not deadly force."

"If it was strictly a man defending his property, then it may very well be an issue of whether it was proper" to shoot, he said. "Jury instructions for this type of case say that you may not use deadly force to defend your property or to prevent someone from interfering with your property. Was there something that happened that put the shooter in reasonable fear for his life and that it would justify this level of force? [That] is what will have to be answered."

Many residents of the apartment building said yesterday that the shootings were the culmination of months of frustration and anger over a spate of break-ins and auto thefts in the community.

Andrea Harris, 37, a Fox Rest resident, said: "Everybody is alert because of concerns of recent break-ins. Their apartments and cars are being broken into."

But authorities cautioned the residents to call 911 if they see crimes in progress.

"We are all frustrated over the number of cars stolen in the county," Police Chief Melvin C. High said through a spokeswoman yesterday. "We need the help of our citizens to put a stop to this crime, but not at the expense of that citizen putting himself or herself in harm's way. . . . We encourage citizens to call and let us handle the situation if they can, rather than resort to violence on their own."

Prince George's ranks first in the state and in the region for auto thefts, with more than 15,000 vehicles stolen last year, according to department statistics. Slightly more than 10,000 vehicles have been stolen since January, a 17 percent increase over the same period last year.

In comparison, slightly less than 8,000 vehicles were reported stolen in the District in 2001, the most recent figures available, and about 700 were reported in Fairfax County that year.

The high rate in Prince George's has taken on greater significance in the wake of yesterday's shootings, said Ivey, whose office has focused in recent months on educating residents about vehicle anti-theft devices.

"Clearly, we know that auto theft is a major problem," he said. "Many people have been victimized, including me, and I know how frustrating it can be to have your car stolen. But as a community, we need to be careful not to overreact. We need to be careful how we address this problem."



Staff writer Darragh Johnson and staff researcher Bobbye Pratt contributed to this report.

© 2003 The Washington Post Company
 
"We are all frustrated over the number of cars stolen in the county," Police Chief Melvin C. High said through a spokeswoman yesterday. "We need the help of our citizens to put a stop to this crime, but not at the expense of that citizen putting himself or herself in harm's way. . . . We encourage citizens to call and let us handle the situation if they can, rather than resort to violence on their own."

We can't do anything about criminals, but we don't want mere commoners doing anything about them, either. What rot!
 
"Police said he has a permit for the gun."

I wonder what kind of permit they're talking about. If it's actually a CCW I would be very surprised but my guess is the writer didn't know what they were talking about.
 
"Police said none of the suspected thieves had a weapon. Police said a screwdriver was found on the ground near where the Tahoe had been parked outside Ellis's apartment."

The Plot Thickens

I wonder which story we should believe, the first or the second. Or I wonder if they are both true, the weapon in the first story was a screwdriver ?

Or maybe the Butler did it with the candlestick.
 
My only question about the whole story is why they hung horse thieves in the old west, and shooting car thieves is wrong? In both instances the thief was depriving the victim of his means of transport. Why was the crime any more heinous then? It seems to me that a mans car is as vital today as was his horse then. I say that getting shot should be considered an occupational hazard.
 
"I don't want to say too much," Ellis said after arriving home from police headquarters. "I need to get a lawyer."
I don't think he should be saying anything. "I need to get a lawyer."...gross understatement.

Sam.
 
the first place he needs to be is in his attorney's office. The last place he needs to be is in front of a reporter with a camera crew.

In Texas, at night, if someone was trying to steal your vehicle, odds are that you would likely get a call from the DA's office within a day or so to discuss it. If it were a little more sticky than your standard 'shooting thieves' deal, they'd present it to a grand jury so they could no-bill you on an official level.

Had plenty of this happen over the past several years, but not much comes of it for the property owner, from a legal standpoint. Trouble is, they keep breeding stupid thieves who step up for the next nocturnal cycle.

Regards,
Rabbit.
 
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After he talks to the police he wants his attorney. Opps!

In Calif., if the perpetrators did not threaten him and approach, it would be a bad shooting. By NV standards, it would be a good shooting.

Still wainting for the Nevadans to invade and liberate us.
 
He shoulda moved to Texas where this type of shooting is legal.

Note to Self, Mr. Ellis: Don't shoot someone if you are going to feel worse than they do afterward.
 
If it went down like the second story said, and he was just starting to think about getting a lawyer as the media was grilling him in front of his apartment, then I'm afraid he's in deep, deep trouble.

Personally while I have a serious dislike for any type of thief, I'd find it very hard to justify shooting somebody for attempting to steal my car. It is after all, just a car.

Do I think he should be charged / jailed for this, no.. Do I think he used very bad judgement, yes.. Do I think they'll string him up, oh yea.

Leo
 
"Police recovered a weapon in the parking lot that they believe belongs to the two men."

This may prove to be his saving grace. He can argue self defense if they had a weapon.
Not quite, this is Maryland. By MD law the castle doctrine only applies in your home, everywhere else you must retreat. Even if he just happened to stumble upon them during the theft if they had less than a gun the prosecutor will probably argue that he could have (and thus under MD law, should have) run away. That is if he happened upon them. Since he knew they were stealing his car, under MD law the only legal course of action would be to call the police, you certainly aren't allowed to charge out and confront them with a weapon. Since he went out the door with his gun to go after the car thieves (plus the fact that he and the entire complex were previously victimized and fed up) he will probably be charged with first degree murder since it was "clearly" premeditated.
 
" I'd find it very hard to justify shooting somebody for attempting to steal my car. It is after all, just a car."

Not picking you on, but I see thoughts like this expressed often in threads like this. This is only the most superficial part of it. In reality that car represents thousands of hours of your time that it took to pay for it. Time that you could have spent with your family, time you could have spent enjoying your hobbies but instead, it is time you spent to pay for that car; time you will never get back. It also represents money in the same way. It is money you could have spent on a house, or your kids education or whatever now taken from you. It also takes away your piece of mind. You have been violated. You will never have the same degree of trust for your fellow man. If you ever felt sucure, now you don't. Mentally, you will never be the same.
On the surface, it is just property that can be replaced but in reality what it represents can never be replaced.
Then of course we get into the whole impact on society. The people who steal the car or strip the car have it reinforced in their minds that crime does pay. They will almost certainly victimize someone else. Their friends will see them and want to do the same thing. Who knows if these guys were violent or not. I would imagine as the idea that you can commit crimes and suffer no consequnces for it, that the crimes you are willing to commit become more numerous. Allowing someone to steal a car contributes to the break down of our society. Then of course there is the insurance issue. You might break even on the insurance but probably not. The cost to the insurance company will be passed on to the customer. As the guys continue stealing cars the insurance rates will continue to rise. With each rate increase again, it takes your time to earn it, and your money away from something else more productive. It also makes more and more people that simply can no longer afford to own a car because the insurance rates are too high for them to pay.
It isn't just a car, it is a part of your life. If it was a nice car, it was a significant part of your life that you will never get back. They are stealing a part of your life.
 
Police said he has a permit for the gun.

Yeah, *** kind of reporting is that? In Md, you do not have to have a "permit" to own a gun. You do have to fill out a form that gets sent to the Md State Police, who mark it "NOT DISAPPROVED" and you get your handgun.

As far as a CCW (and you PA folks will love this) you have to have:

a) Police reports documenting threats against your life, or

b) Bank receipts showing you carry large amounts of cash, and if the permit is granted you can only carry to and from the bank.

To prove all this you will have to go before a panel of ex-Md State Police who will approve or deny your application.

So I will eat my hat if he has a Maryland CCW.



"We would not recommend the victim confront the suspect," Merkel said.

Of course you wouldn't. Heaven forbid people take responsibility for themselves.

Police Chief Melvin C. High said through a spokeswoman yesterday. "We need the help of our citizens to put a stop to this crime, but not at the expense of that citizen putting himself or herself in harm's way.

What a bunch of bunk! The authorities could care less about a citizen "putting himself in harm's way", its the rights of the criminals they're concerned about. Remember, the parents of these POS vote, and its Prince Georges County and Baltimore City that control politics here in MD.

Gotta stop now before my head explodes!:cuss:
 
"State's Attorney Glenn Ivey says he understands how people feel when their cars are stolen because he's an auto theft victim himself. But he says it's inappropriate to use deadly force."

I had my car stolen on my 36th birthday. Was working nights, came out at 5:00am and found it gone, with just a little pile of broken window glass where it had been parked. At that time in my life it was almost all I owned and was absolutely necessary to get me to work so I could keep myself going. I was very lucky (afterwards) in that it was found and returned later that day, albeit with over $1,000 in damages. And though I had insurance it still cost me a lot out of my own pocket to make up the difference.

I have much more sympathy for Mr. Ellis than for the dead teen. Mr. Ellis sounds as if he was trying to live within the boundaries which honest citizens set and live by in order to help make this a better society. The other one chose to violate these boundaries.

For those of you who think that it is "just property", well you are entitled to your opinion. But in a larger sense it is more than "just property", it is the idea that one man (or men) can just take a part of your life without regards to the pain and problems it can and will cost you if they are successful. And the state has very little if any concern about what you will have to go through to regain that part of your life.
 
We in Maryland do have a right to confront a suspected thief and use reasonable force to prevent the crime. but what is reasonable force? Do we approach somebody without our arms in hope that THEY won't be armed? Unrealistic. Do we approach them armed, and upon determinig that they are unarmed, holster our weapon so we can engage in a hand to hand battle where they have an opportunity to disarm us and use our own weapon against us?

If the facts are straight in this, than let's be happy that there's likely a few less car thieves harrassing us.

I HATE Md politics.
 
But authorities cautioned the residents to call 911 if they see crimes in progress.

Yeah, right ... so then the police saunter by a couple days later to take a report .... yawn.

Unless of course it is a bank robbery. A couple thousand dollars of a corporation's money is worth more than a private citizen's forty thousand dollar vehicle.

Police won't/can't protect, and they want to make sure (in general at least) that we can't protect ourselves. Just whose side are they on, anyway?
 
What is a 16 year old school student from South East, DC doing
25 miles away in Laurel at 2:30 AM on a school night?

getting educated?

Theres a lot of media focus on the man who's truck was stolen
but the criminals are being brushed off as "normal".
 
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