Russ Jackson
member
- Joined
- Dec 17, 2009
- Messages
- 564
Why not just call the Police and ask them if you can legally carry in the place or places that you frequent. Explain that you have a CCW and do not want to leave your handgun on the snowmobile.
Michigan/Snowmoblie
- Thread starter dab102999
- Start date
- Status
Sam1911
Moderator Emeritus
Sometimes that works. Most of the time, however, cops don't know what the law actually says and (sorry to say) tend to say whatever they think it is or believe it should be. And, sometimes they answer more appropriately, telling you that their job isn't to offer legal opinions. They aren't lawyers, and they aren't YOUR lawyer either.
In the end, "Well some cop told me over the phone that..." isn't going to get you out of trouble.
In the end, "Well some cop told me over the phone that..." isn't going to get you out of trouble.
beatledog7
Member
This is a nation of laws, not of men.
Cherry picking which laws to obey and disobey is beyond the concept of lawful firearm ownership, and it gives anti-gun people the ammo they need to argue that gun owners are dangerous.
It doesn't matter that by and large we are not dangerous; admitting in a public forum that we decide on a case-by-case basis whether we will honor firearms-related laws and policies makes us look dangerous.
Cherry picking which laws to obey and disobey is beyond the concept of lawful firearm ownership, and it gives anti-gun people the ammo they need to argue that gun owners are dangerous.
It doesn't matter that by and large we are not dangerous; admitting in a public forum that we decide on a case-by-case basis whether we will honor firearms-related laws and policies makes us look dangerous.
guyfromohio
Member
The law is structured around revenue assumptions. Responsibility should be on the establishment to post signage.
Certaindeaf
member
Just bring your own booze.
Sam1911
Moderator Emeritus
Is there some way in which this informs the conversation? How does BYOB fit in with the MI law? Are you saying if you bring your own bottle you can enter a bar while carrying? A very confusing statement.
USAF_Vet
Member
I go for my CCW class on Sunday. I'll ask the legal guy there.
Although, the law isn't as unclear as a lot seem to make it. I don't think most people really have a difficult time determining whether an establishment is either a bar that serves food, or a restaurant that serves alcohol.
I'd rather be asked to leave by the owner for legally open carrying rather than be arrested for illegally carrying.
'Concealed means concealed' is all well and good, but I don't think the judge is going to buy that as an excuse.
Although, the law isn't as unclear as a lot seem to make it. I don't think most people really have a difficult time determining whether an establishment is either a bar that serves food, or a restaurant that serves alcohol.
I'd rather be asked to leave by the owner for legally open carrying rather than be arrested for illegally carrying.
'Concealed means concealed' is all well and good, but I don't think the judge is going to buy that as an excuse.
Certaindeaf
member
Why would you need to go into a bar if you have your own booze? A very simple statement/concept.
smalls
Member
Sometimes it's the only place to get food. Especially if it's late.
USAF_Vet
Member
It's not about drinking, it's about gettin out of the cold and warming up.
Drinking while armed is a bad idea as it is, and illegal with a CCW. But bringing your own booze is so not the point of this topic.
I don't drink, but it is still against the law for me to carry concealed into a bar.
We r getting a little away from my original intent. Thank all of u for your input but this is not about drinking. In fact since I ride machine capable of extreme speed drinking is not an option for me. Besides the law on carry is like .002 i believe. Which is very little if any alcohol. But I have spoke with the lawyer we had in our class and unfortionitly the law in Michigan on this is pretty vauge. It only States an establishment that serves alcohol in a glass that has a majority of its income from that. Now does that mean on Tuesday when they have a full house of "old people" eating there dollar burger's and not drinking I can carry...but on Friday when every <deleted> is trying to out drink the other I cant..and to this he could give me no answer. And as far as calling ahead it takes a sled head to understand..you go where the snow is. And from day to day. Or even during the day that changes so you really don't know where u will end up. So thanks all of you again but I think either they will stay locked in a box in the truck or home in the safe.
Last edited by a moderator:
snowmobiling
I would check out the website for El Paso Sadlery:
http://www.epsaddlery.com/pc-154-25-1942-tanker-holster-3-to-5-barrels.aspx
and see if the Tanker holster would meet your needs. These are extremely comfortable when riding, flying, driving a tank, etc. They are also very good for retention when you are bouncing up and down. They are also very convenient when it is time to use the bathroom. Then I would get a nice loose black fleece jacket to wear over it zipped up. Then I would put on my big old snowmobiling parka and go about my business. This way you have all your bases covered, convenience, security, keeping weapon warm and dry, and comfortable. You can also pick them up at a surplus store but it is hard to find the originals instead of "knock-offs".
I would check out the website for El Paso Sadlery:
http://www.epsaddlery.com/pc-154-25-1942-tanker-holster-3-to-5-barrels.aspx
and see if the Tanker holster would meet your needs. These are extremely comfortable when riding, flying, driving a tank, etc. They are also very good for retention when you are bouncing up and down. They are also very convenient when it is time to use the bathroom. Then I would get a nice loose black fleece jacket to wear over it zipped up. Then I would put on my big old snowmobiling parka and go about my business. This way you have all your bases covered, convenience, security, keeping weapon warm and dry, and comfortable. You can also pick them up at a surplus store but it is hard to find the originals instead of "knock-offs".
Mr.510
Member
I used to snowmobile a lot and always carried a handgun in a shoulder rig as that's really the only thing that worked with bib pants and a jacket while allowing any kind of reasonable access. A shoulder rig with tie downs to your belt on both sides is a must, at least with our mountainous terrain and rough trails. If you're lake racing or something your needs may vary.
Here in WA we traveled to extremely remote, mountainous locations by sled. Because of our "be prepared" attitude we carried recovery gear and spare parts on our sleds in ammo cans bolted to the chassis under our hoods. We didn't normally lock the cans but did carry a padlock in each so if we had to leave a broken or buried sled in the woods in an emergency there wouldn't be anything "loose" of value for someone to steal. If you need a lock box on your sled I suggest a small ammo can bolted under the hood. If you're going someplace that you need to stow your handgun for legal reasons stop in the woods before you get there and lock up your weapon. If you don't know until you get there, take a quick ride to a location with some privacy, stow your gun, and ride back.
I'm having a hard time wrapping my brain around a state where restaurants/bars aren't required to post that concealed carry is illegal on their premises if that's the case. It's easy here, if you have to be 21 to enter you can't legally carry, open or concealed.
Here in WA we traveled to extremely remote, mountainous locations by sled. Because of our "be prepared" attitude we carried recovery gear and spare parts on our sleds in ammo cans bolted to the chassis under our hoods. We didn't normally lock the cans but did carry a padlock in each so if we had to leave a broken or buried sled in the woods in an emergency there wouldn't be anything "loose" of value for someone to steal. If you need a lock box on your sled I suggest a small ammo can bolted under the hood. If you're going someplace that you need to stow your handgun for legal reasons stop in the woods before you get there and lock up your weapon. If you don't know until you get there, take a quick ride to a location with some privacy, stow your gun, and ride back.
I'm having a hard time wrapping my brain around a state where restaurants/bars aren't required to post that concealed carry is illegal on their premises if that's the case. It's easy here, if you have to be 21 to enter you can't legally carry, open or concealed.
- Status
