Molds and loads

Status
Not open for further replies.
AJC1

AJC1

Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2020
Messages
12,308
Location
St Marys Georgia
Casting is a great time and there are a million new things to figure out and learn.
So when you cast a bullet I am understanding that the bullet should weigh what the mold says if using the proper mixture, normally defaulted to lyman #2. If the bullet requires a gas check that is additional weight being added after the fact, and any coating or lubricant. Do the load manuals account for the added weight? Seems like if they do, how they accommodate this extra/excess should be discussed, and how much tollerance was used.
 
Let's say you have a 38spl mould, a 158gr rn. Say it throws a 162gr bullet with your alloy.

Less than 3% variance.

I ignore the weight variance and work up a load.

I've pulled military ammo and weighed the projectiles and also the powder charges. Even though milspec stuff is usually loaded to the top of the range it isn't unusual to find fairly wide variation, especially in the powder.

Unless the difference is crazy - say a 175gr bullet from a 158gr marched mould - I don't concern myself.
 
Depending on the BHN I want my bullets to run and the alloy mixture I am using, some of my molds cast close to the molds advertised weight and some are a little further off. For example, my .476 Lee mold has an advertised bullet weight of 400grain, my bullets drop at around 383-385 grains. Not a big deal, I weigh a handful of bullets after I cast and use that weight as an average for where to look at my reloading data.
I don’t worry about the extra weight of the gas check or coating I use, it’s insignificant.

The most important part of a mold in my opinion is that it doesn’t cast undersized bullets. It is easy to size a couple of thousands of an inch down to a desired bullet size but not as easy to size up.
 
Last edited:
lightman said:
I'm going to say the difference is not enough to worry about. If you start low and work up it shouldn't be a problem.
Click to expand...
I guess as I free fall down the rabbit hole, the why and how becomes more intresting. Some of the front matter articles in the lyman #4 casting manual are still very technical and not fully understood. It seems as other areas are just a giant mystery and arent covered at all. I guess that's why I'm always on the hunt for new books and pamphlets on the topic.
 
I feel like I should buy a Mold fir shft… any suggestions for .357 and .45acp molds
 
I'll throw this in just to confuse things ;)

When I cast (back in the Dark Ages when the internet was still a DARPA spying operation) I used a pot and ladle. It's how I was taught and always worked really well. My 358311's always dropped at 160gr. using Lyman #2 Alloy. I had a buddy who worked at US Satellites who also cast and reloaded. I lent him my 358311 mold and his cast at 155gr. using the same alloy - I gave him a couple of ingots - but he used a bottom pour electric pot. So, why were my ladled casts heavier? My guess back then was the bottom pour pot was hotter and aerated the alloy as it went into the mold. Could be lots of things, though. That 5gr. made zero difference in how the bullets shot, though.
 
Hooda Thunkit said:
Let's say you have a 38spl mould, a 158gr rn. Say it throws a 162gr bullet with your alloy.

Less than 3% variance.

I ignore the weight variance and work up a load.

I've pulled military ammo and weighed the projectiles and also the powder charges. Even though milspec stuff is usually loaded to the top of the range it isn't unusual to find fairly wide variation, especially in the powder.

Unless the difference is crazy - say a 175gr bullet from a 158gr marched mould - I don't concern myself.
Click to expand...
I think it would help with a good extrapolation process. How I take data from other bullets to make a load for an unlisted bullet seems very solid as sticky extraction is the worst problem I've had. Maybe its kept quiet because they only want more experienced people to use that process.
 
GeoDudeFlorida said:
I'll throw this in just to confuse things ;)

When I cast (back in the Dark Ages when the internet was still a DARPA spying operation) I used a pot and ladle. It's how I was taught and always worked really well. My 358311's always dropped at 160gr. using Lyman #2 Alloy. I had a buddy who worked at US Satellites who also cast and reloaded. I lent him my 358311 mold and his cast at 155gr. using the same alloy - I gave him a couple of ingots - but he used a bottom pour electric pot. So, why were my ladled casts heavier? My guess back then was the bottom pour pot was hotter and aerated the alloy as it went into the mold. Could be lots of things, though. That 5gr. made zero difference in how the bullets shot, though.
Click to expand...
DAPPA is still a thing! fyi

Back in the cowboy days, how did they make lead bullets on the campfire
 
9 out of 10 times my bullets come out heavier than the mold would suggest. I don't worry about it too much as 99% of the time I'm using loads that are not max loads. If loading near max I'll use the chronograph to see what velocity I'm getting along with being more cognizant of any signs of over pressure.
 
Mark_Mark said:
Back in the cowboy days, how did they make lead bullets on the campfire
Click to expand...

Fire, hot coals, pan for melting lead, ladle and mold. I use a fire pit in my back yard and a cast iron Dutch oven for melting down 40 to 50 lbs of wheel weights at a time.

The Lee 358-125 RF is useable for .38 Special, .357 Mag and 9mm. There is a .358-158 RF mold that is popular also for .38 Special and .357.
 
reddog81 said:
Fire, hot coals, pan for melting lead, ladle and mold. I use a fire pit in my back yard and a cast iron Dutch oven for melting down 40 to 50 lbs of wheel weights at a time.

The Lee 358-125 RF is useable for .38 Special, .357 Mag and 9mm. There is a .358-158 RF mold that is popular also for .38 Special and .357.
Click to expand...
That’s what I want to do someday, Camp and fish. Then make bullets on a camp fire and load on a lee loader and see what I can kill for dinner
 
New to you bullet? Cast up a few, use min. starting data for what the bullets are supposed to/ designed to weigh, and do a load work up. Been doing this since about '97 when I started casting for my 44 Magnums. Basic "Reloading 101"; any time there is a change in components or a new cartridge reload, start at min. and do a load work up. In 40+ years I have had no problems using this method...
 
Last edited:
After 47 years of casting bullets, a sized, lubed, gas checked (or not) cast bullet is seldom the weight alleged on the mold or its packaging box. Lube density, lube quantity, tumble lubed, "purity" of bullet alloy, gas porosity, nose imperfections, base imperfections can all cause weight variation.

Ultimately the bullet maybe 5 grains light to 15 grains heavy. I have a 44 caliber mold that had a very large, deep lube groove. After finding out that the bullet required a ridiculous quantity of lube to fill the groove, I carefully drilled out the mold at the groove to make a shallower lube groove. Bullet weight was approximately 20 grains heavier and I made a 1 grain reduction in powder charge. The load was still very accurate, and more comfortable to shoot.
 
reddog81 said:
You have to break a few eggs to make an omelet. You want bullets for under $.02 a piece you have to spend some money on equipment. NOE molds will last a lifetime and then your heirs will be able to use them.
Click to expand...
Some molds are just so usable and utilitarian that they are worth it. Some molds are exploration and might be good or might not work out. To me the two listed molds are worth it because of the volume of that bullet I shoot and the joy and ease those molds provide. Lee molds are good for exploration of things you would like to try, and I'm thankful they afford that cheap option.
 
Engineer1911 said:
After 47 years of casting bullets, a sized, lubed, gas checked (or not) cast bullet is seldom the weight alleged on the mold or its packaging box. Lube density, lube quantity, tumble lubed, "purity" of bullet alloy, gas porosity, nose imperfections, base imperfections can all cause weight variation.

Ultimately the bullet maybe 5 grains light to 15 grains heavy. I have a 44 caliber mold that had a very large, deep lube groove. After finding out that the bullet required a ridiculous quantity of lube to fill the groove, I carefully drilled out the mold at the groove to make a shallower lube groove. Bullet weight was approximately 20 grains heavier and I made a 1 grain reduction in powder charge. The load was still very accurate, and more comfortable to shoot.
Click to expand...
I'm really on the fence about modifying a few molds. If I hadn't gotten rid of my dads mill I would have trimmed a few already. I may try it on the lathe.
 
I have only used Lee molds so I can’t compare to any other brands. That said, I get extremely consistent weights and great bullets with mine. I’m using the 158 swc tl for 357, the 148 dewc tl in 38 spl, a 124 2r rn tl in 9mm, and a 124 tc tl in 9mm. The 38 & 357 I tumble lube and the 9’s get powder coated. None have come out at the listed weight yet with different formulations of lead, but are close enough that unless shooting max loads I don’t worry about it. Lee molds are a great way to get into casting cheaply and decide if it is for you. If it is you may decide to try higher quality molds($$$) or just get more Lee molds. I had 17 Lee molds until prices got stupid and sold a bunch I rarely use after casting up a supply of those bullets. What I have left I won’t get rid of and my most used mold I have 2 of.

There is a digital book “ from ingot to bullet” or similar from the cast boolets site that I’m sure someone will link to that answers most any questions you could have about casting. One thing you will definitely learn is most often close is good enough with lead.
 
AJC1 said:
Some molds are just so usable and utilitarian that they are worth it. Some molds are exploration and might be good or might not work out. To me the two listed molds are worth it because of the volume of that bullet I shoot and the joy and ease those molds provide. Lee molds are good for exploration of things you would like to try, and I'm thankful they afford that cheap option.
Click to expand...

To expand on that thought some... For me, Lee molds are great if they have the exact design you are looking for. I have a couple that get used quite a bit. NOE molds are nice because there is a much better variety of bullets, options for plain base or gas check, and even hollow point options.
 
reddog81 said:
You have to break a few eggs to make an omelet. You want bullets for under $.02 a piece you have to spend some money on equipment. NOE molds will last a lifetime and then your heirs will be able to use them.
Click to expand...
$.02 cent you say??? 4 real?!?!?!
 
a pound of lead should cost about $1 to $1.50. There's 7000 grains in a pound. You'll get 56 124 grain bullets from a pound. If you paid $1 per pound that's $.017 per bullet. If you pay $1.50 per pound and use 158 grain bullets you're at $.034. You'll have to add some cost for lube or PC but it's minimal. The setup for applying lube is $100+.

A big problem at this point is finding the lead. Many sources have dried up as wheels weights have went from lead to zinc or steel. I've still been able to find a couple hundred pounds just about every year or every other year for the last few years.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

1
  • Locked
good bullet mold for subsonic .308 loads?
Replies
8
Views
2K
fecmech
F
AJC1
  • Locked
Are we ready for mold companies to update?
2 3 4
Replies
80
Views
2K
dannyd
dannyd
dagger dog
  • Locked
Bullet casting questions
Replies
13
Views
1K
dagger dog
dagger dog
troy fairweather
  • Locked
cast 308win hunting loads
2
Replies
29
Views
1K
Blue68f100
Blue68f100
Bula
  • Locked
Lee 358-158-RF Mold for .357 mag loads
Replies
3
Views
2K
Bula
Bula
Back
Top