Moving from PA to RI with firearms

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40dash1

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Ive read the laws from the NRA site, however, I dont think i'm seeing the whole picture correctly (lack of sleep? hehe)
My situation is as follows: I am driving a U-haul from PA (my current residence) to RI (moving closer to family). My course is without a doubt going to involve NY, and CT. Assuming I drive uninterrupted (aside from re-fueling) Will I be protected by the FAOPA?

Another question is, when purchasing a handgun in RI, you are obligated to wait 7 days before you can take it home. Will I have to surrender my firearms to my (new) local police department for 7 days when I move there?

Thanks in advance guys and gals!
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It seems that you can pass through NY if you have permission for the police commissioner of the cities you are travelling though (see McKinney's Penal Law § 265.20). CT allows you to pass through (see C.G.S.A. § 29-38d). Read through 18 U.S.C.A. § 922(a) for the federal guidelines. Google these citations and the appropriate statutes should pop up.

RI has no registration procedure for firearms, but if you have pistols then you're going to at least need a blue card in RI. You can go to any number of dealers and ask to take the blue card test, which consists of 50 multiple choice questions about gun safety. Try calling the Department of Environmental Management to see if they will send you the test so that you can take it, return it, and receive your blue card before moving.

What town are you moving to in RI? I'm a Rhode Islander attending school in CT. If you want to avoid the stress just have your FFL ship your firearms to an FFL in RI. Call Heritage Gun and Coin in West Warwick to receive your firearms. They're the best in the state that I've found for customer service (and they don't charge transfer fees - I know, unheard of). Also check out forum.cralri.com for a local gun message board. There are a lot of knowledgeable local folks on that board.

You could also call the Attorney General's office in each state and ask for an explanation of the laws. Ask them to send you a letter explaining the law in case anything goes wrong - in most cases reliance on an official interpretation of the law is a complete defense to a criminal charge.

Also, no suppressors or FA in RI; double check on SBRs, SBSs, and AOWs if this applies to you.

Acknowledge that this is not professional legal advice. Please accept it only as directions to the appropriate law. Always consult an attorney for professional legal advice. But let me know if you have any other questions about RI shooting.
 
My course is without a doubt going to involve NY, and CT. Assuming I drive uninterrupted (aside from re-fueling) Will I be protected by the FAOPA?

The safe passage provisions of FOPA '86 do cover you. Follow the federal rules exactly and don't make any but the briefest, most absolutely necessary stops along the way. FOPA does trump all local and state laws. (Of course, some places like NY and NJ haven't always been completely convinced ... but that's the law, at least.)

As for living in RI, the NRA's site says, "There are no state licensing requirements for the possession of rifles, shotguns, and handguns by adults." So what you own already is good to go.

I don't see any reference to having to have any safety card or purchase permit to possess your guns when you move into the state. (Maybe E-Rock can provide a legal citation if this is so ... the NRA's legal team seems to say no.)

(However, you would have to have a state issued safety card and a purchase permit to BUY A GUN once you're there.)

Further, I can't see any reason to involve a dealer. You aren't transferring possession of your firearms. You own them already.

Pack them up, follow FOPA's rules, and go!
 
Erock and Sam Thanks, both of you..
I dont mean to split hairs here, but your 2 interpretations of the legality of said move kind of butt heads with each other. My wishful thinking is breathing a sigh of relief after Sams post, but my better safe than sorry attitude is worried by E-Rocks. Yikes! And E-rock I have lived in RI before, in both Pawtucket and Providence. Wow @ a no charge ffl. regardless I thank both of you for responding.
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While I really wish we could all just trigger-lock our guns, toss them in the trunk and head wherever we please, there's more to consider. First are the types of guns you'll be transporting. The FOPA argument is great in theory but is hardly practicable in this instance. Do you have pistol magazines that exceed the statutory limits for capacity for NY? Then you can be arrested. Both NY and CT are "ban states" - any AK/AR pattern rifles (or others with a detachable magazine and pistol grip) not spec'ed within the states' statutes can land you in jail. Pulled over with a trunk full of guns and no state permits? I doubt you'll be waived through and told to have a nice day. To many others have ruined this for us so we now have to play by stricter rules.

Brian Aitken is a prime example of federal guidelines failing in state courts. We all think it's wrong that an otherwise law abiding citizen can be arrested and imprisoned for a period of years for possessing guns he legally owns in another state, but those are the various states' rights - federalism still exists.

There are several ways to approach an interstate move, each involving different balances of risks, rights, and expenses. In all likelihood you can store you guns safely, drive carefully, and make it through without incident. There is also a chance that you own firearms or related components that are illegal to possess in a state through which you will be driving, have mechanical difficulty, and have to stay in one of these awful states overnight. I wouldn't ask you to disclose what types of firearms you own on a public message board, but keep that in mind.

If you don't own anything with a pistol grip, you're probably good to go. If you own something with a pistol grip (rifle, handgun, or shotgun) then take a really close look at the state statutes before crossing the border.

Sam does make an excellent point about the blue card in RI. If you're a law abiding citizen with no criminal history then you're clear to possess legal firearms in RI and do not need a blue card. It still doesn't hurt to take a quick and easy exam just to be safe.
 
While I really wish we could all just trigger-lock our guns, toss them in the trunk and head wherever we please, there's more to consider. First are the types of guns you'll be transporting. The FOPA argument is great in theory but is hardly practicable in this instance.
It all comes down to whether or not an officer and/or department you might end up dealing with happens to be following the federal rules or not. Unfortunately, some do not always, and some press the gray zones pretty hard.

(e.g.: If you are forced to stop for the night due to engine trouble, are you still on an interstate journey? Are you still covered by FOPA or has your emergency lodging become a de facto "destination" thus removing your federal protections?)

Otherwise, all the worry about pre-ban/post-ban and illegal features would be of no concern: That's exactly the kind of thing FOPA is supposed to prevent you having to worry about.

The best plan is to gas up and pee before you enter an "unfriendly" state, and then drive the speed limit straight through without stopping. If you end up stopped for some reason, don't give an officer any probable cause to search your vehicle, nor any inkling of a reasonable suspicion that you've committed some crime.

(You may decide to remove the NRA sticker from your car and scour the passenger compartment for gun-related items that could spark some deep fishing attempt. There was a guy in MD who's vehicle was searched because a Maryland State Trooper saw a speedloader in the cup holder. That was upheld as legitimate reasonable suspicion because it indicated that perhaps the guy was transporting a firearm not in accordance with MD law.)

If pressed, get out, lock your doors, and very politely but firmly refuse to consent to any searches. Remember, refusal to answer probing questions or to give your consent for a search are not, themselves, reasonable suspicion or probable cause. If you are outside of a locked car, the officer's "terry frisk" for his safety's sake has to be limited to your person and immediately accessible locations.

If an officer wants to press the issue, yes he can probably find a reason to search your car, but if he has to do so without your consent it puts the burden much more heavily on him that anything he finds that doesn't jibe with his states (illegal) refusal to abide by FOPA was not obtained through an illegal search.

All of this could ruin your day, but the chances of having the kind of trouble that will get you police attention, compounded by the chance of running into an officer who won't accept FOPA protection are probably pretty small.

There are always risks, unfortunately. Follow the law exactly and you place the onus of breaking the law on the entity which doesn't respect your rights.

Brian Aitken is a prime example of federal guidelines failing in state courts.
Aitken was not covered by FOPA -- AT ALL -- because his situation had nothing to do with interstate travel.

It still doesn't hurt to take a quick and easy exam just to be safe.
Be safe about what? Is there some circumstance under which you could be forced to show your safety test card to prove that you can own a gun you already possess? I understand you have to provide that to the seller if you want to purchase a gun. Is there any situation under which you'd have to show it to anyone else, for any other reason?
 
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In regards to the blue card requirement, it takes all of ten minutes and any FFL in the state does it free of charge. There's really no reason not to get it. Technically its only required to purchase a hand gun, but many of the police officers here are completely ignorant of the laws.
 
Technically its only required to purchase a hand gun, but many of the police officers here are completely ignorant of the laws.
I certainly understand that statement, but I'm curious if there is any instance -- out at the range, or ... I don't know...anywhere? -- where a police officer can demand to see your "blue card?"

If it is a requirement to PURCHASE, why would you ever be required to -- and under what legal authority could you be forced to -- show your card with regards to a gun you already possess?
 
The one time I was stopped with a pistol on my motorcycle, the police officer was more than cordial about the affair, but was more concerned to ensure I had the blue card. After showing it to him, he let me go without a ticket even though the maneuver that led to the stop was pretty bone headed. I'm not familiar with the statutes enough to dig up any citations requiring presenting it to a LEO, but for a piece of paper that is free, I have no problem taking the test. I know some people oppose any unnecessary government intrusion into their rights, but DEM doesn't even keep records on blue cards. If you lose it or it becomes damaged, you have to take the test all over again.
 
Be safe about what? Is there some circumstance under which you could be forced to show your safety test card to prove that you can own a gun you already possess? I understand you have to provide that to the seller if you want to purchase a gun. Is there any situation under which you'd have to show it to anyone else, for any other reason?

A blue card serves a couple purposes aside from the direct purchase procedure:

First, it shows police that you are lawfully able to purchase a pistol in RI. If you are lawfully able to purchase a pistol, and have a pistol in your possession on your property, then the odds are greater that you've undergone the background check in order to purchase that pistol. At the very least it shows a good faith effort to comply with state laws. It is not a "permit to own a pistol" (not quoting you, just quoting to illustrate an implied turn of phrase), no such thing is required by law, but is more a formal requirement to come into possession of a pistol, which can be construed as a requirement for ownership by law enforcement with an agenda. It's not uncommon. Especially in some parts of RI.

Second, there is only one public shooting range in RI and it is run by the state. A blue card is required in order to get your "green card" (literally, a green card) that permits you to shoot at the public range. If you show up to the state funded and operated range on state land with a pistol and no blue card, I wouldn't be surprised to see you get pulled over on your way home. Again, "being safe."

Who among us is really done purchasing firearms? OP is likely going to have to get one anyway, why not now and add a measure of security to his move?

I support your fervent insistence that law enforcement ought to understand all nuances of federal and state conflicts of laws, but that's a job for the courts. I think its better to play along with the system and fight the laws in legislature than to fight the system in the streets and try your luck in the courts.
 
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Thanks again for the responses. I think I am gonna go ahead and take my chances per Sam1911s advice, after all I will be in a U-hual with a good amount of furniture/other belongings in the back. I'll just be extra cautious and place my firearms well out of sight. As per the blue card issue E-rock you are 100% correct, I am not finished buying guns. Therefore a blue card is high priority for me upon my arrival.

OT: How is the state range? I know it is outdoors and seasonal. What are some recommended clubs?
 
its not even the federal rules.

let your fingers do the walking, and call your new local SO. ask him.
also, if you must, call each one in between as even in texas, its freaky...
if you keep them out of sight, unloaded, and if you are asked, for whatever reason, i think youll be ok...god forbid you need one on the way...

i forgot my most important reply lol.
say hi to the griffins for me. jk....

oh yea...there is a case now, very similar to what you ask, and, oddly i think its RI...
he was moving, and had rifles, unloaded in trunk. pulled over, now in prison for unlawful transport. (across state lines)
just, be careful. none of should have to worry it...but if you are smart, you will.

-G
 
Thanks for the answers, guys! I can't imagine being "done," either, so unquestionably I'd want the card (intrusion or not). The state range admittance issue is just the kind of thing I was asking about.
 
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