My most unreliable new gun ever: Glock 17 Gen 4

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KingoftheHill- don't get too wound up over Reaper. He runs the local Kool-Aid stand here at THR ( ) and links to those torture tests every time someone mentions a Glock.
It's his way to show that they are the best pistol in the world
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i'm a 1911 guy, but i do own a glock, and have owned xd's, and m&p's. i have to say glock's torture tests are very impressive, and unachievable by many other competitor's products.

i've never seen a 100,000 torture test involving sig, beretta, xd, m&p, etc. where nothing broke and the springs were still functional, have you?

glocks are the most popular pistols in the world because they work, and they're cheap.

reaper provided proof of all this. can you provide proof to the contrary? or even a torture test of a competitor's pistol that's as arduous as the glock one? you're certainly welcome to. simply calling someone a "kool-aid" drinker doesn't prove that person is wrong, my friend.
 
What do the Glockophiles here have to say about James Yeager's Glock 19, which couldn't even do a thousand rounds without choking five times?
 
We had the Glock Rep here yesterday with the Gen4's. They are offering Gen4's for $360 with Night Sights. We are getting one for T&E. I have hands on with M&P's in 9mm, 40 and 45. All have functioned perfectly right out of the box. We, Firearms Instructors, are going to do a head to head of the Gen4 17 and an M&P 9, will let you kno who blazes and who blows.
 
The Microsoft rejoinder by someone was pretty spot on. Microsoft fanboy: "Apples are toys, what's their worldwide market share? Ignore that they sell 91% of all computers retailing for over $1,000.00 because it means nothing as Microsoft runs the low end."
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Who really cares if that's only 10% of the total market though? I'm sure there's a restaurant somewhere that sells 91% of the most hamburgers priced over $100. You can take numbers and make them look good with whatever number tricks you want to use, but that still doesn't make your pile of beans any higher in the end...it just makes people think differently about your small pile of beans. Now if the market changes and $150 hamburgers start taking over a big % of $5 hamburger sales,....now we have a different story entirely. Apple is making most of it's money from other products anyways.

I think the argument that just because something sells well makes it good is completely wrong to begin with. It's all how you look at it though. Does McDonald's have the best cheeseburger? Many would say no. Does McDonald's have the best cheeseburger for under $1? You'd get a bit more yes votes there I bet. Does McDonald's have the best cheeseburger you can get at 11:30pm otuside of a few thousand different highway exits in the middle of nowhere for $1? Even more yes votes I'd bet. Everyone has their own piece of the pie.
 
What do the Glockophiles here have to say about James Yeager's Glock 19, which couldn't even do a thousand rounds without choking five times?
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That test was done with crappy S&B ammo and using 60+/- beat up training magazines donated for use by Tactical Response students. I would say that is incredible reliability under the circumstances.
 
ignore that the M&P has been winning 80% of the the T&Es it has entered.
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Taken from an article on Policeone.com.
But as other companies struggle with incremental gains, GLOCK, Inc., with over 65% of Law Enforcement using their handguns featuring the highly regarded “Safe Action System” continues to set a blistering pace in agency conversions.

More and more agencies are determining that rock solid reliability and world class customer service combined with an economical price tag win out over marketing and pricing schemes dreamed up to move excess inventory.

In the last eighteen months GLOCK, Inc. has converted over eighty (80) agencies in the United States from a single competitor. This success has carried over to the conversions of agencies from other competitors as well.
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I am an M&P owner as well.
 
"its decent ammo but has its faults."

No idea what that means.

Wow that is some bad rust on that M&P. I have never seen one rusted at all, but obviously that one sure did.
 
this is the only S&B ammo i've ever had issues with. it's copper washed steel cased stuff, and it made my glock 19 jam. i noticed the extractor channels were inconsistent. this is s&b's cheapest ammo line.

ZYSBA00915.jpg


all their other ammo has been flawless for me for over 15 years.
 
Full Metal Jacket said:
i'm a 1911 guy, but i do own a glock, and have owned xd's, and m&p's. i have to say glock's torture tests are very impressive, and unachievable by many other competitor's products.

i've never seen a 100,000 torture test involving sig, beretta, xd, m&p, etc. where nothing broke and the springs were still functional, have you?

glocks are the most popular pistols in the world because they work, and they're cheap.

reaper provided proof of all this. can you provide proof to the contrary? or even a torture test of a competitor's pistol that's as arduous as the glock one? you're certainly welcome to. simply calling someone a "kool-aid" drinker doesn't prove that person is wrong, my friend.
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Yeah.. well.... Ive seen PLENTY of Toyota's with over 300,000 miles. Most of them with sub par maintenence. Is Toyota the best car maker out there? Just because you cant stop a Toyota doesnt mean its the best :uhoh:


Full Metal Jacket said:
everyone puts out a crapper. my xd45midsize couldn't go 50 rounds with choking 5 times....

one case doesn't prove anything.
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Ah yes. The ol' "its only one" defense. But Reaper said in this very thread that Gen 4 failures are all over the internet. Hmmm. Some kind of contradiction dont you think?

REAPER4206969 said:
That test was done with crappy S&B ammo and using 60+/- beat up training magazines donated for use by Tactical Response students. I would say that is incredible reliability under the circumstances.
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Oh yeah... the other defense of "its the ammos fault... its the mags fault... its the shooters fault.

REAPER4206969 said:
Doubt it. The XD and SIG rust issues are well known. As for the M&P...

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http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=5&f=16&t=90988

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=5&f=16&t=91265
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And those pic's depict about as big a problem as Glocks Tac light issue that YOU said were way over blown in this very thread.

REAPER4206969 said:
It's decent ammo, but it has its faults.
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Wait a minute. You blamed the Glock failure on ammo and mags. Now you're saying the ammo was decent. You're insinuating that Glocks need premium ammo and good mags in order to function correctly. I though Glock eat everything :confused:

Glock-o-philes: You guys might want to check your Glock cup for leaks because some of your statements arent holding the koolaide very well.
 
Oh yeah... the other defense of "its the ammos fault... its the mags fault... its the shooters fault.
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Even you must admit that only five failures, a few of which were FTFire due to faulty primers, using 60+/- training mags donated by various students is an amazing feat.
And those pic's depict about as big a problem as Glocks Tac light issue that YOU said were way over blown in this very thread.
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Absolutely. My M&P has been fantastic, those pics are just something to note before you go bury your M&P. :neener:
Now you're saying the ammo was decent.
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S&B manufactures different lines of ammo. Some is good; some not so much. See FMJ's post.
You're insinuating that Glocks need premium ammo and good mags in order to function correctly. I though Glock eat everything
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All repeating, magazine fed firearms need in-spec ammo and quality, well maintained magazines to operate properly. In this case the Glock went through 1000rds of questionable ammo using many different mags with only 5 failures. That is very good by any honest mans estimation.
 
danez71 said:
Yeah.. well.... Ive seen PLENTY of Toyota's with over 300,000 miles. Most of them with sub par maintenence. Is Toyota the best car maker out there? Just because you cant stop a Toyota doesnt mean its the best
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say what now?



danez71 said:
Ah yes. The ol' "its only one" defense. But Reaper said in this very thread that Gen 4 failures are all over the internet. Hmmm. Some kind of contradiction dont you think?
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there are gen4 failure reports coming in on every internet forum (which reaper has noted many times on here).....where's the contradiction you're referring to?
 
Why in the world would they be using the same weight spring for 9mm as for .40? Makes no sense.
 
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