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Need Some 9mm Assistance

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Masterartisan

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Jun 3, 2011
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Location
Williamsville, NY
Need Some 9mm Assistance

I’ve decided to start reloading some 9mm bullets. I’ve done a little .45 reloading on my new Hornady Lock-N-Load but I’ve been shooting more 9mm lately. I’ll be shooting at an indoor range where they only allow lead bullets.
I am interested in:
• A reliable source for some consistent 9mm 115 grain RN lead bullets. The closer to Buffalo, NY the better. (Or 125 grain RN if you feel that would be better)
• A tried and true recipe for your favorite powder and amount used.
• How much you flare the case (measurement) to accept the bullet
• How much you crimp the case (measurement) to hold the bullet
• Any other information would be greatly appreciated. I am new to reloading so don’t assume I know anything!
 
Close doesn't count.
http://www.missouribullet.com/results.php?category=5&secondary=8

You flair enough so the case doesn't shave off bullet lead or lube when you seat them.

You crimp till the case mouth flare is straight with the case wall again, or a measurement of .377" with lead bullets.

I can't give you a favorite load, as there are a lot of powders well suited to that bullet.
I'd suggest Bullseye, 700X, Red Dot, W231, or Unique.

Were it me, I'd try 4.5 Unique and see if it cycles your gun or not.
If not, work up to the 5.0 MAX, .0.1 grain at a time until it does.

But hopefully others will jump in here that shoot a lot more lead 9mm then I do!

I'd suggest you buy a copy of the Lyman #49 loading manual if you are going to load lead bullets.
It covers more lead bullet data in every caliber then you could ever want.

rc
 
Unique is a not a powder that plays well with the LNL, at least not mine. 231 or most any ball powder is a better choice. Bullet fit is critical when it comes to shooting lead. Most casters these day are doing a hard cast. With hard cast bullets the fit needs to be right and you need to push them. If you like light loads look for softer bullets with the same good fit.
 
I've started using WSF instead of Unique in my 9mm loads so I don't get the spillage I saw on my Dillon SDB press. I also use the Berry's bullets instead of the pure lead.
 
refered to the flare: Internal diameter of the case that i like to flare is .355( for plated bullet that are .3565) and .353 for jacketed , some people say that you dont have to flare with jacketed bullets but i found that expanding the mouth of the case helps to reduce run-out drasticallly ... i use the Lyman M-die (great tool)

refered to the crimp : exactly as Rcmodel said ...

refered to powder and bullets: I cant say any commercial advice (becuase i dont live in your country) but in my experience Winchester 231 its a great powder fot he 9mm luger for mild-target loads ... its clean(only at mid-top of the chage list) and meters really well (spot on in 99% of the time)... since you are starting to load for this cartridge i recomend you to use plated bullets to avoid some serius porblems with leading ... just my 2 cents

hope this helps ! :)
 
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Unique doesn't tend to play well in progressives. Meters inconsistent in L&L and spills every-frickin-where in the Dillon.

Bullseye is a great powder, all around. I keep a shelf of it because I can use it in both 9mm and 45. I used to use Unique - went through 25 lbs of Unique on pistols (which is a lot of loading), and it's a great powder. Just likes to hop out of casings on progressives too much, which is why I switched to Bullseye.

You should always flare the case a little, but not drastically. If you flare too much you'll end up splitting necks. If you don't catch THAT (may be hard to see on a progressive), and it's a slight split, you will end up with a bullet getting set back when it's chambered.

If you're loading with a progressive *always* take that extra step to check over loaded rounds for split necks. It doesn't take much time, but is worth it from a safety standpoint.

When you're loading single-stage or turret it's easier to pick up on splits.
 
What gun are you using? 9mm's vary dimensionally and we cannot recommend the same thing for a Beretta or S&W or CZ.
 
I’ve decided to start reloading some 9mm bullets. I’ve done a little .45 reloading on my new Hornady Lock-N-Load but I’ve been shooting more 9mm lately. I’ll be shooting at an indoor range where they only allow lead bullets.
I am interested in:
• A reliable source for some consistent 9mm 115 grain RN lead bullets. The closer to Buffalo, NY the better. (Or 125 grain RN if you feel that would be better)
Don't know. I prefer MasterCastBullets.com or Missori Bullets. PS: I find 115gn L-SWC to be a lot more accurate
• A tried and true recipe for your favorite powder and amount used.
Look in your loading manual. Even if I give you a load, you still must start at the starting load and work up. I have found that 3.9-4.0gn Red Dot is very accurate. Unique is almost universally accurate from 4.0-5.5gn. Finally, 5.4gn Herco has been very accurate.
• How much you flare the case (measurement) to accept the bullet
Just enough so you can put the bullet on the case and will stand straight and not rock back and forth. Also, separate the seating from crimping
• How much you crimp the case (measurement) to hold the bullet
This is not something that EVER needs to be measured. You want to remove the flare/belling so the round chambers easily. Next, if you look at the round with a white backdrop, you should see no flare/belling left. If you look at the case mouth, it should be shiny from the taper crimp die. Finally, you should be able to run your finger down the bullet ogive and NOT have it catch on the case mouth. The measurers seem to like to run about 0.002" under SAAMI case mouth dimension. For 9x19, this would be 0.378" or so.
• Any other information would be greatly appreciated. I am new to reloading so don't assume I know anything!
Then, read a couple of manuals. ABCs of Reloading and Lyman #49 would be great places to start.
Also, remember that works for me may not work with your gun. Take any thing from the net with a grain of salt.
 
I’ll be shooting at an indoor range where they only allow lead bullets.
Click to expand...

An indoor range that allows only lead sounds like a health hazard. Especially in NY state where they might tend to close off the ventilators in winter. You might ask about their cleaning process and inspect for a thin dusting of gray on all horizontal surfaces.

Just my 2 cents.
 
Masterartisan said:
A reliable source for some consistent 9mm 115 grain RN lead bullets.
Click to expand...
My reference jacketed load is with 115 gr Winchester FMJ pushed to near max load data of W231/HP-38; but for lead 9mm loads, I prefer the heavier 125 gr bullets. Why? For many newer 9mm pistols, especially for shorter barrel compacts/subcompacts with stiffer recoil spring sets, you'll need to push the lighter 115 gr bullet to near max load data to reliably cycle with the stiffer recoil spring which may add to leading problem. With proper bullet-to-barrel fit (.001" over the groove diameter of the barrel) and 125 gr lead bullet, I can use mid-to-high range load data with reliably cycling of the slide, very good accuracy and no leading in the barrel.

A reliable source? +1 to Missouri Bullet - quality bullets, very fast shipping and awesome customer service (you can also buy their bullets from Powder Valley. Do a search for THR discount to use on MBC website orders).

These are 9mm MBC bullets I am currently using:

attachment.php


A tried and true recipe for your favorite powder and amount used.
Click to expand...
Since pistols have different length barrels/ramp angle, groove diameters, leade length (space bullet jumps from the case neck/chamber to the start of rifling) and rifling type, you need to specify the pistol you are using to get specific load recipes. What works well in my pistols with .355" groove diameter barrels may not work so well in pistols with .356"-.357" groove diameter barrels with different rifling/leade/ramp angle that may require different OAL. I would suggest starting out with W231/HP-38 with mid-to-high range load data for most lead bullets with slight adjustments to reflect different OALs used for bullet nose profile and reliably feeding/chambering.

How much you flare the case (measurement) to accept the bullet
Click to expand...
When you resize a case, case neck will be reduced smaller than the diameter of the bullet. You need to flare the case neck so the inside diameter of case neck is larger than the diameter of the bullet. For me, I use just enough of flare so the bullet can seat/stay flat when placed on the flare and not shave the side of the lead bullet during seating/taper crimping (I use combination Lee seating/taper crimp die). For this amount of flare, I can feel the flare with my finger tips, but very hard to see with my eyes (yes, that slight of flare). Start with minimal amount of flare and incrementally increase until it works for you. I do not measure the amount of flare with the caliper.

How much you crimp the case (measurement) to hold the bullet
Click to expand...
Taper crimp does not "hold" the bullet but neck tension from resizing the case neck does. As many others posted, you just need to press the flare back to the bullet flat. Since case wall thickness is around .010", I add .020" to the diameter of the bullet to determine the taper crimp to use. So for .355" jacketed bullet, I use .375" taper crimp and for .356" lead bullet, I use .376" taper crimp. Below is a comparison picture of different bullet diameter bullets and taper crimps used but shows bulging of case neck to indicate good neck tension.

attachment.php


Any other information would be greatly appreciated. I am new to reloading so don’t assume I know anything!
Click to expand...
+1 to Lyman #49 ($17) as it is a very good reference for lead load data when powder manufacturers' websites don't always show lead load data for a particular bullet you are loading for.

Also, 2004 Alliant load data pdf is a good reference for lead load data.
 
Again, thank you very much for the information. Quite honestly, all of this data is a bit overwhelming. It will take some time to digest it all and slowly work it out. I hope you all don't mind if I keep coming back with more questions.

FYI...I am shooting a new XDM 9mm with a 5.25" barrel. I had Scott at Springer Precision do some trigger work and a few other modifications and really like the way it is shooting. I try to get to the range three to four times per week and shoot around 75 rounds on each visit. I stop shooting when I start to calculate my ammunition costs and don't want that to interfere with my training. So, in my mind, it makes way more sense to reload my own ammo.
 
From my reading, XDM 9mm barrels have a .357/.358" throats, so you will need .357" diameter bullets to prevent leading. Order the softest bullets you can in terms of BHN. I like 231 with lead in the 9mm. 4 grains under a 125gr bullet is just about right, even at super short COAL's.

Use your barrel as a gauge. Make several dummy rounds at different OAL's and see which ones fit the best.
 
Penn Bullets provides great bullets for 9mm. Their 115 cast SWC is very accurate for me and he can provide different sizing for your gun. Check the site: http://www.pennbullets.com/
I like 231 / HP38 for mide range and up loads but lots of powders will work. Check out the Lyman #49 manual for data.
 
More great information, thank you. I'm am embarrassed at how little I know about reloading. Would any of you be interested in taking this conversation aside and mentoring me through this process, I would really appreciate it.
 
I have 2 XDM and your in for a rough time with lead in those tight chambers,tight throats.I found the barrels are great for lead but the bullets have to really be true and centered in the case or they hit the leading edge of the throat.Once you get things working ok,they shoot real good.I like AA#5 ,SR7625,and WSF for lead,with a little HP-38 mixed in.
 
nudder vote for Missouri Bullet Co & a copy of Lyman's 49th Reloading Handbook.

These two should be required to get a reloading press. :D
 
BDS what are you tumbling those lead bullets in to give them the copper tone? Is that some sort of special mix moly?
 
I think thats just the color hue his camera created.I have a camera that makes thing redish/copper for no apparent reason mostly under flouresent lighting.
 
You got it. It's the color of my compact florescent light bulbs inside the goose neck lights over the reloading bench as I take most of my pictures there on white 8x11 copy paper.

Also, you'll often see the reflection of my right hand (kinda copperish in the reflections?) as when I use the super macro mode on the Olympus SP-600UZ digital camera, I need to get real close. In the super macro mode, flash won't work and I get more orangy/copper hue in the background but in the normal macro mode I can use the flash and it adds more bluish hue.

If you are referring to the three copper jacketed and plated bullets in the picture, yup, they definitely show their copper tone. :D
 
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