New Arisaka project!

[tark]

Well, now I don't know WHAT to think! Just measured one of my Hornady (PPU head stamped) 7.7 rounds. .472 at the base. OK, that checks out. Then I measured a Remington factory 180 gr. 30-06 cartridge It went .462 at the base! WHAT!!! Is that normal? Because .010 difference IS a problem. Some Korean surplus ball ammo came in at .466. Is this much variance common?

 

[jim in Anchorage]

Just a off topic note here on cerrosafe- it can stick to your chamber like solder. And yes I oiled it, waited for shrinkage. Had to boil the gun to melt it out.

 

[LoonWulf]

Mt.girl, ive used jb bore paste as well as flitz, on steel wool wraped around a pistol brush thats the correct size for the chamber. Chuck that in a drill and it will get out most rust, fouling, and smooth some fine pitting or machining marks. Makes the chamber shinny too, if that your thing.

Tark, that appears to be standard for all the 06 brass i have, which is all us majors, and some a few lots of military cases. My FIRED brass (two different guns) comes out that size also, so it suggest the chambers are cut to match......that size being .464-466 for my brass. I have one case from a lot of federal thats .470. this is by no means an exhaustive look at all the 06 brass i have, just whats cluttering up my desk atm.

Jim, thanks for the heads up, ive Actually got the cerrosafe sitting here, and ive been looking for an excuse to play with it. Ill keep that in mind and be on the look out for it.


Since the threads been upped heres a short update on where this projects at.
I ended up deciding to rebarrel. My gunsmith had issues getting the original off, so i took the action back and ended up having to make a relief cut in the old barrel to get it off.
Once that was done, I decided i might as well have a barrel made for it, so its sitting here till I find the spare cash to move forward on getting it rebarrled. Ill also have it chambered for something else, im thinking 7x57, or one of the ubiquitous 08 or x57 bassed standards/wildcats.

That decision made I sold the stock, as ill be doing a new one thats longer and will match a longer barrel.
I also set it up with a turned down bolt handle. Lacking the ability to weld one on, I cut, drilled, and tapped the stub (at an angle) for a screw in bolt handle. The threads are 1/4x20 and leave Plenty of meat on the handle root, and they should be strong enough for anything ill likely do to it.

I also bead blasted and and reblued the action.

Ive incluced a picture of how deeply the bolt sits into the barrel breach on these guns, one of the reasons they are expensive to rebarrel

 

[jim in Anchorage]

Note on my above post: think I had a mechanical lock. Rough chamber.

 

[CaptTripps]

I had an Arisaka brought into the shop I was working in one time. The owner bought it used and wanted a chamber cast done. I examined the chamber under a bright light and saw an odd, half circle gouge in the camber wall. After casting it and some measuring with my calibers I realized that the gun had been re-chambered for .30-06. The semi circular gouge was in fact the old shoulder of the original 7.7 chamber! I told the owner what I had found. I recommended that he save the action for a nice sporter. I explained they were strong, good receivers to rebarrel, just that someone had done a hack job on this one.

 

[fpgt72]

Great thread...

I have had a type 99 for quite some time...I am guessing 10+ years. Just got around to shooting it a few weeks ago (medical issues and such kept me away) now after all my surgeries I am pretty recoil sensitive, but I can say one thing that was brought up was the recoil vs a 3006. I would agree that the 3006 in say a 03 is much more crisp vs the t99....same goes for a mas36....the 3006 is more crisp, harsh, whatever you want to say. To me the 03 feels lighter over the other two, not sure if it really is....but I can see the reports saying the rifles switched to the american 3006 would be more harsh

 

[eastbank]

a little off topic, but the 7.7x58 is a good cartige and i hunt with my original 99 that my uncle gave me that he brought back from the south pacific durning ww-2. i bought a 5 gallon bucket of 174gr hornady bullets for cheap that had been saved after a fire at a gun shop and only suffered water damage(stains) and at 2200-2300 fps are accrute. i use once fired 8x57 cases that i neck size the first time i load them into 7.7,s and full lenth size them the second time in 7.7x58 dies. i love reading about your projects as i have done many over the years, but at 73 i have slowed down on the projects a little. eastbank.

 

[LoonWulf]

Thanks Eastbank! I really enjoy the projects and like sharing them. Ive gleaned way more usefull information from folks like you, who comment and share, than I have my own efforts either at research,or actually muddling thru. Also its always fun to see what other have done or would do.

Those are great pictures, ive seen alot of other milsurps with kills but i think thats the first none modified Arisaka ive seen. I hadnt thought to try 8x57 brass in mine (and i think i actually have some) as i bought a bag of PPU when i got my first one, but thats a piece of info ill file away for later just in case. Ive been messing with loads a bit, but with the kids its hard to get out and shoot as much as id like so, ive only used 150grn handloads, tho i do want to try some heavier round bullets to see how they do. Factory ammos actually on the shelf at one store here, I cant force myself to spend the 50 bucks to buy a box tho lol.

CaptTripps, I ended up in the same boat as your customer. I guess the guy who cut the chamber on my guns 06 barrel did a decent enough job to not leave the shoulder in, but my smith suggested the same thing.

Fpgt72, I think your right, the original loadings for the 7.7 were lighter than the 06, not by alot but enough, and i THINK your right about the 1903s being a bit lighter overall. My buddy has a complete(dustcover and all) early T99, and its heavy. I didnt have a original 03 to compare it to but it definitely felt heavy.... Probably why i could never get him to bring it hunting....ill admit i was mildly nervous when i was considering trying to shoot the gun when it was a 6lb 06s lol.
The action itself tho i think is lighter, it surprised me how light it was when i got the barrel off. Most of the weight seems to come from the stock and all the doodads they stuck on it.

 

[BrocLuno]

hello broc luno,,if you here,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

I'm here, just tuning in Cool project. Another Arisaka to actually go hunting with ...

Well, my apologies. I replied to MtnGrl and missed some of the progress ...

For the buyer of the stock: I would strip it and then soak in Clear Penetrating Epoxy Sealer (CPES) which is used in marine and construction all the time to strengthen wood and separating laminates. Most big builders supply stores can get it if they don't already have it.

If you want uniform color before epoxy soak, use alcohol based stains and wipe on and let dry (hour maybe). Then flood with CPES. While still tacky, but setting, apply MinWax Polyurethane varnish. It'll bond like crazy and be one tough finish. You'll need at least five coats. But the first is done tacky and then allowed to dry 24 hours. Lightly roughen with nylon scrub pads and coat again. Somewhere around number 3 it'll be ready to start actual sanding for a real smooth finish.

So, on the new barrel. Why not just buy a replacement 7.7x57 ... I can put you in touch with a fellow in ID who has maybe 150 barrels. He can match your arsenal so it should be minor fit up. Prolly $150, or less... He can supply bottom metal too

303Brit/311 bullets are not hard to come by and you reload

Or, if going new barrel, maybe something a bit heavier?

 

[LoonWulf]

Thanks Broc, ive never heard of cpes, it sounds like something useful tho and worth looking into. Wood finishing is always one of those tasks i either get perfect or just horrible so any new methods are always appreciated.

I think Mt.girl was asking if you had any experience with polishing a chamber with the jb bore bright...which might be different than the jb bore paste i use?

 

[BrocLuno]

I edited my post as it was off topic as things now stand ...

 

[mountian girl]

tyvm,for yo replies,,,,,,,,,mtn. girl & jd

 

[mountian girl]

oooops,,,,,,will a 30-30- round work in a 6.5x50,????????????????,,,u guys r smart,,that why i ask,,,,,,ty

 

[jim in Anchorage]

oooops,,,,,,will a 30-30- round work in a 6.5x50,????????????????,,,u guys r smart,,that why i ask,,,,,,ty

It might go bang.

 

[LoonWulf]

...bolt most likely wont close on it, but if i and it went off it would go BOOM....least i THINK it would case heads are smaller on the .30-30 and the rim is significantly larger than the rim on the 6.5x50.

You can buy 6.5x50 ammo, tho interne might be the best place to find it.

 

[mountian girl]

i need a couple rounds to make sure this is 6.5,,but guess i"ll have to buy a whole box,,,,,no one got none,,all tha big guys don"t got no 6.5x50,,,,any idea"s,,????????????????thanks guy"s

 

[mountian girl]

tyvm,,,,mr. lone wolf,,awwwoooooooolllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll

 

[mountian girl]

mr. jim in alaska,,tyvm,also,,,,mtn. girl,,,,,nc

 

[LoonWulf]

https://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/category/categoryId/164
Grafs has it in stock , you could order a box.

A better option would be to do a chamber cast. We talked about them a bit earlier in this thread.

And to clear up what i ment by BOOM, is that if you got a 30-30 in there and it went off it would likely rupture the case, which would be very unpleasant.

 

[boom boom]

Another way, that is a bit more problematic to do a chamber cast is to heat up sulphur (in a well ventilated area) until liquid and do a chamber cast with that. Until Cerrosafe, that is what the old timey gunsmiths used but I have never personally tried it. Some have also used just plain paraffin wax.

A second thing to note for those trying to use altered Japanese military stocks. They often appear crudely refinished, especially late war ones, with polyurethane. Chances are it is urushi based Japanese lacquer which is made from the tree sap of the Japanese variant of our poison sumac. DON'T TRY to sand it off. Remove with carefully with chemicals if you must before trying to reshape it etc. Wear protective gear, gloves, masks, etc. The problem is if you aerosol it by sanding it, you get exposure in your lungs, and hands, and every other part. Not sure how long the urushiol persists and people vary in sensitivity to it, but be careful.

For those of you looking for a low odor, low toxicity, finish stripper for stocks, consider using Soygel which you can get from Rockler, Woodsmiths, or direct. It takes more time than MEK but you can do it anywhere, it is thick like honey and persists and it does not dry out wood stocks as the main ingredient is soybean oil. It is a bit messy and needs some time to work depending on the strength of the finish--poly v varnish, etc.

 

[boom boom]

Well, I guess I learned something! But the myth I meant to refer to was the one that the 7.7 cartridge itself was larger in dia than the 06'. As in larger enough to be a real problem. It isn't. The real problem was the sloppy chamberings in the rifles. Made worse by the fact the last ditch guns were preferred because the bores had no chrome plating; which chewed up the re-chambering reamers. At least , that's what I heard.

Anyway, thanks for the knowledge Boom Boom. I learned a thing or two and now I know what a conversion looks like. I have never seen one until now.

Thanks for the kind word Tark, I found out about them when I bought a cheaply sporterized Arisaka for restoration at a pawn shop for a song. At that time, getting Arisaka 7.7 ammo was unobtanium unless you got into case forming and I was looking for a ready chamber conversion so that I could shoot the rifle.

 

[mountian girl]

tyvm,lone wolf,,i tried everwhere,,,,graf & sons outt o stock,,ty guys very much,,,this is a cool forum thingy,,,,cool beans,,,mtn. girl,,,

 

[jim in Anchorage]

I think we're getting trolled here.

 

[LoonWulf]

Probably best to make a chamber cast anyway.

 

[boom boom]

MtnGirl or anyone else needing loaded ammo,
Midway has Norma 6.5x50 Arisaka for about $44 and it ships tomorrow.
Buffaloarms has Hornady 6.5x50 in stock for $31 in stock.