New Swiss K31 and reusing GP11 cases

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To be sure by today's prices I have, depending on the particular load, I have between 50 - 52 cents per round, not including the cost of brass.
Hornady 150 FMJ - 25 cents
50 gr. powder - 19 cents
Primer - 8 cents
I do know that you can get GP11 ammo for about that much. However. there's more to it than just getting a rifle and sticking someone else's ammo through.
Reloaders know what I mean. Surplus ammo shooters, maybe not so much.

Besides my hand loads will shoot, and do shoot better than GP11 or eastern block aftermarket ammo. But we are just splitting hairs now as everything I shoot through K-31's shoots extremely well.

Yet another testament to this incredible species of old wooden gun :cool:
 
Trent, I wish I could say I can get whatever type of bullet I want, when I want. That's just not the case anymore apparently. :barf:
Seems, at least where I'm at the bullets that are somewhat available is the Hornady 150 gr. FMJ's. And they aren't as expensive as match grade bullets. Plus as you can see they shoot as well as anything. So for plinking at 100 yrds. the 150 gr. fit the bill pretty well.
If I need to shoot for real at longer ranges I'll break-out the "special recipe" :evil:
 
I currently have close to 8k rounds of GP11, so I won't need to reload for the Swiss Miss any time soon.
 
I wouldn't mind finding a reduced recoil load. The farthest I can shoot is 300 yards, so a lighter load would save my shoulder, and my GP11.
 
Tell me about it. I shot a 50 round High Power event with my Swiss K31 last year and the bruise lasted 2 weeks. Was July .. and hot.. and I wore a t-shirt.

Won't do that again any time soon.

I won the match but cost myself some pain and suffering. Could barely put on my shirt the next day, my shoulder was so sore.

(EDIT: I was using GP11 in the match, too)
 
Forgot the obligatory Swiss porn photo.

Look at those ladies.

d9mpjrxh.jpg

K31 threads require lots of pictures. It's a damn rule. :)

(My RSO shirt is still stained from the wax that'd migrated to the necks, which I wiped off the first 20 rounds; I stopped doing that mid-match and found it didn't matter one way or the other).
 
I have two, with a third on the way.

1922178_10203231516335229_194628696_n.jpg


1969114_10203231530735589_568888457_n.jpg
 
My photo fu isn't great. Perhaps my kids will teach me a thing or two. Actually it's more like remember where files (pics) are and relearning picture posting.
For just about any accuracy sweet spot that one finds, another sweet spot should show at lower loading. At SR.com check out some of Pierre's pet loads like a Rem 165 grn PSPCL and 37 grn of IMR 4064 or US 173 grn pulled bullets and 39 grn of IMR 4064. load down and check targets.Best
 
Is there a typical round count life expectancy for the barrel before they are shot out? 5000 rounds, 10,000 rounds, etc?
 
HammsBeer said:
Is there a typical round count life expectancy for the barrel before they are shot out? 5000 rounds, 10,000 rounds, etc?
Click to expand...

I'd assume it'd be about the same for any midlength cartridge of similar pressure; 30-06, 8x57, etc.

(Another question would be 'has anyone ever shot one out') :)
 
I've heard of Garands with shot out barrels that keyholed, but never heard how many rounds it took to reach that point.

I did read a test article about four AR15s using copper jacketed or imported bi-metal jacket ammo. The barrels using copper jacket ammo still showed good accuracy after 10,000 rounds, but the ones using bi-metal jacket ammo were completely shot out by 10,000; the rifling was almost nonexistant by that point. Makes you wonder what the cupro nickle jackets are doing to the barrels?
 
I may be mistaken but I think the intent of the wax seal where the bullet meets the case is meant to help lubricate the barrel/bullet to help mitigate the wear caused by the bi-metal jacketing on the GP11 ammo.
 
Pics uh?

Ok, here's some K31 porn :evil:
 

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lencac said:
I may be mistaken but I think the intent of the wax seal where the bullet meets the case is meant to help lubricate the barrel/bullet to help mitigate the wear caused by the bi-metal jacketing on the GP11 ammo.
Click to expand...

yes but over time, the was migrates off the bullet and on to the case neck. I have 0 wax on my bullets, it's all formed a rim around the neck.

Moves over time, due to some phenomenon I don't understand. :)
 
HammsBeer said:
I've heard of Garands with shot out barrels that keyholed, but never heard how many rounds it took to reach that point.

I did read a test article about four AR15s using copper jacketed or imported bi-metal jacket ammo. The barrels using copper jacket ammo still showed good accuracy after 10,000 rounds, but the ones using bi-metal jacket ammo were completely shot out by 10,000; the rifling was almost nonexistant by that point. Makes you wonder what the cupro nickle jackets are doing to the barrels?
Click to expand...

I'm sure it can't be pleasant on them.
 
You guys are slaying me. Poke around the swissrifles.com archives or ask your questions at the forum. So yall like them good shootin Swisses with the great bores and great accuracy but think GP11 is ruining the bores. The 30'06 has higher pressure, speed, and-I'd guess-bore flame temperature. The 308/762 has an even higher pressure and-again I'd guess-bore flame temperature. I'd like to believe that you already know which barrel will give longer service life. Wax was always at bullet/case junction, never on the bullet.
 
lencac said:
Canuck, nope, all the measurements are correct. So I sat and thought about it :scrutiny: for a while :confused:

Then it came to me :what:

We are overlooking something because we are assuming. :banghead:

The 178 gr. GP11 bullet has a dia. of only .303 in. :eek:
Which means things like BC, sectional density, length all improve over a 178 gr. bullet in .308 dia. ;)
Not to mention it's interaction with the barrel itself.

Think about it. :uhoh:

BTW;
I have mastered reloading GP11 brass. It's easy, no hydraulic.
Anybody interested in how?
Click to expand...
Well yes
 
Regarding the wax I've read it's either to help lube the throat against erosion, or during firing it's forced down the neck of the brass to aid in extraction, since straight pulls have weak bolt camming power. Nobody seems to really have a definite answer, but apparently it's not important since they did away with the wax in later years.

Shown here is a sampling of my ammo lots:
'79 has a thin wax on the bullet with most of it on the case neck, and uniform case color.
'82 and '83 have no wax but the necks have an odd copper like coating on them
'92 has much deeper crimps and the necks are now annealed.

The bulk of my lots are dated '79 with '92 being currently available from most suppliers. The '82 and '83 were around only for a short time couple years ago.
I don't notice any perceptable difference in accuracy or recoil between lot years.

gp11years.jpg
 
Hamms, nice illustration of the different bullets.
I do believe I remember reading an article some time ago about Camp Perry matches I think in the 20's. At that time the article said they used bi metal jacketing 30.06 ammo like the GP11. It worked very well for accuracy in those National Match 1903's. However, it also said the bores of the rifles fouled quickly so the shooters would use grease to lube the bullet.
It also said the bi-metal jacketing caused faster throat erosion.
But things like helping make the extraction easier, less fouling and less barrel wear on GP11 ammo, I think the wax is a good thing.

Lonnie has a point. M2 30.06 ball ammo produces higher pressures by a little bit and 7.62 NATO increases pressure quite a bit. I think the only "turn-of-the-century" hi-power military cartridge that is more gentle than the 7.5x55 Swiss is the 6.5x55 Swede. And much like the K31 the Swede M96 in that caliber has renowned accuracy.

Here's some more K31 porn
 

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