Newbie Questions

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Blue Brick

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Looking at getting a replica black powder revolver…

1. What are the best brands?
2. Anyone have a lifetime warranty?
3. Are they all still imported expect Ruger?
4. How much is Balls and powder compared to center fire ammunition?


I was just looking of buying one for fun and to have as a truck gun and to take along with me on hunting trips. I was thinking about an 1851 revolver.
 
My opinion would be to get a pietta steel frame 1858 Remington copy from Cabelas
no warrantys
ROA would be a good BPR to purchase

there is really no comparison cap and ball is far cheaper once you get all the necessiary accessories like a powder measure, powder flask, loading stand (optional) capper

read this forum you will learn a lot about C&B revolvers and shooting them
 
While I agree the 1858 NMA model is a solid performer & very good choice for a shooter to get I would have to say that your thoughts of the 1851 Navy model is also a very good revolver.
I would suggest if you can find one in your area is a LGS that has a few models that you can look at & get the feel for, this way you know which one you would like more as your first C&B revolver purchase.

The Ruger Old Army is no longer made but is still available in used & NIB condition but you will pay a premium for them, the up side to it is that the ROA is the finest C&B revolver out there & worth every penny.

Uberti & Pietta are the 2 most likely brands that you will see like in Cabelas.com or Basspro.com & they both are fine reproductions of historical styled revolvers & IMHO you can't go wrong with either one of them, outside of the normal year waranty from the manufacturer there is no waranty on them.

A pound of powder will last at least 200 shots for a .44 caliber revolver. $22.00 a LB.
A tin of 100 caps. $12.00 for 2 tins.
box of 100 .454 ball. $30.00 for 2 boxes.
about $64.00 for 200 shots on average.

.45ACP ammunition is $24.00 for 50 rounds. $96.00 for 200 rounds on average.

IMHO the Black Powder is more fun & educational which increases the value as well.

Hope this helps.
 
Cabelas for sure, their return policy is outstanding [within a reasonable time frame of course], i have purchased 3 piettas from them in the past few months and all 3 are outstanding [1858 steel, 1858 buffalo brass, 1851 brass] i did some cost comparasions for shooting a 44caliber cap and ball to shooting a 45lcolt. I can shoot 50 rounds of 44caliber round balls using hornady .454 balls, 25g 3f goex blackpowder, cornmeal filler, a homemade wad , and a remington #10 cap for about $9.00 or so, I can reload a box of 50 45colt ammo for about the same, but shooting 50 rounds of cap and ball is a lot more fun than shooting 50 rounds of 45collt and the fun factor is a lot longer too.pghrich
 
You may no longer return BP firearms to Cabellas but it is still one of the best place to get one price wise, Dixie Gunworks has about the best selection I believe. A brass framed (what the call) confederate navy is going to be your cheapest route. imo egoot (everybodies got one of those) ;)
 
now if you really get bit and start casting your own bullets and making your own powder the savings can really add up.
I have and do cast my own balls for a couple of my muzzleloaders but I usually buy for my revolvers because I go through them faster.

I have never made my own powder but thanks to the Brush Hippie for his awesome video tutorial's and recipe on how to make a double batch of powder I am going to start making my own
here is the post for Hippies recipe http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=8359672&postcount=36
and here is the link to the whole thread that will link to the youtube channel
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=672851

you can really get gunpowder on the cheap by making your own.
 
Thank you sir! Tis true my home made powder runs me about three bucks a pound and I pay a buck a pound for lead....not sure how many balls a pound makes.
 
Hey Jim thanks for the welcome, this board is the best, i cant stop looking at all the old post, its very intertaining to sat the least, Cabelas took back just a few weeks ago a 1847 uberti colt walker from a friend of mine no questions asked, it was fired and dirty when he returned it in person to the cabelas store in west virginia, so unless they changed their policy very recently, they do still take back returns, pghrich
 
Go inexpensive to start and get your feet wet. There will be plenty of time do come up with the necessary reasons you "need just one more revolver" for the home front.
 
Brand of maker is less important than fit. Some folks are head over heels about Remmingtons, others feel that the only true gun is a Colt's Pattern. If you're near a Cabela's take a trip over and fondle as many as you can. Also, don't ignore pawn shops and local gun shops but be careful about buying used from somebody who hardly knows which end the powder goes in.
 
Traditions cap and ball revolvers are made by Pietta. Quality can vary, from abysmal to very good. In the past five years or so, quality for Pietta has improved from what it once was (generally so-so).
Pietta would be okay as a first gun.

Do NOT buy a brass-framed revolver.
Not only is the brass frame weaker (forget using Hodgdon 777 in it!) and requires lighter charges of black powder and Pyrodex than identical steel-framed revolvers, but brass-framed guns are almost always of lesser quality.
There's a reason why brass-framed revolvers are cheaper than steel-framed ones: less work is put into them, especially when it comes to fitting, polishing and the proper hardening of steel internal parts.

Uberti makes the best cap and ball revolvers in current production. The best Ubertis I've seen are those sold by Cimmaron Arms. Cimmaron hand-picks the best Ubertis, then smooths them up a bit. You pay a little more than a regular Uberti, but the quality is outstanding.

The Ruger Old Army is no longer produced, but an exceptionally well made revolver.

The Colt 2nd generation revolvers of the 1970s and 1980s were also very well made.
Later, the 3rd generation "Signature" series (with Samuel Colt's signature on the backstrap) suffered from unpredictable quality. Some were very high quality, others were terrible. Buying a Signature series 3rd generation is a gamble.

And no, reissue Colts (2nd and 3rd generation) are not entirely made by Uberti. The frames, barrels and a few other major parts were roughly made by Uberti, then shipped to the U.S.
Why?
Because Italian law requires that finished firearms be test-fired at the factory, then be stamped with the Italian proof mark to show they passed.
Knowing that American buyers would not stand for Italian proof marks on their Colt, a compromise was reached between Colt and Uberti: machine a few of the major components in Italy, ship them to Colt or its contractors (Iver Johnson was a Colt contractor) and Colt will ensure that the major parts are finished to Colt standards in the U.S.
Colt also ensured that smaller parts were made in the U.S. The 2nd and 3rd generation guns were finished and assembled in the U.S. They were NOT shipped as whole guns, as some claim, because of Italian laws.

Another no: Uberti did not purchase the old machinery to make Colt cap and ball revolvers. That machinery was long gone by the early 1970s, when the 1st generation revolvers appeared.

If I were you, as a first gun, I'd buy:

Pietta-made copy of the Remington 1858 Army in .44 caliber.
.454 lead balls
Black powder of FFFG grade, if you can get it, or Hodgdon Pyrodex P.
Remington Caps
Ox-Yoke Wonder Wads of .44/.45 caliber. Then soak the wads in Ol' Zip Patch Grease sold by Dixie Gun Works, or a 50/50 mix of Crisco and beeswax, melted together at low heat in a small, cheap saucepan from the thrift store.

If .380" diameter lead balls were more readily available to beginners, I'd suggest a .36 caliber revolver to save powder. But they're not, so I'd go with .44 caliber (Hornady and Speer both make .454 balls).

Search the net for my name, "Gatofeo" and "How to properly use a cap and ball revolver." Been posting that long article for years. I think it's also here, in the High Road.

But before you buy a cap and ball revolver, ask yourself if you're willing to dedicate the time to clean it, and keep it clean. If you're the type to neglect cleaning a modern gun, then black powder guns are not for you. Black powder, Pyrodex P, 777, and all the other black powder substitutes promote rust -- and quite quickly, especially in humid environments.
 
Hello, i disagree about brass guns being made inferior, albeit my experience is somewhat limited [on and off about 35years using and owning blackpowder firearms] i have a navy arms 1851 brass 44cal.with a round barrel from the 1970's that is just as tight as the day it was made, i only shoot about 16g 3f black with a .451 ball, i recently bought a pietta 1858 buffalo brass that is idenical on the inside compared to my pietta 1858 steel, i also recently bought a new pietta 1851 44cal that has the best factory trigger ever, so if a person uses some common sense about loading and cleaning, a brass gun is fine and will last many years, besides i really like shiney guns, pghrich
 
Ya I disagree with that comment as well all the internal parts are identical to the other internal parts that use steel frames the only diffrence is the brass frame
however I do agree that brass frames tend to wear faster because brass is softer metal,
however brass will last just as long if it is taken good care of and lighter charges are used i think the only brassers that are being stretched are the oned that are not very well kept.

I will admit however I would rather have a steel framed 1858 due to the fact it is a more durable metal than brass.
but if I run across a good used brasser that can be bought for a ridiculously low price I will buy it with out any hesitation what so ever.
 
They are solid Brick.
Well, not a solid brick, but made of solid brass Brick.
Well not really a brass brick.........oh never mind
Sorry, couldn't resist :D
Yes, the ',44's', actualy shoot a .45 or .451 ball.
Mmm...why do they call 'em ".44's" then ?
 
Because the bore of a ".44" actually measures (in general, but not always) .440" land to land. A .44 uses a .451 to .457 ball because the groove to groove diameter is (in general, but not always) .450, and in a perfect world the chamber diameter needs to be .001 to .002 larger so the ball will take up the rifling. Since a cap and ball revolver needs to have the ball swage into the chamber to prevent chain firing, the ball needs to be even larger than the chamber diameter. So by now, you've worked up to a .45 cal ball.
 
One thing to consider about brass frames that is rarely mentioned is that they are a pain to keep in new-like appearance. A steel gun needs only to be cleaned and oiled a brass framed gun needs abrasives to keep the brass looking good and wood and bluing don't like abrasives.
 
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