Non-flaring Dillon powder funnel for loading 9mm

[Alex G]

Hello all,
My newly purchased Dillon XL-750 arrived today, and I’m excited to get loading on it! That being said, the one thing I do not like is how the Dillon powder measure funnels for pistol are only the expanding type.

When I still had my LNL AP, I’d flare with a Lyman M-die in station 1, and charge powder with a regular rifle-style insert on my LNL case actuated powder measure in station 2.

Is there some way to accomplish the same thing with the Dillon and not have to use an expanding funnel? (Yes yes, just not set it down far enough to expand, I know. I’d rather not have it entering the case to begin with, or have to rely on precise case uniformity to fully actuate the powder measure)

thanks in advance!

 

[jmorris]

…the one thing I do not like is how the Dillon powder measure funnels for pistol are only the expanding type.

…I’d flare with a Lyman M-die…

Is there some way to accomplish the same thing with the Dillon and not have to use an expanding funnel? (Yes yes, just not set it down far enough to expand, I know. I’d rather not have it entering the case to begin with, or have to rely on precise case uniformity to fully actuate the powder measure)

View attachment 1012187 View attachment 1012188

Expanding and flare/belling the mouth are two different things.

It’s common for bottle neck rifle dies to have an expander on the decapping stem because the expander will be inside the larger portion of the case while the neck is being sized. If one tried to do both at the same time, expand/size, everything would lock up. This is why straight walled pistol expands in a different step.



It’s also not uncommon for people to load jacketed rifle bullets without any flare/bell on the case mouth but less so with pistol.

If you want to bell/flare the case mouth while charging but not expand, just get a powder die for a 1050 (they expand with the back up rod of the swage station) far left. It is universal for many pistol calibers as it doesn’t expand.

If you don’t want to expand or bell/flare you would need a powder die made like the rifle ones (inverted funnel) but longer in length so the short pistol case fully activated the measure.

 

[Alex G]

If you don’t want to expand or bell/flare you would need a powder die made like the rifle ones (inverted funnel) but longer in length so the short pistol case fully activated the measure.

That’s exactly what I’m looking for.

 

[cfullgraf]

I made drop tubes for my L-N-L powder measure that the case mouth rests on a step to activate the powder measure.

The part that enters the case mouth is cylindrical and does no expanding or flaring of the case mouth.

 

[koz4guns]

If you are wanting an “M” Type bell/flare there are a couple of places that sell replacement inserts for the Dillon that will do that with the powder measure.

https://uniquetek.com/product/T1736

https://www.photoescapeinc.com/products/9htc-ptu.html

 

[9mmepiphany]

If you are wanting an “M” Type bell/flare there are a couple of places that sell replacement inserts for the Dillon that will do that with the powder measure.

DAA also makes a very nice one
https://www.doublealpha.biz/us/mr-bulletfeeder-powder-funnel

Have one for the Dillon 750 on my bench and it does a great job of creating a cup to hold the bullet in the case mouth securely as it travels between stations

 

[lordpaxman]

Welcome to THR!

I’d rather not have it entering the case to begin with, or have to rely on precise case uniformity to fully actuate the powder measure)

What caliber are you reloading? And, if I’m reading this correctly, on your LNL your rotary powder measure wouldn’t rotate the same degrees on all cases when using PTX? Hornady sells a powder measure stop that somewhat solves that problem by overdriving the rotation and using the stop to set a max limit. DAA also sells the PTX M style for the LNL measure.
When I went blue, I bought the DAA PTX M style for Dillon and it works well. It will fully actuate the slider bar in the powder measure with varied case OAL (within a reasonable range). I run mixed 9mm brass and haven’t seen a “short throw”. With the Dillon it’s also a solid stop so you’ll get the same flare for each case the same length - basically it’d be the same as setting up a dedicated M-style die station.
Setting this up for both type reloaders is the biggest PIA, but I give a slight nod to Dillon since you loosen two set screws and can rotate the die body without having the powder measure spin. Hope this helps, let us know what you decide? Good luck.

 

[Alex G]

If you are wanting an “M” Type bell/flare there are a couple of places that sell replacement inserts for the Dillon that will do that with the powder measure.

https://uniquetek.com/product/T1736

https://www.photoescapeinc.com/products/9htc-ptu.html

DAA also makes a very nice one

I appreciate all the input, and I know other companies make them, but you guys aren’t understanding what I’m looking for.
I want a powder measure funnel for pistol that looks and works like a rifle powder measure funnel. No belling, no flaring, no entering the case with anything, just charging powder. My brass is fully prepped entering the press, and I run an M-Die to expand and flare in station one.

 

[MifflinKid]

Also

https://www.lousgunwork.com/M-Neck-Expander-Powder-Dies.html

 

[garandsrus]

Alex, check your messages.

 

[cfullgraf]

The drop tubes, particularly the reverse funnel style used for rifle cases do not require alot of precision to machine. The outside diameter needs some precision but fortunately that is easy to control.

If you have a friend with a lathe, he can make one fairly quickly. A machine shop probably woukd do one in less than 2 hours.

I’d buy or borrow a Dillon rifle drop tube for dimensions and figure out how much longer it needs to be for your hand gun cartridges. You probably only need one custom drop tube. (Note, my drop tubes for the L-N-L are different lengths because I was trying to eliminate the need to adjust the powder measure. It did not work as planned and adjusting the measure is easy. )

My drop tubes are made from bronze and lubricated with a dry lube like graphite or teflon.

 

[Soonerpesek]

Cut off the expanding and belling part of the Dillon funnel, chamfer the inside recess, and,
Presto.....you now have a "rifle" powder drop actuator.....

 

[9mmepiphany]

I want a powder measure funnel for pistol that looks and works like a rifle powder measure funnel. No belling, no flaring, no entering the case with anything, just charging powder. My brass is fully prepped entering the press, and I run an M-Die to expand and flare in station one.

The obvious question would seem to be, why not use your Hornady powder measure, since it did what you wanted it to, on you 750?


I am using the Mark 7 powder measure ( product improved Hornady) on the 750 on my bench

 

[koz4guns]

I appreciate all the input, and I know other companies make them, but you guys aren’t understanding what I’m looking for.
I want a powder measure funnel for pistol that looks and works like a rifle powder measure funnel. No belling, no flaring, no entering the case with anything, just charging powder. My brass is fully prepped entering the press, and I run an M-Die to expand and flare in station one.

Why do you expand and flare in station 1?

 

[lordpaxman]

I appreciate all the input, and I know other companies make them, but you guys aren’t understanding what I’m looking for.

Ah, sorry, you do the progressive 2 step. First round is to process brass to the point of powder, second round is finish up. I don’t quite understand that process yet, perhaps in the future I will. Let us know if you find or make your non-PTX?

 

[jmorris]

The drop tubes, particularly the reverse funnel style used for rifle cases do not require alot of precision to machine.

Even less complicated would be a piece of tubing to sit on top of the shorter rifle powder die that is the correct length to have the powder measure complete the stroke. It’s necessary length would obviously depend on the caliber, that remains unknown.

 

[rfwobbly]

...but you guys aren’t understanding what I’m looking for. I want a powder measure funnel for pistol that looks and works like a rifle powder measure funnel. No belling, no flaring, no entering the case with anything, just charging powder. My brass is fully prepped entering the press, and I run an M-Die to expand and flare in station one.

1. Maybe we don't understand what you mean by "fully prepped". If the brass has already been through the press, has been Sized, Primed and Expanded, then why is it passing though a second time ?

2. If the brass has only been cleaned and is making a single pass through the press, being Sized and Primed, then it also needs a case Expansion. The Dillon pistol Powder Funnel does 2 separate jobs: Expansion and Belling. If you don't wish to include Belling, then you simply raise the Powder Measure. But your pistol cases will still require case Expansion to get the correct bullet fit.

3. If you were to find a rifle-type of Powder Funnel, then you'd be missing out on the required Expansion step (which on a rifle case is done in the sizing operation by the stem of the Sizing Die).

So, maybe it's YOU who don't understand ??

All the best.

 

[Alex G]

Cut off the expanding and belling part of the Dillon funnel, chamfer the inside recess, and,
Presto.....you now have a "rifle" powder drop actuator.....

Yes, except then the length isn’t correct and the steel is hard to machine.

The obvious question would seem to be, why not use your Hornady powder measure, since it did what you wanted it to, on you 750?

If I had it still, i would. The gentleman who bought my LNL didn’t have a powder measure so I sold him that one.

Why do you expand and flare in station 1?

Because I prep my brass in a separate step so that only clean brass is going into the machine.

I don’t quite understand that process yet, perhaps in the future I will.

Just a preference, but I like clean brass and hood looking rounds. This also allows me to size and decap in separate steps as well.

 

[Alex G]

Even less complicated would be a piece of tubing to sit on top of the shorter rifle powder die that is the correct length to have the powder measure complete the stroke.

Thats actually a really good idea, I’ll have to look into that!

fully prepped

Fully prepped to me means Deprimed, sized, swaged (if needed) and SS Tumbled.

If the brass has only been cleaned and is making a single pass through the press, being Sized and Primed, then it also needs a case Expansion.

See note about station 1. The Lyman M-Die is the dedicated expander in station 1.

If you were to find a rifle-type of Powder Funnel, then you'd be missing out on the required Expansion step

Also see note on station 1. Separate expander die

 

[GW Staar]

Hmmm, I may send this thread to RCBS. They make a really nice "M" die expander for rifle and include it in their new near perfect RIFLE bullet feeders for the P.Chuckers, but nothing great for pistol. I've put in a request to an engineer I know, to make a similar feeder for pistol.....but so far nothing. I really prefer loading the same way.you do. Just wish the Covid thing would go away so R & D and production would go back to normal. If this is the NEW normal, it sucks.

 

[lordpaxman]

Just a preference, but I like clean brass and hood looking rounds. This also allows me to size and decap in separate steps as well.

I should have chosen my words more carefully - I do understand the two step process, what I can’t grok is why on a progressive press you want to do it. To me, the ROI time isn’t worth it given the rounds I’m producing with a one step are close to factory. This is for pistol, not rifle calibers.
PS - Let us know how you like turning blue?

 

[garandsrus]

His process doesn’t add any time or steps! It does require two passes through the press because he wants to deprime and then stainless steel tumble.

This is no different than the way rifle brass is processed. The first pass through the press deprimes and sizes. After removing the case lube and trimming, the second pass is for loading the prepped brass.

 

[garandsrus]

Even less complicated would be a piece of tubing to sit on top of the shorter rifle powder die that is the correct length to have the powder measure complete the stroke. It’s necessary length would obviously depend on the caliber, that remains unknown.

I guess I don’t understand how this helps, unless you happen to have a rifle die that is the correct size for a 9mm case. The rifle powder dies have a short tapered section on the bottom to center the case mouth and then the case mouth rests on a “ledge” that allows the brass to actuate the powder measure. The opening in the die is smaller than the ledge so that all the powder makes it into the case. The dies are made for a specific case mouth diameter, but it can be a little larger than the case mouth so is less critical than the pistol funnels.

A rifle style powder die for a 35 Rem would work for the OP, but it is probably not common. I generally use a pistol style powder die for rifles when loading cast to expand the case while dropping powder. These aren’t common either so I make my own.

 

[lordpaxman]

His process doesn’t add any time or steps! It does require two passes through the press because he wants to deprime and then stainless steel tumble.

Sure it does. Read your second sentence, again. Some are willing to pay that price, I just haven’t seen where that produces superior product.

 

[koz4guns]

Your looking for something that I don’t think is available at this time so you can use your “M” die in station one.

They do however make a powder funnel that has a profile similar to an “M” die for Dillon, so why not leave station one empty and purchase this for station two, it would get you the same thing.