North and South

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MagnumDweeb

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Yesterday I had a cook out at the house I rent. Me and my roomate are big time Grill kings and fiancee can make salads all day long to her heart's content.

So of course I have my latest acquisition in a run of the mill plane jane hip holster, Ruger Redhawk 4" .44 Magnum, resting comfortably on my hip as I sport a T-shirt and swim trunks. My fiance has my P90 in a shoulder holster. My roomate is sporting his first acquisition (at the age of forty, better late than never) Springfield 1911 he got at a pawnshop at a deal (only 10% above blue book). Of course my two redneck buddies are hanging out and sporting their 1911 and Beretta 92F(I think that's the one he had, I didn't ask and he loves Berettas for a reason only he knows).

So of course my roomate's guests start showing up and the 'ooh and ahhs' start along with all kinds of questions. At first it was kind of pleasant grilling up Baby backs and chicken breasts and getting inquisitively grilled about owning a gun in the state of Florida(few of them are natives) then a 'Holy <profanity deleted>'. It was of course some lady from New York city with all that baggage in tow. I started to ignore her but she wouldn't let it go and her husband was no help. She was comabtive and downright unpleasant and I of course offered "if you don't like it you still have your car keys and are welcome to leave, it'll mean more ribs for me" when she commented that me and my fellow gun owning 2nd amendment patriots should lock our guns up in my safe. She kept giving me dirty looks to which I smiled back at.

Of course my nosey good for nothing of a neighbor who's claim to self-proclaimed fame is he's from New York city himself, decides to walk the acre and half from his porch to ours (his porch is highly elevated and can look on the property and our porch), no one invited him, me and my roomate have had troubles with him to which we have chosen to civilly ignore his existence by so much as repairing the home owner's fence for free with the expense of materials paid by the homeowner. So of course he walked into the lake to walk around the little cement rooted chain link extension we had made (going to have to add another fifteen feet it looks like) to first come onto the property.

To say the least the three Yorkies as i so affectionately label them talked a lot of what we southernners could only understand to be nonsense. Just some things some folks say that don't make no sense to us Americans it seems or so me and my buddies remarked for their enjoyment.

At one point I finally got tired of neighbor's presence, especially after he rudely reached past one of my guests, while on line for the table buffet, to grasp half a rack of ribs meant to be cut from for individual servings, and asked him to leave. Of course mister big and bad York city boy decides to go and "what you going to shoot me if I don't." To end it, the threat of calling the police on him was called (he was never invited on the property, and I had made several prior suggestions his presence was a blight, actually said "you being here is such a diseased and puss leaking blight on such a pleasant day") and he left while making several profane statements.

The long barrage by the Yorkies(like those little dogs that pose no real threat but bark like they are) got me thinking about all the times i've met northerners whom held rather alien ideas about gun ownership, especially those ideas that seem to my consumption almost if not qualitatively pro-Nazi and pro-Stalin Soviet Russia.

Now folks in Rhode Island and New Hampshire as I undertand it have fairly good gun laws allowing ownership with little interference and in the case of New Hampshire, open carry. After them two I can't think of many states with what I would say are Pro-American gun laws.

At my gym that I frequent quite regularly and people know me to be a chatter box about investing, politics, movies, and guns, I've met a lot of folks whom in some cases have labeled themselves refugees of states that have gun laws that don't seem quite American to me. A fellow from Chicago who had left the state over ten years ago commented how it's even difficult to get a gun in the country side and common areas of Illinois. An acquaintance from Maryland who's turned southern as of twenty years ago, comments how when every year he goes back it's just getting worst and worst and how he could remember as a kid (he's in his late fifties) how many folks talked about guns as if they were evil things. A nice college professor I know who left California (he's a secular conservative) lamented that he left the state because of all the 'screwballs' ruining it. When I asked him about gun ownership she exclaimed "it's nearly impossible, it's like the idiots in office want us to get robbed and murdered, and for our women to get raped along the way, those <blank> <blank> are so pro-crime and squalor it's a wonder how part's of the state don't get third world poverty aid funding."

At times I get the feeling that being a 'Son of the South' bestows unto me a different perception of gun ownerhsip, granted since I was young child I was regailed with stories about how my great-grandfathers, grandfathers, and my father used firearms to protect themselves and theirs. A few cousins of mine have used firearms in self-defense having on occassion being forced to use deadly force. Then it probably don't help matters that in my research to combat anti-gun statements and claims, I've discovered countless horror stories where folks whom didn't own firearms were tortured, raped, murdered, robbed, generally some mix of those.

I wasn't "raised" on firearms as some might say, oh sure I got to shoot .22lr rifles at scout camp. Got to shoot my grandpa's .38 at thirteen and his .44 Magnum (Blackhawk 7.5" that I now own after his passing) at fifteen (usually .44 Special given that was his choice round for the gun). I got to shoot my Uncle's variety of 1911s (great guns but I'm a wheelgun man and magnum dweeb at the bone) starting at eighteen. I only started shooting rifles once I was eighteen and it was my Yugo Mauser and fortunately there as an open range with 300 yards about a half-hour from my house.

When going out I figure the checklist goes like this "wallet, cellphone, keys, pepper spray(for non-lethal options when first resort to lethal force might look sketchy), snub-nose .357 magnum for the pocket, and if I'm wearinga long shirt over my jeans like a denim button shirt then it's my P90 for a IWB holster. All of this now seemingly natural to me. When I told an acquaintance of mine at the gym of this whom is a recent first time gun owner(he blames me for it, LOL, he's forty-four with a wife and three kids) and is from Conneticut originally he gave me a strange look like I just stepped off a spaceship. But a nice Scot at my gym whom does the whole Highlands games(or did at least) who is a beast of man, told me he chose to live in Florida over New York between the two jobs he had to choose from when immigrating, because he could "finally own a gun."

I believe gun ownership, or at the very least the uninfringed right to ownership(no one should be forced to own a gun against their will at time as I see it) and civil use, is a key and defining part of the American identity. The government doesn't define me as an American, my values do. The value before mentioned of gun ownership is a linchpin of American identity in my perception and unwaivering opinion, without it the American identity dies and becomes something alien like Fascist, Nazi, Commie(Communist), and the government that destroys it is no longer an 'American' government but something the founding father's did not intend and as such not American. And I have only pledged my loyalty to the United States of America from a young child capable of speech and understanding.

So I wonder, a question to my fellow southernners, and to my Northern contemporaries (by Northern I refer primarily to the northeast), what perspectives do you hold on firearms ownership, are you perspectives alien to your fellow northernners. Now to those in the Midwest (i.e. Montanna) I realize our values are generally not too different and we tend to overlap but what of you?
 
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I'll leave it up to these three:

Benjamin Franklin: Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."

The Dalai Lama: "If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun."

Sigmund Freud: "A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity."
 
I have lived in both Connecticut and Alabama.
I also am not entirely unfamiliar with New York City having had a friend who lived there for a number of years and having had numerous occasions to go into what photojournalist Arthur Fellig refered to as "The Naked City." When you stick eight million people into a few square miles, you will get people like you describe, but there are nice people there too. The friend I mention was a native Connecticutian who was also a firearms owner, though not as avid as I am.
Big cities like NYC, Boston, Hartford, etc., and others are rife with liberalism, but there are conservatives there too. I'm sorry your neighbor is such a jackass, but not all New Yorkers are, and certainly not all New Englanders.
Nor are all Southerners gentlemen. We have our own jackasses too -- I've met some unfortunatly.
As gun ownership, I think in general it tends to break down conservative vs. liberal. Having said that, there are liberals who are pro gun and some of them post here. And I'm sure there are conservatives who are antigun.
See what happens when you try to generalize??;)
 
Having been born in the south and raised in the north, I find that the differences between the two cultures is like the difference between night and day.

In the north, people perceive other people as threats or normally evil. That's why people up here don't like other people having or owning guns. Down south people are good and decent UNLESS you've done something bad and been convicted of a serious crime. Once you're convicted down south, you remain bad forever and NOBODY forgets it. The northern mindset revolves around emotions rather than logic. It also turns on the axis of "could of," "mights" and "maybes" without anything to justify their convictions. Northerners don't understand that you need not fear ANY honest man. As such any honest man can be trusted with anything to include firearms. Northerners see a gun as evil and wrongly attach a human emotion to it. People from New Yawk (York) are among the most wrong of all at doing such ignorance. What you need to do is put up a fence of your own between your house and that ignorant Yankee's property. Also have a lawyer send him a letter warning him to stay completely away from your house, person and off of your property. That way the Yankee will know that you mean real business. Keep a copy of the letter stashed in several places just in case there is trouble and need to be able to prove the letter's existence. It would also be nice for you to file a report with the local law enforcement authorities where you live so that they have on-file in their own records your disdain for the Yankee living next door to you.
 
You might have done a little better at educating the original folks or just throwing them out as being rude and annoying. A simple, "I tell you what, you enjoy the party and if no one gets shot you can decide if what you've been told all your life about guns and the people who carry them is as wrong as what I'd been told about Yankees. Since I eventually grew up to think for myself I've come to realize that the majority of Yankees aren't all thieving Carpet Baggers and perhaps you'll learn a little about guns too."

As to the neighbor, post a no trespassing sign and enforce it.
 
This is essentially the problem with antigunners in general, no?

If they say, "No guns on my property," Then I say, "Fine," and I've got the choice to go unarmed or stay out. (I've got a third choice, but that's not polite.)

If I say, "Firearms are welcome--here's mine--and you are welcome, too," you get, "Well now that I am here you HAVE to put away your guns. And by the way, those ribs are MINE!"

Some people have a problem with limits: what is not theirs, what they have no control over, and what they have no say about.

Do you think that correlates to a problem with politeness? :)
 
If I'm eating your ribs, I'll not disagree with you one bit.

'Course I'm from the Intermountain West/Four Corners which has nothing in common with the North, South, East, Midwest or either Coast. We desiccated Westerners think you guys worry about what other people think/do way too much. Talk too; you guys suuuuure love to talk...;)
 
Can't say too much about carpet baggers in part because I descend from one sort of famous one who hails from Arkansas and the eradicaton of the first evolution of the Ku Klux Klan on my mother's side.

I have grown reticent to refer to all northerners as Yankees, a Yankee is somenone whom I'd say is ignorant much like the folks who we have here in the south we colorfully refer to as white trash. Not all folks who live in trailers are white trash(a good some keep them real nice and are hardworking folk whom don't want the burden of house maintenance and enjoy the cheap cost of the mortgage and homeowner insurance) and such not all folks who hail from the north are Yankees. Know a guy from New York state commons and rural like who is quite similar in opinion and ideal like I. Yankees are folks whom carry their baggage with them thinking the north knows what's best for the rest of the country even if they somehow can't get it right in their own state of origin. Had an incident at 'Steak and Ale' enjoying a dinner with my Parents and Uncle and Aunt, where some Jersey guy mouthed off about how our tap water was bad (scratches head) you don't drink from the faucet unless you have a Brita setup or some such, you drink from the fridge with its filtration system.

Yeah we southernners have our trouble makers surely, an employee of my roomate is from Polk County in here Florida(I'm in Seminole County, right next to Crimelando 'Orlando'), and he is an ignorant one claiming moral superiority and greater intelligence but he's living out of the office and is barely living on feeding himself with five dollars a day (still paying off the loan on a van he destroyed during a drunk driving incident).

In my defense with the Yorkies, at first I attempted to be polite and explained none of us would be passing around our guns like it was show and tell or some such like event. My buddies only had their guns in their hip holsters because they saw I had mine on and went back to their trucks to get theirs. Tried educating them with empirical information (statistics) and treatises by law and college professors, and of course the Federalist and Anti-Federalist Papers. They of course had no interest, calling me unkind names and making foul suppositions about my mental health and character.

And the RIBS!!! When you prep three racks of baby backs each rack prepared in a different fashion and cut the first half of the rack up so people can take single ribs as to share, because we also had BBQ chicken, pulled pork, beef ribs (I was responsible for the chicken and baby backs my roomate had the others) and fixings for roast beef and ham sandwhiches, come on, you don't be a glutton and grab half a rack. LOL

Yeah the trespassing....I should probably deal with that because he can be counted on once every couple of weeks of showing up and being a pain, "No you can't borrow my 4 four wheel drive optional truck to pull your 2 wheel only Dodge Ram out of the muck, that's greatness and superiority you have exclaimed in contrast to my 99' Durnago (hey it only cost me 2 grand and still runs great and have had it seven years)."

Was really trying to get at, and it's my failure for not better articulating my desire, what gunnies from different parts of the nation had in the way of perspectives on gun ownership, my apologies.
 
Every village has its idiots. Part of the reason you had these abrasive Yorkers in your neck of the woods could be that they were more or less run out of NYC for making jackasses of themselves.
Expats can be real bastages. Sometimes they consider the area they move to as filled with barbarians conducting child sacrifices by the light of the full moon, and they are Cortez come to set 'em straight.
 
First I've gotta say that Montana isn't in the midwest unless a person considers that the midwest extends from the Alleghenies to the Continental Divide (which BTW runs through Montana). Calling a Montanan a midwesterner is like calling a Norwegian a Swede or a Scot English.

Uninvited guests are generally welcome in civilized society, but folks from NYC that I've met seemed to think that they were a couple of levels above us commoners. Short of calling the local law and charging your neighbor with (maybe criminal) trespass you might try No Trespassing signs, assuming the jerk can read.

Going to someone else's place and complaining about their guns, especially uninvited, is he height of something, and it ain't good manners.
 
Apologies for the Montana thing. My Crim. Law professor is from Montana (moved to Florida for the Golf and his wife don't like the cold) and referred to Montana as the midwest. Plus the ballsy bit where the state said to the fed that if they didn't like the decision in Heller they'd secede caused me to have a great deal of respect for them, wish Florida would have joined them but there are too many Expats from Massachusets, New York, Maryland, California and so on for such patriotic thinking.
 
FWIW, I have had a house and yard full of people (including a single mom with a bunch of kids) and have been happily yakking away with everybody while blatantly open carrying a revolver.

Nobody else was carrying (to my knowledge, anyway) but nobody even blinked or said a word. I pretty well consider anyone visiting us to be coming under my protection while they are here.

Even though I may be dwelling up here on the snowy 47th parallel, my roots are all in the South (or lower midwest) - Scots, Irish, and Scot-Irish farmers and stockmen.
 
I don't care where you're from, going to someone's party uninvited and then complaining about their OC'd firearms is the mark of a pure jerk, simple as that. That's beyond rude. No one is forcing you to be there, if you're so beyond help that you're afraid of inanimate objects then at least don't push that onto others.

*shrug* at least, that's how I was born and raised, here in the suburbs of Boston.

Having said that, gun culture is practically non-existent here. I'm 29 now and I have never known a single person who owned guns. I never fired one, or seen a privately owned one (outside of police) until I visited some midwestern in-laws. It's bad here in the anti-gun states. No wonder they get to pass every inane brainless gun control law, 99% of the population doesn't have a clue.

Alas.

Dope
 
Ya forgot Vermont, one of the most gun-friendly states.


I've also gotta say that the mentality of the West is similar to that of the South. Having lived in both Texas and Washington, I can say they are both very gun-friendly (except Seattle). Washington, Idaho, Montana, Wyoming, Nevada, New Mexico, Arizona, etc. have good gun laws.

California is our black sheep.
 
Ct resident and native here.

I like guns! And if I were at a bbq, I would be respectful of the host and other guests.

If I wasn't invited, I would not invite myself...
 
I've lived in eastern PA my whole life and I think that our gun laws are tolerable. Our problem is that the area where I live has become, in effect, the 6th borough of NYC. Probably 50% of our population commutes to the city each day, with a majority staying there all week long. Of course they leave their kids here unsupervised all week where they join gangs, deal drugs, commit vandalism, robbery, etc, etc.

I would tend to think that the problem isn't a southern/northern thing, but rather more of an urban vs. rural thing with most of us "country folk" having the intelligence/common sense/thinking ability and the city imports having little to no common sense about anything, specifically guns, at least around here.
 
When in Rome do as the Romans do. You should not insult your host. Please don't judge us Yankees by a few bad apples. I am from Pennsylvania. PA is the exact opposite of New York when it comes to gun control. A simple form to fill out , 2 reference letters, and you have your LTCF in about 45 days. Hell they didn't even check my references. There is no range test and no class room stuff. So don't say evey N.E. state is anti gun.
 
Big Matt I here ya. I live up by Lake Wally. We don't have that many transplants. We do have a lot of summer people though. Really a shame about the Stoudsburg area. I think we need better parents.
 
form to fill out , 2 reference letters, and you have your LTCF in about 45 days
Sounds pretty Anti to me. Just passive-anti. And doesn't PA not allow semi-autos for hunting?

OP:
You have experienced the stereotypical "Yankee". I grew up in SW Florida, so I've seen a few. I also moved away to a more friendly environment. The "Yankees" in Flaaarida don't like it, they want it like where they came from. My answer - "Go Back!"

It's more than a culture thing, it's also about the "Nanny state" these people live in in the bigger cities. What need do they have to protect themselves or even provide for themselves.
Florida is an interesting case in that it was a very UN-populated place just a few decades ago. Alabama had a higher population in the 60's than Florida, and it ain't cuz the breeding season is longer in FL. A huge influx of outside people and cultures have changed the state and the environment. It will never be the same again. (cue the Indian with a tear running down his face (Seminole, of course))
 
Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont, Minnesota, Michigan, Pennsylvania, etc. are all considerably more pro-gun than my southern state of North Carolina. So are most Western and Southwestern states.

Here in NC, thanks to the legacy of Jim Crow, you have to go to the county sheriff's office/jail and get written permission from your (usually white) sheriff in order to buy a handgun. Imagine how intimidating it would be to do that as a person of color in 1955. Which was, of course, the point.

It's also a crime here in NC to carry in a restaurant that has a wine list.

New York, Massachusetts, etc. aren't just different from (most) southern states on the gun issue, they are different from most states, period.

FWIW, my favorite gun shop in the whole USA is Van Raymond's Outfitters in Bangor, Maine.
 
35 rem filling out a form getting your LTCF in 45 days does not sound anti to me. I think its more then a cultural thing too. It sounds more like a hate thing the way you talk about the north.
 
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